Re: New Reality Seeds
 

It's hard to imagine a more ethically one-sided Civil War than IRL, but making the Southerners into human-sacrificing bloodthirsty Satanists might do it.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Can I suggest a Theoi timeline or two in which gods act like, you know, gods? You know, like arrogant egocentric adulterous scumbags? None of this anachronistic kind-hearted far-sighted liberal nonsense?

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Go for it! The more razor tongued and scurrilous the better.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

???

You mean they weren't??

Theoi-11 diverges in 1455 at the First Battle of St Albans, the traditional first battle of the Wars of the Roses. At dawn before the first charge, the forms of Demon Lords Beelzebub and Asmodeus, towering over a hundred feet high, appeared. Asmodeus procalimed himself the patron of the House of York, and Beelzebub announced his patronage of the House of Lancaster. All noble and royal participants of both sides were granted health, superhuman strength, and black poison swords. The non-noble and non-royal participants were split between running away and trying to kill their former lords.

Those who ran spread the news that both sides of the conflict were damned souls, and the common folk and lesser nobles rose up in rebellion. This also caused problems in Scotland, France, and Burgundy, who had supported the two English factions.

A new force, the House of Tudor, arose (thirty years earlier than OTL), and Edmund Tudor became Edmund III of England. In order to avoid demonic entanglements, Edmund proclaimed the Schism of London, founding a seperate Church of England.

The year is 1515, Edmund's grandson Henry VII rules in England (not the same one as in OTL), Europe is in turmoil as the Schism of London has spread, causing so-called "Protestant" national churches to spring up everywhere. (There is no unified Protestant doctrine.) Witch hunts are popular, although there is no evidence (to outtimer eyes) of any actual witches. The Roman Holy See is very political, and a seperate Budapest Holy See is proclaiming crusades against the Protestants and the "Anti-Pope" (but they're less popular).

There are a few noble survivors of the Battle of St Albans, either trying to carve out their own empires or overthrow the Tudors. Most of them are active devil worshippers, but again there is no evidence of any supernatural forces.

Incidentally the battlefield at St Albans is a Very High Mana location, and in fact the only magically-active location on this Earth.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

I dunno. If you need somebody to act like an egocentric adulterous scumbag in order to provide a change point, human leaders are capable of that. You really only [need] divine intervention for the alternates that require kind-hearted far-sighted leadership to produce.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Theoi-12 diverges in 410AD when Heracles and Romulus appear and drive the Visigoths off. The appearance of the son of Zeus and the deified founder of Rome has led to a revival of Faith in the Pagan gods and violence from and against Christians. Much of the violence from and against the Christians comes from Christian bishops denouncing the pagan gods as devils deluding the people. The Visigoths and similar groups are at present fearful of both being attacked by supernatural beings and being caught up in religious riots.

Whether or not this will be good for the Roman Empire's longevity is yet to be determined.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

I take it Theoi-12 was discovered not long after the PoD? (An interesting alternative is that it was an historical echo discovered before the PoD, and someone from Infinity witnessed the change.)

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

As written, the first. However, your suggestion is more fun. Having events unfold in real time could be exciting.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Gordon-Rogers-2 seems to diverge after WWI. Science and technology seem to speed up after 1918. Slowly at first, TL7 is achieved in 1937. The USA and the UK both start WWII with jet fighters, jet bombers don't show up until 1944. Weirdly high historical inertia keeps WWII mainly similar but with a slightly more favorable outcome for the western allies.

The space race stars earlier and TL8^ is reached in 1960. Twenty years later, in 1980, TL9^ was reached. The faster technological development seems to have allowed the USSR to delay hitting the limits of command growth until 1975. The development of cheap fusion in the 1960s reduced the importance of oil and fossil fuels.

In many ways the local year, 1988, is a Raygun Gothic cold war spy setting. There have been moon bases since the 1960s and Mars settlements since 1975.

Note: Mars in this parallel is semihabitable with the ruins of ancient civilizations. No living Martians have been encountered and they seem to have practiced cremation or other means of destroying corpses. Similarly, they seem to have rejected depictions of their appearance. The buildings and artifacts suggest a largely humanlike form would have been the most likely.

Interactions with Martian artifacts have led to the discovery of repeatable ESP and other Psi phenomena. This has led to serious competition in Martian archeology.

Society in this parallel is lively and prosperous. As neither the Bretton Woods system has collapsed nor the Oil Shocks happened before oil was being replaced, the economy and social conditions more closely resemble the 1960s than post 1975 Homeline.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Could a Hollywood studio or the like sue Infinity for copyright infringement if Infinity named a timeline 'Waterworld' or the like?


To be fair, perhaps Waterworld didn't come out on Homeline. It was released in real life in 1995, which would be right around when Van Zandt went public with parachronics. Even if it did come out, it could have been quickly forgotten amid the discovery of other worlds.

Or maybe it became more celebrated, for being an 'alternate world' (though it actually is supposed to be set in the future), a rare Hollywood depiction of such at a time when alternate worlds would be all the rage.


I wonder how parachronics would effect Homeline pop culture. Would the bright timeline not become obsessed with post-apocalypses like our world? Or would Homeliners be more interested, as such worlds could now be found, a few even visited?

Certainly, Homeliners would be less interested in space, aliens, etc. Maybe also less interest in old comic book heroes.

And someone would have adapted The Man In the High Castle a lot sooner.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

I'd point out that historical epics are mentions as popular imports. Dealing with worlds where the past is playing out now clearly leads to interest in the wonders of the past.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Yeah, historical movies would definitely be popular, from off-world epics to intimate stories shot on Homeline. Indeed, the Homeline-made ones might be more popular, as the past often isn't as cinematic as audiences want (the famed Time Tours King Arthur debacle).

Homeline movies & programs might use footage of battles, castles, and other background combined with manufactured personal footage with Hollywood stars.

Unfortunately, the most cinematic timelines are also the ones Infinity most restricts visits to, from Azoth-7 to Yrth. But could use depopulated Ariane for 1915 setting, and covered-up filming in Johnson's Rome or Gernsback.

What would the Infinity policy be on importing past/alternate Hollywood stars? Echoes would likely be off-limits, but what about living, underappreciated actors & directors from depressed close parallels like Campbell and Lenin-1? To say nothing of close non-parachronic parallels (like our real world)...

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Try this idea...

People kept on looking for Terra Australis even after they'd found Australia. In this Q5 world, Terra Australis is real. It was discovered by Tasman in 1642. At least to the extent that Europeans knowledge of Terra Australis. Native Australians had been there for millennia. The island of Tasmania in Homeline is in the same place as the northernmost peninsula of Terra Australis in this world. Antartica is part of Terra Australis.

The local year is 1706. Large colonies have set up in Terra Australis by France, Sweden, England, and Holland. The land of Terra Australis is cold, but there are large temperate areas and when you have European crops, farm animals. and farming techniques, large amounts of good farmland. There are large deposits of valuable minerals. The forests are vast and filled with fine hardwoods. There are wide navigatable rivers that make these valuables accessible.

As per the normal behavior of early modern European society, the division of the continent isn't going peacefully. Unlike North America, there aren't large areas dominated by one power. This leads to sudden shifts of alliances both to exploit opportunity and to fend off attacks.

