Re: GURPS MIDNIGHT Conversion
 

Congrats!
You know, you are right. The more I read the more it seems like they used GURPS Magic as an influence <g>. For instance, Ceremonial Magic (GURPS Magic 3e Page 14) fits Midnight's ritual magic very well.

I think that if we want to replicate the "buy a college" feats of midnight it could work like this:

Spell College 2 points for College 0, 2 points per added level.
This advantage gives access to the spells of a particular magic college. It may be bought up to the spellcasters Magery level but cannot be higher. For all spellcasting rules the level of the Spell College advantage is used in place of Magery for all learning, casting and prerequisites pertaining to spells of that class.

Now, this makes mages much more expensive so I suggest a -30% limitation to Magery itself. So Magery 0 would be 3 points, and Magery 1+ would be 7 points/level.

This will cause mages to specialize a lot.

Alternately we could do away with Magery and have Aspected Magery instead, devoted to each college, but this would allow a specialist mage to really rack up the spells in his one college and unbalance the system. I would not recommend it.

As for Channelers, I would say that anyone with Magery 1 or better would be considered a Channeler.

Re: GURPS MIDNIGHT Conversion
 

Additional ideas:

In Midnight non-channelers seem to have much less spell energy. Since I figure a person with Magery 1+ is considered a Channeller, we should restrict the casting ability of Magery 0 casters. To replicate this I suggest those with Magery 0 have a the cost to cast a spell doubled. Magery 1 or better the cost is normal.

With the Spell College feat (if we use it) the level of the Spell College would determine the cost adjustment.

As well, I suggest a new type of advantage:

Spell Energy 2/level
You have a reserve of energy that may be spent in place of FP to cast spells. You may not have more level in spell energy than your Magery level (magery 0 cannot buy this advantage). Spell energy returns to full after a night's rest.

If we use the "spell college" buying outlined above you cannot spend more spell energy than your Spell College level per casting. For instance, you have Magery 3 and Spell College: Fire at level one. You buy 3 spell energy levels (your max with Magery 3). When you cast a fire spell you can only use one of the three spell energy points to fuel this casting. However, if you have three levels of Spell College: Air you can use up to 3 of your spell energy on a single casting.

Re: GURPS MIDNIGHT Conversion
 

Yeah, I'm actually left with the impression that the designers of Midnight would probably have preferred to use GURPS, or a similar points-based system, rather than class-based D&D/D20. Heroic Paths allow any character of any class to excel at things that are traditionally tied to specific classes in D&D, and the fact that there are far fewer PC-able core classes (6 if you don't count Legate, vs. 11 in core D&D), suggesting that class was more of an obstacle than anything.

That sounds workable ... it basically forces a mage to specifically decide what colleges he wishes to have access to, which is the apparent intent of the D20 rules. Cost-wise, it's a little cheaper to specialize in just one College, but if you take more than one, it start to stack up ... again, this seems right in line with the intent of the D20 version.

Hmm ... perhaps all mages must have Magery 0 -- equivalent to having the Magecraft feat -- and then must buy levelled advantages that act like Talents for each College that they wish to use, for 5 points/level each. This would replace levels of Magery above 0. In order to use the spells from a particular College, you must have at least 1 level in the corresponding talent. Just a thought....

Also, I've always liked the idea that certain other advantages help certain types of magic ... Animal Empathy to Animal spells, Medium to Necromancy spells, etc. Perhaps these could act as a "virtual level" of Magery for determining what spells a mage can learn, but not providing a bonus to skill.

Yeah, Channeler is essentially the "generic spellcaster class." One thing, though ... what about Traditions, i.e. Hermetic, Charismatic, or Spiritual? Is this just a special effect, or should it affect how a character learns and casts spells? If so, how? I don't see basic spells off of Will or Charisma in GURPS, as it would be far too easy to buy up those stats for much cheaper than IQ and create an Uber-Mage.

