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-   -   GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School (https://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=136058)

Kromm 07-10-2015 12:15 PM

GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
I came here to teach
And in answering questions
I did also learn
— Some hack
In GURPS, "learning" is often just a euphemism for "spending points on new traits that make my character more powerful." That's fine, but sometimes you want more than that – whether because realism matters or because education is a theme of an adventure or even the whole campaign. In situations like these, Chapter 9 of the GURPS Basic Set might not be enough . . . which is why we've released GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School.

This supplement builds on the existing mechanics for learning, elaborating on the options in the Basic Set and other supplements, and offering entirely new ideas (like treating study as a "job" that pays in hours toward new skills instead of in $). It also views training from the instructor's perspective, explaining how the Teaching skill works in play, extending GURPS Social Engineering to the teacher-student relationship, and addressing practical matters (such as getting paid!). It covers a variety of ancillary concepts, too, from tuition fees to shifting points from skills to attributes to reflect the holistic benefits of a broad education. Yet it isn't all crunch – gamers who want to run campaigns that use these rules will find plenty of advice on how to make that interesting.

Fond of heroes who study somewhere other than at the School of Hard Knocks? Interested in a campaign inspired by high-school themed anime or a certain well-known school of witchcraft and wizardry? Want to make anything from realistic Special Forces training to being Trained by a Master an adventure rather than a background story? GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School is your textbook!


Store Link: http://www.warehouse23.com/products/SJG37-1668

cptbutton 07-10-2015 12:19 PM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
I was hoping you'd licensed the Rodney Dangerfield movie...

Phantasm 07-10-2015 12:41 PM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cptbutton (Post 1917461)
I was hoping you'd licensed the Rodney Dangerfield movie...

Well, that movie's whole premise can be done using this book, I'd say. Still, that particular license would be a niche within a niche within a niche.... that is to say, wouldn't sell to more than a handful of people.

I just have to say... CURSE YOU, BUDGET! :(

Dragondog 07-10-2015 05:38 PM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Reading what's on the W23 page, this seems to be EXACTLY what I need right now! Bought.

Peter Knutsen 07-10-2015 07:34 PM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
At least now all teachers capable of teaching will no longer be equally good at it. That's a huge step forward for GURPS.

NineDaysDead 07-11-2015 04:18 AM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Accelerated Learning looks like it will be a popular advantage for those who use the "Improvement Through Study" rules.

Randyman 07-11-2015 07:47 AM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Haven't seen it yet, sadly. I'd be essentially uninterested in the learning rules, but heavily interested in educational settings for campaigns or educational institutions for "broader" settings. As usual, something for everyone, it appears! (That attention to scope is well appreciated.)

Bruno 07-11-2015 11:14 AM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Randyman (Post 1917689)
Haven't seen it yet, sadly. I'd be essentially uninterested in the learning rules, but heavily interested in educational settings for campaigns or educational institutions for "broader" settings. As usual, something for everyone, it appears! (That attention to scope is well appreciated.)

Out of the four chapters, The first one is more or less rules about learning. The second chapter is about two thirds rules about teaching, one third discussion about "being a teacher". The third chapter is about organizations. The fourth chapter is about campaigns.

Your judgement if that's enough for you.

Randyman 07-11-2015 11:24 AM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruno (Post 1917732)
Out of the four chapters, The first one is more or less rules about learning. The second chapter is about two thirds rules about teaching, one third discussion about "being a teacher". The third chapter is about organizations. The fourth chapter is about campaigns.

Your judgement if that's enough for you.

Definitely. Like I said, good attention to scope; something for many/most, if not everyone. Thanks for the breakdown!

munin 07-11-2015 02:27 PM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
The original Super-Speed enhancement for ATR (p. P42) states it can't be used to hasten learning (it's only for mundane repetitive tasks, which learning is not), while Back to School says it can (p. 20) but only with a similar teacher, I guess?

whswhs 07-11-2015 03:26 PM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by munin (Post 1917787)
The original Super-Speed enhancement for ATR (p. P42) states it can't be used to hasten learning (it's only for mundane repetitive tasks, which learning is not), while Back to School says it can (p. 20) but only with a similar teacher, I guess?

That's right. With that restriction it's relatively hard to abuse and it captures some bits from the comics.

NineDaysDead 07-11-2015 04:45 PM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by page 13
In conjunction with intensive training (p. 5), the extra hours count only as self-study, because you aren't under close supervision.

Why can't the sleepless be "under close supervision"? Why can't one being with Doesn't Sleep train another being with Doesn't Sleep for extra hours per day? Or have a student with Doesn't Sleep have multiple teachers working in shifts?

dataweaver 07-11-2015 06:15 PM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Hmm… anything about Skill Chips (or their equivalent) as “training wheels” for learning?

johndallman 07-11-2015 06:45 PM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dataweaver (Post 1917847)
Hmm… anything about Skill Chips (or their equivalent) as “training wheels” for learning?

Not as such. It describes example TL10 and TL12 methods for technologically assisted learning, and there are plenty of tools for describing other accelerated learning methods. For skill chips, you'd have to decide what their effects ought to be on learning, which would have a lot to do with how they appear to the user.

