Re: Reviewer gives GURPS Space substance 3 out of 5
 

I meant that no consistent 'Planetary System Generation' was used in STrek. Sure, aliens mostly kept their traits (though check out Stardestroyer.net for a list of bugs on Klingons etc.). But they were not made according to logic, but rather according to the author's whim. Not so with GURPS aliens and planets (which is a Good Thing©). So it would be logical to assume that ships would get at least some attention.

Re: Reviewer gives GURPS Space substance 3 out of 5
 

Sorry 'bout that. Where were..oh yes, Space 4e.

My main complaint is that the planet/system/alien generation rules aren't detailed enough, but I do realize that you can only fit so much within a 240 page-count.

However, what could have been put in were references to space highways and stabilized wormholes (i.e. the FTL travel that may actually work).

And...that's about all I can think of, nothing worth declaring crusade about.

Re: Reviewer gives GURPS Space substance 3 out of 5
 

Because, dramatically, heroes often start out brilliant, strong, etc., and have lots and lots of raw potential, but need time to master training and harness said potential. We didn't want to price being very smart or very strong right out of the ballpark for those who wanted that as part of a starting concept. And note that attributes, unlike skills, don't correspond to anything in real life in any event. They're arbitrary composites that exist primarily to satisfy the desire to hammer the fundamental capabilities of any kind of being -- human, alien, fantasy, robot, or otherwise -- into a four-vector. As such, enforcing some sort of "distribution" through a cost curve would mean imposing assumptions about one species of character on all the rest.

Re: Reviewer gives GURPS Space substance 3 out of 5
 

Nope. Let us assume now, since you brought it up, we are talking exclusively about what I want.

In my games, I want characters that are more than a component of their hardware -- in other words, I do not want a game where the character becomes just a generic "pilot" sort of like the Mecha pilots in BATTLETECH or the driver and gunner in CAR WARS.

This means that the character comes first.

Now... as far as space combat -- I want a fully detailed, fully realized, well thought out and comprehensive set of rules to do this. This cannot be done in GURPS Space and be done well -- to my standard for my campaign we are talking about. I want GURPS Vehicles to give me this data; I want GURPS Ultra-Tech to give me this data...

But...

When it comes to how the combat is handled in a Space Game -- I have to admit that in all but a very few games it worked like this:

1. I describe to the players what the current tactical situation is.
2. The players each in turn, give me their plan for how they are going to act this round (a round being about 1-6 minutes of actual combat time)
3. I assess the situational modifiers (+5 to -5 depending on how outmatches each side is compared to the other) then apply individual modifiers based on the plan as expressed by the players (+5 to -5 depending upon how well I think that plan would work in this given situation). If the character has a particularly good or bad piece of hardware (an advanced Space-Fighter, or a Highly Accurate Shipboard weapon) they are using, I may assess an additional +3 to -3 for the equipment.
4. I assign a series of skill rolls (usually 2-4 different rolls, sometimes using the same skill more than once) that the player needs to make for his or her character that illustrates the skills that are primarilly used in the plan that they have described.
5. The players roll their skills in order.
6. Based on what skills were successful and not successfull, I describe the results of the combat for that rounds and the process starts over again

This is essentially the same rules I used for mass combats as well.

Sure. I never said (and never meant to imply) that no campaign would ever need these things. Just that it was not appropriate to put them in GURPS Space, not needed on a general level for Space Campaigns, and should be handled in another book.

Re: Reviewer gives GURPS Space substance 3 out of 5
 

I wonder what 4e Aliens will look like then. :)
Not that I ever had one for 3e.

And to make a counterpoint, there are Space settings where there are no aliens and the only starsystem is Sol (think about anti-FTL hard SF etc.), so one could say they're not necessary either. :)

Of course, I DO want aliens and systems.

Re: Reviewer gives GURPS Space substance 3 out of 5
 

Phrasing it that way, I have to agree with you.

I know they weren't always consistent, but at least the basics were. (Granted, I've never seen most of the last three seasons of DS9, or any but the first season of Voyager, so I don't know if they got more inconsistent later.)

It's true that aliens were made to the author's whim, but, there was an episode of Next Generation that explained WHY so many of the alien species were similar, so some logic was applied eventually.

And, as for the ships, it's my understanding that they will get some attention, namely in Vehicles.

Re: Reviewer gives GURPS Space substance 3 out of 5
 

Putting Vehicle Combat in Basic was somehow considered okay. Why not put two pages that make links between CP costs of Radar, Innate Attack etc. and $cost, mass and volume depending on TL (at least a guideline)? Oh, and I do assume split TLs, i.e. TL10 (Propulsion), TL 11 (Armor) etc.

Re: Reviewer gives GURPS Space substance 3 out of 5
 

I'm done.

I think it was summed up rather well earlier -- we have hit a point where I believe we are all talking past each other and not to each other anymore.

Re: Reviewer gives GURPS Space substance 3 out of 5
 

Then I think it would be better for those of us who want ship design to create some makeshift guide on converting points into pounds and $s and cy's to make ships consistent.

At least it would make the pro-ship-design people talk TO each other instead of PAST the space-oprah ones.

Re: Reviewer gives GURPS Space substance 3 out of 5
 

Or you could wait a couple of weeks for David Pulver's Vehicle Design System to be released....