Into this volatile mix comes the Cabal. For unknown reasons, the Cabal seems to find the mountain range that divides the temperate and subarctic lands from the ice sheets. Homeline wants to know what the Cabal is up to. Finding out what the Cabal will require negotiating a complex and dangerous political situation in a vast frontier.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

To add useful details to my last post, the real world continent of Australia exists in our world and has the same climate and geography. Terra Australis is a much newer continent whose soils are rich. The coastal waters of Terra Australis, like Europe or North America, are rich in fish and for the same reasons.

The discovery of good tasting cod-like fish brought fishermen who quickly established fish drying camps. This led first to the discovery of seals with fine fur and that there were other fur-bearing animals on the continent. The fishers brought the hunters and the hunters brought the farmers. The experience of North America aided in a swift start.

As in contemporary (1706) North America there are islands of settlement with few roads for overland connection. It is possible to have two large towns only about fifty miles apart and no land connections between them.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

I'm wondering why they colonise Terra Australis earlier than Australia was colonised in OTL.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

I thought I explained that in the second post. First the fishing resources and then the furs.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Though a lot of the reason North American fisheries could be profitable is they are close to Europe. You are looking at something like 4 months shipping from Tasmania, vs. 1 month from New England.

Keep in mind that Terra Australis will be pretty cold. Tasmania is relatively far south, and unlike stuff that far north on the Atlantic side there's no warm current. The warmest climate it is going get is something like Oregon or Hokkaido. Most of it will resemble Canada, which isn't uninhabitable, but there's a reason it didn't draw huge waves of immigration until fairly late an all the population still clusters in a narrow band. "Large amounts of good farmland" seems unlikely - though I suppose they don't need to be all that enormous to qualify as "large" by *European* standards.

Sure European empires may eventually claim it (though historically it isn't until the mid-19th century or so that they started to feel they needed to claim *everything*) but it's hard to see them fighting over it very hard. Notice how these empires didn't exactly rush to fight over Australia (which has areas of good farmland on at least the same scale) and didn't hesitate to sell, or swap for single spice islands, large stretches of North America, especially if they were less accessible than the east coast.

Edit: I also think that if it is all that attractive, you may need some handwaving for why it isn't more heavily settled before hand. Asian colonization efforts stop around the Wallis line more because there wasn't anything obviously worthwhile beyond that (Northern Australia is a tough coast to approach and doesn't seem to offer much), than for any technological reasons. If even a trickle of valuable stuff were coming up from south of Australia in ancient times, somebody might have gone looking. This may be especially true if you want to decide it disrupts the West Wind Drift enough to add some of those warm currents to improve the climate, since they'll also carry boats along.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

The altered geography might include sea structure changes which create an equivalent warming current

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

I guess I'm looking for the step before that to be filled in, where any number of people decide to go there in the first place. In OTL, no one followed up Tasman's discovery of Tasmania.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Tasmania was small and certainly lacked the fish resources. Terra Australis is much larger, warm for its latitude near the coasts, and it has vast bays and rivers. It was an obvious prize.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Yes. And I should have said that.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Though it is the kind of thing that is hard to just drop in and leave history anything close to intact.

For example I think if you admit dropping a continent south of Tasmania changes the currents, the big change you have to deal with is disrupting the circulation around Antarctica. You end up diverting it with a cold current running up the west coast of Terra Australis, along western Australia and into the Indian Ocean. Temperatures and humidity in India go down and history is already starting to look different even before you start worrying about the south Asian monsoon collapsing or whether the climate of East Africa changes enough to disrupt the evolution of hominids.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

There is a lot of precident for apparently obvious consequences being ignored. My money is on the new continent being a reality quaked-in change.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

I might add a gold rush to Terra Australis to justify a high population of settlers.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Solid idea. And large amounts of gold wouldn't be necessary. Historically if a native wore some gold nuggets then you start gold fever. And there would be native Australians that would have crossed over to Terra Australis. Remember, its Northernmost peninsula is where Tasmania is, just across the Tasman straits.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

That actually could argue *against* a native Australian crossing

Admittedly the data is pretty poor, but both the genetic and linguistic evidence suggests Tasmanian populations were very different from native Australians, maybe even entirely unrelated. Humans arrived in Tasmania at a time it was connected to southern Australia during the Ice Age, so its logical to assume they walked in from there, but even if that were true it is much less clear aboriginal population of either Australia or Tasmania in the last millennia were related to the people present in either region during the Ice Age.

Either way it's not at all certain anybody ever actually crossed the Tasman straits between the sea levels rising and the arrival of Europeans. It might seem somebody must have at some point, but there's no solid evidence.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Well, there were people in Tasmania, so if one of these natives wore a piece of gold and a 17th-century European Fisherman saw it, BOOM! brutal gold rush.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

On this Q4 world, the Pontic-Caspian Steppe is submerged. As is a large area of the central Asian steppes. It's possible to sail from the deserts of Western China to the mouth of the Danube. The shores of this arm of the sea are more temperate and lush than the equivalent areas of Homeline simply because of climatic effects of water.

The Local year is 326BCE. Alexander is building a Navy to sail to the silk lands and conquer them. Homeline wants PC agents to travel with the fleet both to study events and to discover what links the Macedonian Courts have with the Cabal.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Not unlike my idea for a sea extending from the Arctic ocean into central Eurasia.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

An interesting and complex political setting could be created by having Henry II follow up on his idea of having a Patriarch of France, just as Antioch, Alexandria, and Constantinople had Patriarchs. The idea was to insulate France from a Papal court dominated by the Habsburgs. If Henry of France would have done it then most European monarchs, or at least those isolated from direct Habsburg domination, would likely follow suit. Which would tend to reduce the Papacy to a minor Habsburg official.

This would annoy and displease Centrum. A strong Papacy would aid in creating a strong Habsburg universal monarchy and suppress the Protestants that lead to cultural and political instability. Homeline sees different issues. Europe's religious wars could get revved way up and with a weak Papacy, long term peace in religious matters could be impossible. The Cabal sees early modern Europe as one of its most important time periods. A collapse of the Papacy and the rise of national churches would likely lead to a period of austerity that would wipe out Renaissance Occultism.

The problem with all of this is that these three groups can't work together nor would they tolerate each other's preferred next steps.

Basically, this is a mixture of diplomacy and swashbuckling in a tight space.

Conspiracy
 

Conspiracy, 2000

(an Infinite Worlds write-up for GURPS Conspiracy X)

Current Affairs: China begins to challenge American supremacy post-Cold War, as Europe slowly unifies.
Divergence Point: 1990s; a non-existent Paul Van Zandt does not discover parachronics.
Major Civilizations: Western (empire with rivals), Chinese (empire), Orthodox (empire), Indic (empire).
Great Powers: United States of America (representative democracy, CR3), European Union (feudal league of democracies, CR3), People’s Republic of China (dictatorship, CR5), Russian Federation (dictatorship, CR4), India (representative democracy, CR3).
Worldline Data:
TL: 7 (though advanced TL seems secretly present)
Quantum: 3 Mana Level: High
Infinite Class: Z2 Centrum Zone: Inaccessible

At first glance, this is one of the many close parallels without Paul Van Zandt or parachronics. It is the year 2000: George W. Bush and Al Gore are running to succeed Bill Clinton; Boris Yeltsin of Russia resigned, with Vladimir Putin ascending; the European Union is launching the euro; Y2K passed without a hitch.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Just Because You’re Paranoid Doesn’t Mean They’re Not Out To Get You

Yet this world gives every parachronic traveler the creeps. The mana level is high, psionics works, but there are no known magicians or psychics - and both feel different. The American military-industrial complex is larger than it ever was on Homeline, and there are also many more reports of aliens, monsters, etc. over the past fifty years. Strange signals abound, indecipherable even to Infinity. Government observation and even intervention, for “national security,” is more pronounced, and confusing.

