Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

In a setting I'm running the vampires have breed, and altered with alchemy, humans to provide a steady food supply.

My question is what would be the modifier "Only for blood loss" be for regeneration?

My first instinct was -80%, but I'm not sure. I'd like to hear what others have to say.

Thanks.

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

No Blood is worth [5]. I believe No Blood (Not Immune to Blood-Borne Toxins) is worth [3]. That implies blood that instantly regenerates might be worth [2] - you're susceptible to both blood-borne toxins and blood chokes and the like, but are immune to bleeding to death. If blood regenerates more slowly than, say, 1 HP per second, you could drop it down to a Perk.

If the character can basically make a living off of bottling his infinite blood and selling it, you could probably work that out as a Job. Having ready access to such might be worth an additional [1].

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

You could also tag in a disadvantage: Must be bled on a regular basis [-x] to represent that the blood bag generates more blood than they can actually hold, and thus needs to have the pressure relieved. I've no idea on the pricing, though.

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

I'd base it on Maintenance if it is dangerous enough to make you sick and kill you.

You basically need a person to safely extract the blood from you, either a professional nurse, or a vampire (preferably not the kind that leave a huge wound...).

If you can (and will) remove excess blood yourself without risking infection etc. it wouldn't be more than a quirk though. Maybe halve the value of maintenance if the character would only attempt 'self-maintenance' so in an emergency and there is a notable risk of it going wrong.

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

I wouldn't go that far, but my mind did jump to No Blood as a comparison. -80% on regeneration should be just fine.

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

Check. No Blood should be the starting place. Instantly regenerating lost blood is functionally equivalent to No Blood, so all you have to do is peg the values of less than instant. I'd make Extreme Regen cost the same as No Blood; VF Regen cost 4 pts (Dude... just spend the extra 1 pt!), so you'd usually recover in seconds; Fast Regen cost 3 pts (recovery time in minutes); Regular Regen cost 2 pts (recovery time in hours); and the Perk level would be equal to Slow Regen, where it would take you some days to recover.

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

Thank you for the input. I think I'll go with the -80% then, as I wanted the speed variable, to denote the degree of tampering.

There are other effects for the characters in the situation that don't directly deal with blood, so it might end up being a minor template, 25Pts or less.

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

Here's another one I hope you can help me with. How many hit points will losing a pint of blood cost?

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

That depends on how much damage is assesssed when the vampire takes a pint of blood and that may depend on things like vampire biology and metaphysics.

In the old days a vamp with The Draining lost 2 HP every day and had to amke that up by stealing 2 hp from donors. The thing is I don't remember official rules about how much blood that took. Just the HP.

Technically you don't need to know how much blood is involved for the Regeneratiion rules. The number of HP involved is enough. An average human with HT 10 needs an average of 4 days (without a doctor's care and possible interventions).

Someone who bought Slow Regen (Blood Only -80%) for 2pts only needs a day.

Your problems come when you try and feed vampires with things like plastic bags full of blood. That's where the biology and/or metapahyscis comes in and theres jsut alot of questions only the GM can answer..

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

Losing 1 pint only feels like a couple of FP lost. On the other hand, an average person has 10 pints and no HT roll will keep them alive without blood, so from that viewpoint getting to -5xHP is 6 HP each. I have no idea if losing 4 pints would realistically trigger a death check.

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

I explored some of that here, and ultimately decided the simplest way to handle it was to decouple blood from HP, tracking it and the effects of blood loss on their own.
EDIT: For BP-pint equivalency, every multiple of full BP corresponds to 5% of the character's total blood volume. For an HP 10 character, BP is 5, so each BP is 1% of their total blood volume. An average person has about 10 pints, so every 10 BP is 1 pint. It's up to you if a character with higher BP actually has more blood, or simply bleeds more slowly; if going with the latter interpretation, you may want to say such characters have more "concentrated" blood, such that 10 BP is equivalent to a pint (for purposes of transfusions, feeding vampires, etc), even if it actually takes up less volume (although for transfusions you may need to water it down a bit).

For a typical person, losing 4 pints is a Class IV hemorrhage, which is fatal without immediate medical assistance. Due to the way blood loss works, you can't really work out a blood-to-HP equivalency. Unless you want to track blood separately (as I ultimately opted to in the linked thread), you're either looking at extreme HP loss for missing only 1 pint of blood (12 HP per pint for a typical person, such that 50% blood loss is instantly fatal) or some sort of ramping-up effect of blood loss (an option would be -1 HP for missing 1 pint, -3 for missing 2 pints, -10 for missing 3, -30 for 4, and -100 for 5).

