About salamanders and unarmed combat
 

Normal weapons do no damage to a fire elemental. Do people interpret that to include unarmed attacks of all kinds? (Seems reasonable to do so, in which case HTH with a fire elemental is deadly.)

What about UC throws? Can you grab and throw a fire elemental or is there nothing to grab? Again, seems reasonable to say you can't throw a salamander, but I'm just checking what other think.

I'd figure that whatever we say about UC throws applies to shield rushes as well. And, indeed, any physical trip, such as a bola, lasso, etc. (unless these items are magical).

Re: About salamanders and unarmed combat
 

I think it depends on how the GM envision the salamander.
If it a mobile column of fire with a bad attitude, it will be immune to throws, rushes, etc.

Punches and kicks are considered normal weapons, instead of magical weapons. So these are a no damage even if the salamander is envisioned as a solid creature with a flame aura or some such.

Magical weapons will hurt it even if gaseous, just as it can hurt other immaterial spirits.

Re: About salamanders and unarmed combat
 

One would think tha throws, shield-rushes, etc. would be considered normal or mundane attacks that would not affect beings only susceptible to magical attacks. But, you have to look at what the PCs have to fight such a creature; if they don't have anything and they aren't used to deciding to run, it could end badly. And, you have to be prepared for wizards to constantly conjure illusions of salamanders to fight mundane foes, since their only recourse will be disbelieving.

Re: About salamanders and unarmed combat
 

Thanks, Rolando and Shostak. That's how I was leaning, too.

The reason I asked, Shostak, is precisely because a typical party won't have any real options against a fire elemental unless they're prepared for one with breakable flasks filled with water or something similar. I was wondering whether unarmed attacks (not explicitly mentioned in the text) were an option. At least some non-magical way to put the bugger on his butt for a chance to escape, say.

The fact that a salamander can initiate HTH and not worry about wounds is a huge advantage.

Re: About salamanders and unarmed combat
 

It is a terrible creature, don't use it lightly.

Players not prepared to fight ghosts, spirits and gaseous or liquid elementals should be prepared to run.

After running they may come back with some buckets of water as weapons and wet bedrolls as armor.

Dying is an option too.

A character may always die heroically by distracting the monster and helping the others escape. Also, blood may hurt or discourage the fire elemental as any other liquid, so self inflicted wounds may be enough to discourage to elemental for a moment, enough to escape.

Allow for some creative playing and problem solving but don't forget that adventuring is deadly dangerous.

Re: About salamanders and unarmed combat
 

Oh, I gave enough hints that the players expect the area to be guarded by a salamander and are gearing up appropriately. It will actually be an easy fight, I reckon.

But they might have missed those hints, in which case they'd have a tough time. The area allows fairly easy retreats, however, and anyway, if I've given you the hints and you didn't draw the right conclusion, that's kind of on you.

Re: About salamanders and unarmed combat
 

I don't see "fire" as being any more susceptible to punches or judo throws than it would be to a mace. I don't think they have a solid physical body that one could tackle into HTH or knock down.

Of course, the description in the book may not match what exists in a specific campaign.

Re: About salamanders and unarmed combat
 

In the 80s, I played a monk in D&D and my recourse for this was gauntlets of ogre power.

If a creature can be affected by magic weapons, I think there should be a set of magic gloves or bracers that allows an unarmed combat artist to attack things that can only be hit with magic weapons, likewise they should be able to shield rush, throw, etc.

Re: About salamanders and unarmed combat
 

Any time the scenario rules say no magical weapons you can be sure that your silver dagger staff is going to save the day.

If things look really tough then cast staff to snake and bite the salamander to death.

Muggles need to defend the salamander to death.

ST 9, DX 12, IQ 11
Pole Weapons Expertise, Shield Expertise, etc.
Very Fine Javelin (1d+2), Small Shield (stops 2 hits)

The DX 13 salamander has a 5.88% of inflicting an average of 1.7 damage and a 9.8% chance of inflicting 3.5 damage on itself. (DX 13 -2 on 5 dice)

Re: About salamanders and unarmed combat
 

this is a bit sideline... but it may have some bearing on TFT magical items as well.

Can a Monk even wear and utilize such a magic item?