“It’s like The X-Files turned into a worldline,” one early I-Scout remarked. Indeed, the initial name was “X”, before Infinity nixed it (too ominous). Still, “Conspiracy” is a restricted timeline, with only high level I-Cops allowed to visit. Word is that even ISWAT treads lightly - the division that dare not say its name is certainly involved.

It’s not just the general paranoia. It is a high mana close parallel, without wizards, and the mana feels different. “Instead of the air we breathe, mana here is the water we drink,” said one Paralabs researcher, “Or perhaps the blood in our veins.” Magic seems to draw not from the natural world, but people, more akin to psionics, which also exists on this world, but is more variable.

Then there’s all the mysterious signals bouncing around. Early I-Scouts detected multiple encrypted frequencies, but even with Infinity’s advanced science, no one has broken them. There are hints of other tech far ahead on this world, from impossibly stealthily aircraft doing impossible maneuvers, to signs of energy weapons and even nanotech.

Officially, the history of the world is the same (until no Van Zandt), but there are a lot of alien abductions, monster sightings, and such that never happened in Homeline history. And even those that did are different - the official Roswell story is basically the same as on Homeline, but details are different, and looks a lot more like a cover-up. The strangeness all seems more prevalent in the United States and the last half-century, but there are also unique foreign myths and inexplicable archeological finds.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Outtime Operations

Infinity’s initial I-Cop foray was outside of Phoenix (“Base X”), to monitor two military installations that are too large and hard to observe, in New Mexico and Nevada. However, in only a matter of weeks the agents detected that they were being observed, in all sorts of ways, from magic & psionics to TL8+ spy equipment, nanotech, even ‘men in black’ that didn’t show up in telepathic sweeps. The I-Cops fled in their conveyor, burning everything behind them.

Since then, Infinity has two smaller operations, outside the United States. One on the outskirts of Calgary (“Mulder”) monitors news feeds and other public information, including a massive amount of fringe conspiracy theory (everything from nutty chat rooms to a well-funded journal on cryptozoology). Another, in the desert of northern Mexico (“Scully”), monitors the twin American bases, and other secretive actors (from corporations to cults) - it is believed that ISWAT operates out of here. More recently, a third operation (“Skinner”) was opened in the Cotswolds of England, to research the timeline’s strange mana and psionics.

Infinity is also worried about what is going to happen to the national security apparatus if there’s a successful Al-Qaeda attack on America next year, as was averted on Homeline, but occurred on so many non-parachronic close parallels. National security measures are already quietly heightened on this world; who knows what a Department of Homeland Security could get away with here.

Thankfully, Conspiracy is on Quantum Three and inaccessible to Centrum - but that’s the same timeline as lots of other strange & dangerous worlds, from Reich-5 and Shikaku-Mon to Merlin-1 and Azoth-7. Indeed, even with hints of weird, a parallel this close should be nearer Homeline. Reality Abzu, a close 2013 parallel with lots of ancient cuneiform inscriptions and catchy pop songs, is on Quantum Five (see GURPS Horror: The Madness Dossier). But there are those in Infinity who think any non-parachronic close parallel that diverges without Van Zandt is hiding something.

Also, this world would seem tailor-made for The Cabal, its high mana making its advanced wealth ripe for plucking, but as far as Infinity can tell, no Cabal mage wants to go to. Intelligence gleamed from a low-level Cabal follower indicated that The Cabal knows Conspiracy exists, but there’s some prohibition on going there. The only other high mana worlds Infinity has seen that about are those with active gods…

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

I was rereading my old copy of GURPS Conspiracy X, and made a GURPS Infinite Worlds write-up for the world, as if it had been discovered by Infinity.

I based it initially off the Infinite Worlds write-up in GURPS Horror: The Madness Dossier, which had Infinity finding a non-parachronic close 2013 parallel with a few weird things, but Infinity is unaware of the deeper, horrific mystery. The I-Cops have a better idea that something is off on 'Conspiracy' (no points for clever world name...), but don't know the terrifying depths.

There's no specific date to Conspiracy X, so I guessed 2000. That precedes such things as the 2000 election, not to mention 9/11 and Department of Homeland Security, something not in Conspiracy X. Also digital photography, also not in the world book

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

I happened onto an episode of Lidsville. This episode to be exact. The actress playing both the witch and the genie is Billie Hays an authentic Broadway star, as was Charles Nelson Reilly who plays the magician. Watching the whole thing (childhood nostalgia) I suddenly had a thought that made Lidsville and Living Island and Tranquility Forest into gaming fodder.

My idea centers on the relationships between Mark and Hoodoo as well as Jimmy and Witchiepoo. I think both Hoodoo and Witchiepoo started out as kids like Mark and Jimmy. Both boys were lured into crossing into what I see as part of Faerieland. Sure, Mark was fascinated by the magic show and Jimmy willingly got into a boat labeled "Magic Boat." But how much work does it take to lure kids to see wonders? I think both Lidsville "the land within the magic hat" and Living Island lured replacement rulers. Both Hoodoo and Witchiepoo are childish bullies with short tempers and limited minds (unlike the talents that played them). I suspect they're used up. New rulers, shall we say fresh blood? were needed. Given the stage magician that enthralled Mark was played by the same actor as Hoodoo, the old rulers may be subconsciously cooperating.

I assume Hoodoo and Witchiepoo, once defeated would become part of the magical lands they once ruled. First as henchmen and later as other sorts of natives.

Basically, this adventure could start with curious and/or alienated kids being lured into Faerieland and then being confronted with foes who are the tyrants of the new land they've fallen into.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Canonically, there aren’t really any “Infinity magicians,” outside of ISWAT and some weird research outfits...

As I recall, the usual line is that the Cabal avoids high-mana timelines, because that condition negates their killer advantage — being able to employ Decanic modifiers to negate the penalties for low mana. And high mana tends to mean uppity local wizards, who are just inconvenient.

If I was running this timeline, I’d have one of the first Infinity teams arrested by a pack of Men in Black and held in a government cell, just long enough to get very twitchy about their fate — and then have them rescued, by a Cabal strike team. The Cabal offer the rescue as an earnest of goodwill and a chance to negotiate. “Whatever’s going on here, we both need to know about it. We understand magic, you have the ability to work without it. We may need both here. Share intel?”

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

How does Infinity determine the mana level on worlds? There is some Infinity research into magic (as opposed to none by Centrum).

I guess not a full-fledged "magician" (though his Infinity colleagues may call him or her that), but a "magic researcher" - basically whoever it is that determines the mana level on a world for Infinity.

The thing about Conspiracy is that there appears to be no local wizards that would compete with the Cabal. And there are TL 7 riches, plus potentially mana-rich items that the Cabal would want.

Also, does Infinity know that the Cabal avoids high-mana worlds? On the face of it, that's counter-intuitive, especially if Infinity doesn't know that much about Cabal's ability to do magic on low-mana worlds.