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

This leads you back to the vampire biology/metaphysics I was speaking of. How much blood does the vampire need? That's highly variable.

At one extreme the vamp isn't actually "feeding" on the blood. He's magically stealing "life force" from a living being and the blood is largely symbolic with no great amount required. However stored blood may not work at all and animal blood might be inferior and artifical substitutes aren't even possible.

At the other extreme the vampire'as signature Disadvantage is Restricted Diet:Blood Only. He uses the normal food and liquid requirements except it all has to be blood (or something close to it by scientific measurements). Stored, animal and artificiial blood should be fine as this is science. However, he's going to need those 4 pints just to get his daily hydration unless he has Reduced Consumption. A GM might well rule that those 4 pints have enough solids to count as the required food as well.

Then of course there are possible requirements somewhere in the middle of these two extremes.

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

Here's a template from my old fantasy game with a similar concept, though I gave higher HP, and Very Rapid Healing without any limitation, to make them blood banks:

Hemodrone
‑7 points
Bred by generations of blood mages to be the ultimate slaves, hemodrones are utterly subservient, easy keepers, strong manual laborers, and hardy walking blood banks. Striking ST +1 (5), Lift ST +2 (6), HP +5 (10), IQ‑1 (‑20), HT+2 (20), Speed ‑½ (‑10), High Pain Threshold (10), Reduced Consumption 2 (Cast Iron Stomach ‑50%; 2), Resistant +3 to Disease (5), Temperature Tolerance 2 (2), Very Rapid Healing (15), Fat (‑3), Short Lifespan (‑10), Slave Mentality (‑40), Unattractive (‑4). They are found mainly in societies dominated by blood mages and vampires, where they are nothing more than valuable property and own none themselves (Social Stigma and Dead Broke, but these would come from a cultural lens instead of a racial template).

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

Why isn't this ST+1, Lifting ST+1 and HP+4? Or even just Lift ST+2 and HP+5. Nobody builds Striking ST into slave races.

As another note Bio-tech wouldn't allow you to breed anything but ST up to +2 with regular humans. You'd have t use gene-altering magic to get your template.

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

They do if they're planning to use them as gladiators and janissaries or similar.

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

MA47 prices "limited, crushing" or "limited, unarmed" as -40% if you can only regenerate HP lost to those types of damages. I figure they're the same because "unarmed" also covers non-crushing attacks via Claws or Sharp Teeth (not sure about Strikers) just as long as it's not a weapon (not sure about Innate Attack either...) while "crushing" covers unarmed crushing and armed crushing (bo staff, etc)

-40% for Crushing is also what we see for Damage Resistance on B46 classed as "Common" which implies you can just borrow the values used for DR to swap over to Regeneration.

Unfortunately there isn't exactly a "DR against blood loss" since that's HP loss not subject to "basic damage" and similar (it's straight to injury) but I guess the question we should ask is: how rare is it to bleed?

Powers classifies "injury" as "very common" requiring at least 1 HP lost to any source. I expect "blood loss" would be at least one step rare (common instead of very common) if not moreso (occasional -60 or rare -80)

Temporarily getting No Blood probably wouldn't cancel out any HP you already lost to bleeding, just prevent further bleeding.

One of the downsides to No Blood is probably that you can't actually provide blood for purposes in which it might be useful, which is why Switchable on No Blood might help to swap that feature back and forth.

For "HP converts to blood" as a resource it really should be tracked as a resource, No Blood seems like it would remove a potential resource the same way "No FP" would. Largely beneficial except where you can't use yourself as fuel for abilities which call upon specific materials.

Sort of how like if a character is classified as a magically animated skeleton they can't make steaks out of their legs to feed their hungry friends like Wolverine or Deadpool or Hulk or Flash might be capable of in an emergency.

That part actually makes me wonder: should "I'm inedible" be assumed to be some kind of zero-point feature that they didn't bother to list in GURPS Magic undead templates, or could that possibly fall under one of the other traits?

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

It is, sorry.

Re: Question about Vampire Victims & Regeneration
 

Hey, I wasn't offended. Just rather puzzled.