For example, skill chips where you "just know, naturally", how to use a skill you have plugged in would be harder to lean from than ones that provide someone else's memories of using the skill. And chips that just uploaded skills into your mind would be easy to learn from.

NineDaysDead 07-11-2015 08:43 PM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dataweaver (Post 1917847)
Hmm… anything about Skill Chips (or their equivalent) as “training wheels” for learning?

yes, on page 30.

lachimba 08-08-2015 12:57 AM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Does this contain any guidelines on language acquisition (as opposed to 'normal' skills) and personal training ( as opposed to just working out)?

Thanks in advance

johndallman 08-08-2015 02:31 AM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lachimba (Post 1925515)
Does this contain any guidelines on language acquisition (as opposed to 'normal' skills)

It treats language learning as being like learning skills. It has specific rules for the need for a shared language for many types of teaching, and on learning Language Talent.
Quote:

and personal training ( as opposed to just working out)?
That would be 1:1 tutoring, which gives large bonuses to Teaching skill.

whswhs 08-08-2015 08:51 AM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by johndallman (Post 1925520)
It treats language learning as being like learning skills. It has specific rules for the need for a shared language for many types of teaching, and on learning Language Talent.

There are also slightly expanded rules for learning languages without a teacher, and for learning them via gesture. It's not a huge amount.

RogerBW 10-30-2015 05:13 AM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
(From my blog)

This GURPS supplement deals with teaching, learning, and games based on either or both.

Disclaimer: I received playtest credit in this book and therefore did not pay for it.

GURPS is an unusual RPG in that it includes rules for long-term learning: not just "I have hit lots of monsters, so now I'm better at hitting monsters" but "I have been taking evening classes in Russian for a year in between hitting monsters". As RPGs have evolved, there's been a sense that campaigns may not last very long, so having a character that's fun to play straight away is considered more important than being able to develop a character over time. But there's plenty of gaming potential in learning, and that's what this supplement is about.

It is split into four parts: the first and largest deals with learning, using the study rules in the Basic Set and expanding substantially on them. There are quite a few options here, and it would be a very unusual campaign that used all of them. There's the deterministic counting of hours from the Basic Set, but there's also the option of treating learning as a sort of job: the player makes monthly study rolls (against Will, with modifications) to see how much success the character has had. Learning from points, and from a hybrid of points and study, and simply in return for money (with various high-tech ways of infusing knowledge), are also covered.

There are some notes here on game events that arise from learning (what are the teacher and the class like, how to use classrom scenes, and so on) which are dealt with more in the Campaigns section.

Back to solid game mechanics: "What Can Be Learned" breaks down skills into several categories, which are affected in different ways by the learner's own traits. Things that aren't conventional skills can sometimes be learned too: spells, techniques, languages, and so on, but most interestingly to me disadvantages: sure, Pacificism (Reluctant Killer) can be trained out of you, but education can also bestow negative-point traits, such as Code of Honour or Sense of Duty. Specific advantages, disadvantages and skills finish off the chapter: everything that can affect learning is mentioned, from Single-Minded to Unfit.

The second chapter looks at teaching: when the focus is on intructors rather than students, how do their skills affect the process of learning? There's some consideration of teaching methods (e.g. real-time video links), and more on teaching in the game: heroic learning ("you must all learn basic swordsmanship in the next few days"), and dealing with reluctant learners. The chapter ends with another quick run-through of advantages, disadvantages and skills, this time considering how they affect a teacher's ability.

The third chapter puts the first two together and deals with the bigger picture: how do you find a teacher or school, and how reliable is the relationship? This can determine the attitude of the class or of individuals within it. Academic organisations are statted as in GURPS Boardroom and Curia, with details of facilities and available information. There's more treatment of instructional methods: apprenticeships, direct tutoring, classrooms, virtual environments, drill, and so on, as well as relationships between learners and others (academic communities, rival schools, etc.).

Thr final chapter discusses campaigns with an orientation towards learning: campaigns about students, or about teachers, or about a school as a whole. There's a long list of ideas that can readily be used in school stories, and some considerations of how such campaigns can remain interesting whether bound to the school itself (the "cloister" model) or proceeding outside.

I didn't have any plans to run a school-based campaign, but now I'm thinking about it. That doesn't say much in itself: every book I read causes me to think about running new campaigns. But I think there's potential here: consider a school staffed by retired adventurers (the PCs), who want to help the new generation avoid the mistakes they made, while also keeping them safe from outside threats… or a space-naval academy prequel to the actual game of space-naval operations, as a sort of extended character generation session.

Social Engineering: Back to School is available from Warehouse 23.

whswhs 10-30-2015 09:33 AM

Re: GURPS Social Engineering: Back to School
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RogerBW (Post 1948701)
I didn't have any plans to run a school-based campaign, but now I'm thinking about it. That doesn't say much in itself: every book I read causes me to think about running new campaigns. But I think there's potential here: consider a school staffed by retired adventurers (the PCs), who want to help the new generation avoid the mistakes they made, while also keeping them safe from outside threats… or a space-naval academy prequel to the actual game of space-naval operations, as a sort of extended character generation session.

The former is exactly the premise of PS 238, which is worth a look if you have any interest in the supers genre.


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