In GURPS Britannica-6, it is noted that Infinity over-expects Centrum involvement on the Anglophone world, but under-expects Cabal. So whatever Cabal really does, Infinity might still suspect the simple logic that more mana = more Cabal.

The idea behind Cabal avoiding Conspiracy is basically just to make the world seem more ominous - "What do they know that we don't?..."

I don't think that the Cabal is organized enough to initiate any alliance. There may be an individual Cabal wizard, or group of wizards, who would like to approach Infinity - but other Cabal wizards would say that is heresy, even violently oppose it.

I thought that the differences between magic on Conspiracy and Cabal magic, plus super-science/psychic aliens, would be enough to ward the Cabal off. If they don't like operating in a world with high-mana local wizards, they definitely wouldn't want to work in a world with weird-mana local super-aliens.



I want this world to be a much more slow creep for I-Cops - at first, everything seems fine, but slowly things start adding up, rather than a first contact with Men In Black.

And I'd really hope that Infinity's first contact would be with Aegis, as opposed to Black Book, Saurian MIB, Atlantean nano-tech, Grey abductions, etc.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

This strikes me as a very smart way to play the setting as well as a way to bring Homeline and the Cabal into regular contact. And regular contact is the best way to use the full weirdness of the Cabal.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Yes, by Paralabs, and specifically by Sheldrake Section, with help from academic consultants like Professor Rena Williams. I tend to assume that if Infinity files include a mana level rating for each world, it's always accompanied by a question mark, and if it isn't just blank, will have been determined by someone from Sheldrake (provisionally) or ISWAT, a debriefed Cabalist, or a wild guess based on the fact that some local fireballed an I-Cop.

I imagine that there's been some careful intelligence analysis and fairly aggressive "debriefing" of prisoners. Infinity would have a general idea, though they may be hazy on the detailed explanation.

Well yes and no. It's pretty clear that saying "the Cabal has done X" actually always means "one lodge of the Cabal has done X, possibly with the tacit approval of one or two other lodges, and despite the grumbling of other lodges, probably while keeping things secret from any lodge they know would object..."

I always thought that Infinity-Cabal relations always involved a lot of cautious arms-length alliances of convenience, combined with occasional knives in the dark. There's a bit of chapter-heading fiction in Thaumatology that reflects how I imagine this.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Which reminds me of Oscar Wilde saying "Real friends stab you in the front." The Cabal and Homeline would have a messy troubled relationship, but it would be a relationship. In some ways, it would be like a bad marriage that each party still saw as far better than divorce. You couldn't really have that much of a dialogue with Centrum, Reich-5, or the Swagmen, but Homeline and the Cabal, alien as they would be to each other, could talk, argue, etc...

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Wallenstein-3

One of the most important figures in Central European history, Wallenstein was both loved and loathed by people who called him ice hearted and cruel. Without Wallenstein, the Habsburgs would have had to wait for months or years to field armies and their armies would have been vastly less effective. Wallenstein revolutionized logistics and came up with entirely new ways to handle the financing of armies. Thus his troops were among the first modern troops that could always count on regular food and pay.

In both Wallenstein-1 and Wallenstein-4 Wallenstein avoids the assassins sent by the Emperor. In Wallenstein-1 he reconciles with the Emperor, in Wallenstein-4 he replaces him. In Wallenstein-2 Wallenstein has the Emperor in his clutches and rules the Holy Roman Empire in Ferdinand's name.

Wallenstein-3 is different, Wallenstein died during his early skirmishes with the Turks. The Thirty Years War is beginning, and in this world, the sides are starting evenly matched. The Cabal delighted with the alchemical wonders of Prague under the rule of Rudolf II and seeing Frederick of Palatinate as the best successor, back the Bohemian Revolt. Meanwhile, Centrum wants the Habsburgs to enforce uniformity on all of Germany. Homeline wants to keep as many people from getting butchered as possible, oh and popcorn to eat while watching Centrum and the Cabal fight.

Island 2: 1631
 

Island 2

The local year is 1636, and Europe has been turned upside down by the displacement of a whole town from the year 2000 to the year 1631. Grantville's residents, thankfully, believe that they were displaced in time rather than crosstime, but it's still worrying. When they become more advanced, they'll still have concrete proof that they were moved through space and/or time, and may get to investigating said occurrence.

Worse, Infinity has just found the timeline that Grantville came from, and the US government has spent the past 5 years analyzing everything that came from 1631 Germany in minute detail.

The origin point of Grantville might be a really good timeline to drop Infinity explorers--just another close parallel, until the find about about Grantville.

All credit to Eric Flint for creating the 1632 universe...either end could be interesting.

(Island 1 is the timeline that Nantucket appeared from the 20th century into the bronze age. A jumper tried to go to that timeline, using a piece of Nantucket granite, and returned with a tale of horror.)

All Island timelines are strictly off limits.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

If they are in a world with normal GURPS magic and mana a little rune engraved disc glowing shows mana is present. Would be a trivial item to create so cheap enough to have one in each conveyer. Add in a RPM style charm that does similar, etc.

There is still the risk of places with unusual mana/magic and divine magic might be harder to spot if it depends on the local gods who you don't yet know about but it warns you of the common cases.

Re: Island 2: 1631
 

Have you read the other time displacements in the Assiti Shards universe? Your notes on the source universe echo Time Spike, so I'll assume yes. :)

I haven't read the Alexandria Inheritance yet, and I'm way behind on the 1632-verse. Someday. Maybe.

Buried in author's notes someplace are ramblings on other shards.

Would Island-3 be the timeline where Nantucket disappeared *from?* (I.e., the Emberverse or Dies the Fire series.)

I'll *BET* they are!

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

I've updated the description to say, "Paralabs researcher."

Yes, even on normal worlds, any determination of mana level by Infinity would be shaky. With Conspiracy, it's not just the level that's weird, but how it all works/feels.

Maybe Infinity has heard from Cabal prisoners that the Cabal prefers low-mana over high-mana worlds - but does Infinity believe that? Or does Infinity think that it is a ruse by the Cabal?

Even if Infinity has heard that the Cabal prefers low-mana worlds, I-Cops are not going to stop looking for the Cabal on high-mana worlds.

And with Conspiracy, the same prisoners could specify that there's a specific ban/warning on going to Conspiracy, but the prisoners don't know why. Just to generally increase the paranoia about the world.

Even if the Cabal and Infinity work together at some point on Conspiracy, I would think it would be down the road, not initially. Appearing so early and out of the blue with such a forward, game-changing alliance seems too quick & easy.

A Cabal-Infinity alliance could be the end result of a campaign, where I-Cops run into mysterious actors who are on their side, or at least are 'enemy-of-my-enemy'. Only later, after discovering the initial nature of the enemies on Conspiracy (aliens, Black Book, etc.), does the Cabal approach Infinity. Or perhaps Infinity approaches the Cabal.

This could also play out with Aegis - Infinity initially doesn't know who they are, only slowly learns that they share common enemies, ending with an alliance.

Though with Aegis, Infinity would still have to keep The Secret - an advantage to any alliance with Cabal is that Infinity doesn't have to keep The Secret from them (and Cabal has the same feelings about not letting The Secret out).

Maybe there are certain I-Cops who have worked with certain Cabal members. But it always runs the risk of not just being used or betrayed, but of being co-opted.