Here's my thought on this subject ... this is how we've done Magery since the early days of GURPS 3, when we got tired of the Conan the Mage syndrome that resulted from magic being cast from Fatigue/ST. It's somewhat like a variation on Umana, but with some significant differences (and we used it before we knew about Umana).

Spells no longer use FP by default; they use Mana Points. A mage has a Mana Pool equal to IQ x Magery (thus, non-mages and those w/ Magery 0 have no Mana Pool). Mana is replenished by the use of the Meditation advantage; each successful roll (an attempt takes an hour) restores Magery x 1d Mana Points.

Of course, this wouldn't work with my other idea for completely -replacing- Magery 1+, but it could work with yours for Spell College advantages that shadow Magery. Or, if Magery 1+ was available, but the only effect it had was to increase the multiplier for Mana Pool.

I like the idea of a Mage being able to buy bonus energy (basically, Fatigue with the limitation "For Spellcasting Only").

Re: GURPS MIDNIGHT Conversion
 

The more I look over the Heroic Paths, the less I like the idea of them being explicit "advantage packages." They vary far too much in usefulness, especially if you don't carry over all the innate spells or D20-specific traits. For example, Quickened includes "Burst of Speed," which would translate as Altered Time Rate -- a 100-point advantage; while Charismatic basically distills down to Charisma, Talent: Smooth Operator, and maybe Talent: Enthrallment Skills.

My other beef with the Heroic Paths is that they are -basically- just additional classes -- pre-defined sets of abilities that accumulate as a character rises in "level."

My inclination is to discard most of them, and just allow characters to buy the various advantages -- perhaps with a +10% "Unusual Background" cost to the more powerful/exotic ones.

Re: GURPS MIDNIGHT Conversion
 

I am not sure. The heroic paths seem to be a flavor of the world (as well as a way to make the classes different. A Fighter Ironblood is different than a Fighter Nature Friend). Garyb, what is your thought?

As for things like burst of speed, wouldn't Enhanced Move or Increased Speed with the limitation costs FP, kind of cover this?

I am still, at this early stage, leaning to keepin the Heroic Paths but allowing guidlines and examples of advatages they may give, but letting the player (and GM) decide if one the player thinks would fit the path would be allowed, even if it is not listed. This way we don't have to lconvert everything. For example, a Quickened character may be able to buy increased move (with or without a limitation) or enhance move or even Altered Time Rate, if it fits the path concept. I know it is kind of broad, but that's the way guidelines are.

Re: GURPS MIDNIGHT Conversion
 

Yeah, they do add a lot of flavor. Perhaps we just need a formula to calculate a fair Unusual Background cost for each, given that they can vary so greatly in usefulness. Maybe 10% of the total points of all advantages that are made available by a given Path?

Well, Burst of speed allows an extra "attack or move-equivalent action" (i.e. 1 extra maneuver) each round that it is used, so I'd say it was Altered Time Rate, perhaps limited to X times/day or Costs Fatigue.

That works for me ... we can try to work it in such a way as to make them as unobtrusive and optional as possible.

Re: GURPS MIDNIGHT Conversion
 

BTW, there are a few other conversion-related threads that I've started or contributed to because they handled related issues ... if you like, check them out and make any comments that come to mind:

Aura Traits in 4e

D&D Monster Conversions

Re: GURPS MIDNIGHT Conversion
 

Hi,

Apologies for the thread necromancy, but I thought I'd mention that Wil Upchurch (one of the main writers/creators for the Midnight setting) has now secured himself a job at SJGames, and has noted that he'll be pushing for a GURPS Midnight publication. Sorry if it's old news around here, but I thought it might be of interest.
Either way, I'd still be very much interested in seeing a 4e conversion of the setting.

cheers!
Colin

Re: GURPS MIDNIGHT Conversion
 

WOW!

Any source (link?) for this?

Re: GURPS MIDNIGHT Conversion
 

This would be a cool thing. Hopefully this will happen.