Indeed, one of the themes in GURPS Conspiracy X is about Aegis' human enemy, the Black Book, who work with the aliens, initially to help protect humanity, but have been horribly compromised & corrupted by now (in Aegis eyes, anyway).

There are I-Cops who work with Cabal, but those I-Cops have been slowly agreeing to things no I-Cop should agree to (hurting, even killing, locals, for instance), all in the name of 'the greater good.' The alliance gradually becomes a Faustian bargain, an almost literal 'Deal with the Devil', and the Infinity agent's road to Hell is paved with good intentions.

Islands oops
 

I had intended to have the jumper go to the timeline Nantucket left from--dies the fire. That would be a hell parallel.

Any Islands timelines would be terrifying--how terrifying depending on which quantum they're on. Even more terrifying if ISOT events happened between quanta...

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Krypton-11

This Q6 world was a fairly normal close parallel to Homeline. It had low manna and it seems that there were ghosts and possibly faeries. There seems to be some evidence that Atlantis was real. However, none of this was enough to make this world a Myth Parallel, in spite of there being actual wizards forming an acknowledged profession (such Wizards were too few to have much practical effect, but they were acknowledged as real).

This changed in 1931 when there was a series of reality quakes, the locals knew nothing about these but the Sheldrake Section of Paralabs has found evidence of the quakes. A large number of hidden/Lost Lands showed up in the isolated low-population corners of the world. At the same time, about ten percent of the world became Normal Manna, and 1% became High Manna, these areas are widely dispersed and tended to reflect local myth/folklore.

As these lost "worlds" began to be discovered and connected with the wider world their secrets and skills began to diffuse out as well.

Strange beings from an Antartic City contacted Washington in 1937 and explained that their telepathic scans of Hitler and Stalin appalled them. They were willing to teach American intelligence officers Telepathy and ESP. They also offered technological assistance. The fact they later had to ally with Stalin was distasteful, but Hitler was the priority. The physicians the Antartic Beings trained extended FDRs lifespan so that he could pursue his Second Bill of Rights after the war.

Meanwhile, ancient masters from Shambhala aided Chiang Kai-shek aid at key points allowing him to eliminate Mao's communists as a real force in Chinese politics.

Hitler and Stalin had secret allies as well. Hitler still ended up putting a bullet into his brain. Stalin, on the other hand, got aid from Agartha. They had looked at Hitler, he was closer to their hearts, but Stalin was the deadlier of the two, so they choose him.

The local year is 1950, Truman is in his first term as president. The tech level is TL7+1 in most of the world. Stalin's Russia might be ahead of that. The USA, the USSR, the UK, and France have Moonbases. China has a Space Program too, and with the War Lords gone and freed from colonialism off their backs, they look likely to make it work.

Mars seems to have changed since the Reality Quakes, although some scientists say that previous analysis of Mars was faulty. Mystics claim to have contacted the same Martian spirits that Swedenborg contacted. Others say more sinister things await. But Werrnher von Braum is still working on an expedition to the fourth planet.

Magic knowledge and talent has boomed and will soon affect the Effective Tech Level. Spies already use mystic power as much as possible, this world's George Smiley would be a mage.

From the Reality Quake on individuals of extraordinary ability have been showing up. There is even a man in blue long johns flying around.

The Cabal is interested in this world's mystic and psionic secrets, as is Homeline. Centrum is simply freaked out. All this weirdness has the real chance of becoming as dangerous as Caliph.

Noting that Stalin is still in control of Eastern Europe except for Western Czechoslovakia (certain mages in Prague drove the Red Army out of Bohemia and Moravia), Eastern Czechoslovakia is getting ready to proclaim itself Slovakia, even if he lost China. Centrum has decided to use Stalin and the USSR to gain influence on this world. They seem ignorant of how often those that tried to use Stalin got used.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

The attempt on Franz Fedinan's life failed, delaying WWI by two years. In that interval, a scientific conference occurred that otherwise wouldn't, and new standards for verification of published papers was established. Simply put, a clever system for rewarding scientists for publishing verifiable papers and performing peer review was established; this system also ensured that false or unverifiable papers would not be rewarded.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Problems include (a) there is no evidence this is a serious concern in 1914
(b) there is no unified class of "scientists", every science has its own professional bodies, and its own sometimes slightly different traditions, so there is no body that could plausibly meet and even offer suggestions that would hold across "science"
(c) scientific conferences or organizations don't have much in the way of *resources* with which to reward people for anything
and
(d) the peer review system already works pretty well. The social concerns people have with "bad science" these days have little to do with what goes into the actual respected journals, it's all about what gets into the more popular media, and states are not going to surrender their control of the press and/or give up their traditions of press freedom because some scientific conference somewhere says they should be making the rules not the governments.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Man, you're really not going to like my idea where Franz Ferdinand got eaten by a dragon.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Actually I tend to be more tolerant of settings like that. Fantasy has license to be fantastic, it's the things that might appear to pass as realistic alternates that I want to see more of a nod to plausibility. Add a decade or two of lead in super-science and hey, a conference that might serve as a prototype for a Gernsback style World Science Council can fit right in.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Aubade-1

The Aubade worlds are near parallels with minor occult/mystic qualities that don't seem to change much. These are worlds with low mana but wizards aren't dominating things or very important. The existence of Ghosts or Faeries or Dragons or Unicorns or whatever is a proven fact, but most folks don't care.

Aubade-1 may be looking to change its status.

The local year is 1875, Spiritualism is booming. Ghosts have been an excepted fact for centuries now regular communication between the living and the dead is being established as a regular normal event. At the same time, the people and forces that led to the late Victorian Occult boom (still in the future) are still in place. More importantly, anthropology, archeology, and improved linguistic and literary studies are all bringing new insight into the occult sciences.

All this makes this Q5 world a bonanza to Homeline, and chance to be in on the ground floor of an occult revolution. The Cabal hates this, they want to keep mysticism as a monopoly, and they really hate Homeline, a major competitor, becoming magically competent. They must find a way to put a spanner in the works.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Roma-12

The Goddess Carmenta, although she had a Flamen, was of little importance in most parallels, but in one world, this goddess, associated with technological advancement was more important. At least to Augustus who built a temple to her and founded and richly funded a Library (which like the Library of Alexandria did research). Unique in the ancient world, the Carmetaria was interested in practical research.

The local year is 190AD. Paper, silkworms, mulberry bushes, the spinning wheel, and the box-bellows, have all been introduced to Rome by the Carmetaria. The servants of the Carmetaria search the world for useful skills, technologies, and plants, to bring back to Rome.

The PCs could be the researchers searching the world for useful stuff and trade secrets. They could also be Homeline researchers studying a transforming Roman Empire.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Sophia-2

In this world, George I's heir dies in a riding accident leaving his (George I) daughter Sophia the heir to the English, Scots, and Irish thrones, uniting Prussia and the British Isles, at least potentially. As the death takes place in 1704 (the middle of the War of Spanish Succession which is being fought to keep any one power from becoming too strong) and threatens the alliance against France.

The Local year is 1720, the war with France shows no sign of ending. Will Britain need to repudiate Sophia's claim to the British and Irish thrones? Will Prussia tolerate that? If France and Spain unite will it make any difference?

Centrum wants the Anglo-Prussian state, a blend of 18th century Britain and Prussia would be their ideal. Homeline wants to prevent both the Franco-Spanish and Anglo-Prussian unifications. The Cabal for indecipherable reasons wants a Stuart restoration. It seems to be linked to the Stuart family's Breton origins and the forest of Broceliande.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

The year is 1917 on a close parallel that was once thought to be an historical echo. WWI has yet to begin, though there have been a number of flashpoints that could have caused it, starting with a failed but rather visible attempt on the life of Franz Ferdinand in 1914. Infinity has sent a team of researchers (and guards) to investigate - an investigation that is immediately derailed when the cause approaches them: A group of native psychics were brought together by a member of the Cabal who visited this world in 1905, asking them to help stop a 'malevolent force' he sensed moving on their world. He trained them (and groups on other continents, some of which they have contact with) for a few years, before mysteriously vanishing in 1911.

The psychics have been predicting and defusing the various flashpoints before they could spark a general European war, as well as trying to move the nations of Europe in a more peaceful direction. The problem is that the flashpoints keep coming, as if someone is working against their efforts... and as best they can tell, that someone is from 'outside time' (from a different worldline). Once they knew that the group from Infinity had nothing to do with it, the psychics decided to approach them for help, though with a warning that there's no point in trying to erase their memories, as they both have no intention of blowing the Secret ('Who exactly do you think would believe us?'), and are sufficiently spread out that there's no chance of Infinity getting all of them. They just want to prevent the huge numbers of deaths that they can see coming.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

A villain would have all the cards in this game. The European state-system kept avoiding world war for decades through diplomatic skill and talent. In the WWI era, you had a lack of talent at the top and the system drove talent out of the ministries keeping new talent from coming in. You'd need to build cadres of talented diplomats in the Foreign Ministries of the major powers.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

If someone is trying to make things worse, delaying the war could do just that. If the bad guys introduce things like poison gas, the war will be much more destructive,

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

They had poison gas, worse was possible. From at least the 1890s they had the idea of "germ warfare" in fiction and the popular press. Jack London wrote stories about the colonial powers wiping out non-western cultures through biowarfare.

Even the crude biowarfare techniques available at TL6 could create vast amounts of horror and death.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Taft-8

The scattered tribes of survivors and surviving records suggest that both France and Germany in the first decade of the 20th century had truly amazing geniuses in the field of biology. Which makes it hard to figure which side weaponized smallpox and released a vaccine resistant stain in several different areas along the Western front in 1916.

Europe collapsed quickly, the Near East, Africa, and South Asia were in chaos by 1917. East Asia and the Americas struggled through 1918. 1919 saw the collapse of most surviving governments worldwide. Australia and New Zealand were partial exceptions. Although the new pox decimated these nations too.

Many "survivors" of the pox suffered brain damage and entered something like a hypnogoic sleep. It isn't that close, but it is similar. The victim ( referred to as Pox Walkers) normally can't communicate and seems to be living through a nightmare. These pox victims often remain contagious and wander around fairly randomly. Some of these "Pox Walkers" can flip from passive to terrifyingly violent without warning. Pox Walkers can sometimes seem totally normal, this makes them even more dangerous.

The local year is 1960. Australia and New Zealand are testing new vaccines that might end the plague. Problems with this project include the often bizarrely twisted communities of survivors who've survived this long through paranoia and violence, Pox Walkers that are wild cards, and the many local variants of The Boss.

The local Tech Level is between 3 and 2 in most of the world. Australia and New Zealand are at a very late TL6 with some TL6+1 and TL7 elements.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Roma-13

Seems to have had out time influence, Homeline even thinks they know who the world jumper was. His influence is interesting though. He introduced Double Entry Bookkeeping and the Hindu-Arabic numerals, and seems to have left a fairly solid treatise on algebra.

The World-Jumper seems to have shown up around 79AD and lived a long life as a math teacher and accountant.

The local year is 181AD. Marcus Aurelius is still working on budget reforms so that he can finance military campaigns in the East. Commodus is becoming visibly unstable. Rome seems to be more prosperous and has sounder finances. The recent emperors, including Aurelius, are busy working on promoting agriculture and ending land speculation. There seem to be signs of the application of technology to practical concerns in ways not typical of Roman culture. Where normally they would have thrown more slaves at any job (although they organized their slaves very well) now they are introducing labor-saving devices to make the labor of slaves and servants more efficient.

Homeline finds this Q7 world interesting, Centrum finds it lovely and ripe for the picking, but why are their so many Cabalists swarming around? Yes, unlike most Q7 worlds this world has low manna everywhere Homeline has checked, most Q7 worlds have much less local magic. But what is the Cabal after?

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

The Cabaal is interested in a low mana outpost on Q7, perhaps as a jumping off point for exploring Q6's very few magical worldlines. The Cabal also might be looking to play one of Centrum's games, and quantum shift the timeline.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Fun thoughts.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

A research trip to an echo going through the year 1526 announces the trip was a waste, the English Sweats in that world was a genetically engineered ethnocentric plague meant to kill English people. However, a researcher who had previously visited an echo going through the year 1551 checked the samples she'd picked up in her work eighteen years earlier. It's proved to be the same disease, the "New Acquaintance" in both worlds a genetically engineered ethno-specific plague, either a weapon of genocide botched or a sloppy brutal assassination tool.

As more data comes in, even from Homeline, the English Sweats, known in several outbreaks for killing only English people, is shown to be an assassin's tool that's been hopping around the IW for more than five hundred years. Why? Who was killed that made such a huge difference? If it was an attack to eliminate the English, will they try again? And what do they hope to gain?

PCs will be escorting medical researchers to every major outbreak of the Sweating Sickness and digging into any and all records to look for origins of the attack. This will be a world hopping campaign focused on racking down a powerful amoral mass murderer.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

A Q4 parallel going through the late 1940s is visited by an alien spacecraft. A group of elderly seeming humanlike aliens are aboard the craft. They choose to visit mainly the western democracies with India, Japan, Iran, and Indonesia in as well (in this world Iran never lost Mosaddegh or got the Shah back, and the Dutch left Indonesia peacefully and aided them in becoming a democracy). Later on, it was found these visits weren't diplomatic, they were biomedical research.

The Aliens were dying, they had at most two hundred fifty solar years left to the youngest and most less than seventy-five years. They seeded large sections of the Earth with a proteus virus. This meant that large numbers of children would be born genetically aliens. They would have enhanced intellect, lifespans, and health, as well as mental powers. In reparation for the disruption caused the aliens would teach the humans, transformed or otherwise their technologies and skills.

Basically, TL12^ aliens with Psi powers in the fifties. Take the Midwich Cukoos and make the situation, less scary but more complicated, much more complicated. Unlike the children in the novel, the new aliens are the children of their parents, just changed. The children don't have a group mind (they have to be taught Psi powers, but they do show spontaneous flashes of wild talents). The changed children are no more sinister than any other kids, and no less sinister either.

The Russians and other non-democratic powers are jealous of the opportunities the Western Democracies have gained and fearful of being left behind. Espionage is going through the roof, as are kidnappings of altered children and their parents.

The local year is 1960, the Tech Level is 7 in most of the world and a mix of 7+1 and 8 in the West. There are multiple moonbases and the Aliens dwell in an undersea complex near Maui.

Homeline is watching this world carefully. The Cabal, which does well on this low manna world, watches greedily, hungrily.

Dreadnought-3 first half
 

I sketched this out for a naval history board, and thought it could be useful for someone.

The "Dreadnought" designation is used for timelines where the most noticeable difference is the development of the big gun ships

It's on Quantum 3, and probably very low to no mana. The chronobahn hasn't bee located yet, at least by Infinity, but the idea of Reich-5 finding it is disturbing.
The local year is 1914, and there's a good chance that all hell is about to break loose

The American Battleship Revolution

In the waning years of the 19th century, the United States navy was becoming a force to be reckoned with on the world stage—modern battleships were entering service as the nation flexed its industrial muscles. The US Navy was no threat to Britain or Germany at the time—the Royal Navy was huge, and Germany had no concerns in the Western Hemisphere—although some saw that that could change.
A brief dispute with Britain, although never threatening war, drove home the point to the US Navy that Britain ruled the seas. More to the point, Congress was also made aware of this fact.
Some serious planning was done—the US Navy would always be a second class fleet, unless something drastic was done. Naturally, it would have to be relatively inexpensive, given the tight fisted nature of the US Congress. Congress basically told the Naval Planners, “Do Something about the Royal Navy’s firepower—and Oh, Yes, please don’t spend more money than we’re already giving you…”
(This seems like a typical politician’s attitude)
In 1899, the US Navy started work on the now infamous “12 inch Mark 7” as a part of its ongoing program to improve its weaponry. What it didn’t tell anyone, even Congress, was that the 12” Mark 7 was actually a 14”/45—a weapon far larger and more powerful than any afloat at the time. Had anyone picked up on it, it (just barely) came under the mandate to “do something” about the Royal Navy’s firepower.
In 1902, 3 battleships of 16000 tons and two armored cruisers of 13000 tons were originally authorized. (One more battleship than historical due to the recent incident with Britain)
At the last minute, a caveat was slipped into the act, allowing the General Board to build “3 battleships of 16,000 tons and 2 armored cruisers of 13000 tons. Should the General Board determine that this is not the most effective use of the allocated displacement, the board may authorize the construction of more or fewer ships, provided that the displacement shall not exceed 75000 tons.” It was intended to allow the USN to build one smaller cruiser, and use the extra tonnage to make the second cruiser into a battleship. This was slipped into the appropriations bill quietly, in exchange for a “yes” vote on a few pork-barrel projects.

What they got was something else entirely. The new Connecticut class battleships were built in relative secrecy, although there were rumors that they represented something new. The intended displacement was not, of course, released.
When Connecticut, Louisiana, and Vermont were revealed to the world—8 14” guns in superfiring twin turrets, heavy armor, and a massive (for the time) displacement, they made every existing warship obsolete—and within six months, there would be three more in service, from the 1903 authorization. (The fact that they displaced 950 tons more than authorized was quietly hushed up—they were so successful that no one wanted to criticize them) The next generation was already well along, four ships armed with 10 of the new guns.
Unfortunately for the Royal Navy, this display occurred a week after HMS Dreadnought had made the scene, the upstart Americans making her obsolete mere days after she was seen as the greatest warship on earth—and worse, presenting the world with THREE of the new ships, and three more almost finished. What the general public didn’t see was the advantage Dreadnought had due to her turbines—but even so, Connecticut was a shock to the Royal Navy—the three Connecticut class ships were thought to be equal in fighting power to 8 to 16 conventional battleships.

At the end of 1907, the US had 5 dreadnoughts (the name stuck due to Dreadnought’s dramatic presentation—and more dramatic overshadowing) with 1 fitting out, and two more nearing completion. Two more were in the early stages of construction—these two introducing the triple turret.
In 1907, only two battleships were authorized.
Note that this is approximately the same amount of tonnage as historical through 1907’s authorizations, but in fewer, larger ships.

Britain naturally stepped up its production of Dreadnoughts, although the next four were armed with 12” guns, that being what could be built rapidly. (The last two had a gun layout similar to the historical Neptune, therefore being able to fire all 10 guns on either broadside.)
Armstrong hastily developed a 14” gun, simply scaling up the existing 12” weapon. Larger was desired, but the 14” weapon was the largest that could be rapidly (as these things go) developed.
The need for an emergency change caught Britain’s shipbuilding industry be surprise, and slowed down production of the next generation. Battlecruiser production, however, continued unchecked, as the 12” gun was far superior to the 10” gun on the American ships.
The 15” battleships came faster than historical, as the British attempted to jump ahead of the competition. Britain had 5 of them in August 1914, with 8 more on the ways.

Germany built the four Nassau’s as historical—the Kaiser was insistent that the High Seas Fleet have some of the new warships, and keeping some pace with Britain was necessary.
The Helgolands were significantly delayed, as even Wilhelm II realized that a bigger gun was needed. In the end, Germany paid a huge fortune to the USA for enough 14” guns and turrets for four ships. The USA accepted this offer for several reasons:
1. The US was already working on 16” guns, so the 14” guns would not be outclassed by America’s newest ships.
2. There was still some desire to keep Britain busy worrying about Germany
3. There was lots of money being offered—money the USN used to get an extra New Mexico class ship.
4. Since Argentina, Brazil, Chile, and the Ottoman Empire all had at least one new ship on order in American yards, it would seem almost hostile to turn away a paying customer.

These were the only German ships with imported weapons. The next class had 14” guns built in Germany, but with ammunition compatible with the American weapons.
The Kaisers had 14” guns, as did the Konig’s. (There were only 4 in each class, not 5 Kaisers as historical.)
One 15” Dreadnought was complete in August 1914.

The United States was content with a more modest pace of building after its sudden spurt—Congress was once again tight with funds, and the new ships were expensive. However, after the success of the 1899 program, the Vermont, and California class ships, Congress had become willing to set spending limits rather than displacement limits, and then OK the plans the experts put forth. The biggest winner was the Bureau of Ordnance, which could, in the eyes of Congress, do no wrong, and merely had to ask for money to get it—usually even more than it asked for.

Responding to intelligence reports of British “super-cruisers,” the USS Manila Bay was laid down in 1906, intended to overwhelm any likely cruiser. She was so expensive—and large—that she replaced two conventional armored cruisers in the building program. One of her design criteria was an extremely long range—something that didn’t show up in Jane’s.
She and her sister, USS Bunker Hill, were largely considered a design fiasco due to their light armament compared to contemporary foreign ships, but proved to be a sound design, with plenty of room for modernization. Ironically, this “design fiasco” proved to be the longest serving battlecruiser in any navy, finally decommissioning to category B reserve in 1970, and, in 1982, moving to her permanent berth at Battleship Cove alongside the USS Massachusetts—3/4 of a century serving her nation.
She was one of the first American capital ships to use oil firing—a collision with the USS Montana put her in the dockyard for an extended time. Since she was out of service anyway, the navy decided to test the oil firing on a ship that was large, fast, but not able to stand up to her potential rivals in other navies, and therefore not a catastrophic loss if the conversion should result in decreased performance.
NOTE: Bunker Hill is roomy enough to shoehorn the equipment into to make it a conveyor--barely.
Britain and Germany build numerous battlecruisers—overall similar to in OTL, but with a trend to bigger guns faster.

Dreadnought-3 second half
 

Post was too long--part 2

Battleship 1911 was huge by the standards of the time, mounting 8 of the new 16” guns—and also finally bringing the USA into the turbine age with their battleships. The American battle line was still notoriously slow, (most ships could make 20 knots, but foreign navies were doing 22 or more) and the American fleet was relatively small in numbers. However, no one doubted the overall firepower advantage the Americans had. As one Royal Navy analyst put it, while campaigning for more ships, “The American battleline is slow. All this means is that when it wants to go somewhere, it will take a while—but no fleet on Earth can stop it.”
Another one said, “Our fleet can go anywhere it wants—unless the Americans are going there.”

The superior ability of the USN to engage in long range battles, with 30 (later 40 to 45) degree elevation for their main armament and heavy deck armor was not revealed to the world until it proved a nasty surprise for the ships on the receiving end.

Where do we go from here? The USA starts with a huge edge in dreadnoughts, both numbers and power—and with a bureau of ordnance that is in very good favor with Congress. As war clouds gather in Europe, the US is feeling secure behind a mighty fleet that can keep even the Royal Navy from its shores. Relations with Germany are good, as are relations with the future Entente powers.

(Removing Wilson could make things even wilder--perhaps Reich-5 has seen him as a threat to the Reich.)

USS Connecticut, Commissioned 1906

Displacement: 23000 tons
Dimensions: 590 x 86 x 27’
Machinery: Vertical triple expansion, 18 knots, Range of 6000 nautical miles at 10 knots
Armor: Main belt 11”, upper belt 3”, Turret face 12”, Conning Tower 12”, deck 5” over vitals
Armament: 8 14”/45’s in four twin turrets, 20 3” guns, 2 21” submerged torpedo tubes

Design note: Unlike contemporary battleships, Connecticut and her successors—and the Manila Bay and hers, had a main armament elevation of 30 degrees. The class was gradually upgraded over the years, the survivors being scrapped, converted to other uses, or sold in the 1930’s.

USS Manila Bay, Commissioned 1909

Displacement: 22000 tons normal
Dimensions: 620 x 86 x 27
Machinery: Turbines, 4 shafts, 25 knots, 12,000 nautical mile range at 10 knots (18000 miles after 1913 conversion to oil
Armor: Main belt 6.5”, upper belt 2”, Turret face 10”, Conning Tower 12”, deck 5” over vitals
Armament: 6 10” guns in three twin turrets, 8 x 4”, 18 x 3”, 4 x 21” submerged torpedo tubes.
Manila Bay was constantly upgraded—the first American capital ship to receive oil firing, flying off platforms for aeroplanes, fire control radar. She was almost a legend in the American Navy for the skill of her crew, her always being in the heat of the action, and always having the latest equipment—and always coming home.

Battleship Strengths, August 1914

Great Britain (32 + 12)

5 12” gun dreadnoughts
12 14” gun dreadnoughts
5+8 15” gun dreadnoughts
0+2 18” dreadnoughts

6 12” gun battlecruisers
3 14” battlecruisers
1+2 15” battlecruiser

Germany (20 + 11)
4 11” dreadnoughts
12 14” dreadnoughts
1+5 15” dreadnought

3 11” battlecruisers
1+2 14” battlecruiser
0+4 15” battlecruisers

USA (17 + 10)

12 14” dreadnoughts
(4 with All or Nothing armor)
2 +6 16” dreadnoughts
0 +2 18” dreadnoughts

2 10” battlecruiser
2+1 14” battlecruisers
0+1 16” battlecruiser

Re: Dreadnought-3 second half
 

They'll also need a revolution in fire-control equipment to be able to hit anything at the ranges they can reach. This is quite possible, given the right sort of ingenuity, but early Dreadnoughts weren't actually capable of using the full ranges of their guns productively.

Re: Dreadnought-3 second half
 

Very true, and quite possible to develop. The USN might even have stumbled onto the Telemobilescope and had someone playing with that, but even with a good optical fire control system, long range fire control can be developed.

With the Bureau of Ordnance in favor, I'd expect them to work on better fire control.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

YankeeGamer, if you want the USA effective in WWI, Wilson needs to serve his first two years. As much as people despise Wilson, his reforms of how the Treasury worked were vital to US finances. Maybe you could change his 1912 running mate and put a better man in the office.

Further, the Nazis tended to see Wilson as a pious fool. They were bitter against Clemenceau they hated him, and likewise Churchill and DeGaulle. Roosevelt, who died early in Reich-5 history, they might see as a joke, until he shows his claws.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

I was not actually writing this with a particular goal in mind. It popped into my mind a long time ago as a chance to play with big battleships, with no particular war in mind. Losing Wilson was just a whim at the end.

This timeline could be an interesting one with the prewar build-up, and both sides vying for the support of the USA. (Not to get teh United States into the war, but to get the USA as a friendly neutral.)

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Play up the different nations' pull on the USA. Britain had the high cards in this game. About one-quarter of the population was proudly of ENGLISH descent (even if they were Scots or Welsh they said English), and this population contained most of America's elites. Germany, however, had more cards. Something like one-quarter of the population was of German descent and most of these, even those that lived in America for generations, spoke German and kept up with German culture. A little less than one-quarter of the population of the USA was of Irish descent. They weren't especially friendly toward Germany, but they wanted NO Alliance with England EVER! Period English people commented on Irish Influence anytime they found the USA uncooperative. Even Conan Doyle has Sherlock Holmes comment on "bitter" Irish Americans. Playing American ethnic politics to keep the USA on side could be messy and nasty.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Since the original point of departure was an unspecified dispute with the British, and Britain reacts badly to anyone else having a navy as powerful as theirs, there's a higher baseline tension between Britain and the USA as of the start of the Great War. Not high enough to bring the USA in, but enough to be interesting.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Verne-5

Like most of the Verne worlds, Verne-5 diverged with Cugnot's steam wagon being more successful. In this particular world, a young officer of good family with a knack for engineering and gadgets spotted that the weight was poorly distributed in the wagon, and tactfully explained the observation to Cugnot. In most worlds, the young officer's family sent him into the church but the officer's elder brother died in a duel in Italy so the young noble became an officer and Cugnot's patron for a while.

Cugnot comes out with an improved stream wagon that dramatically outperformed the first. Watt was told of the second steam wagon by an eyewitness who was a capable engineer himself. This led to Watt abandoning all objection to experimenting with steam powered vehicles. Watt convinced the Navy that steam powered rams and tugs could do highly useful work. When French spies reported Watt's activities to the French government. This led to the French navy being told to develop steam powered ships.

The local year is 1860, France and England are in a Naval Arms race. The civil war brewing in the USA is intriguing. Both Britain and France want the USA broken up both to discredit democracy and to remove a rival that prevents imperial expansion into the Americas. However, for one of the powers to seize the opportunities of the US civil war, the other would have to stay neutral and passive while the other grabbed a huge advantage. Centrum sees that the British Empire is in a trap here, and the naval arms race must lead to imperial collapse for Britain when newer powers like the USA, Germany, and Russia rise.

Centrum agents are working with local German nationalists and local Italian nationalists to start the Franco-Prussian war early. Homeline, seeing that the possibility of both early world wars and a shattered USA with no democratic power to pick up the pieces (Centrum has made sure this Britain's democratic tendencies have been squashed), is moving to counter Centrum.

This Q6 world has an odd tech level. In daily life, the Tech level is TL5, though closer to the technology of 1875 than 1860. In manufacturing, military and medical matters, this world seems to be TL5+1 (which adds loads grimdark to the oncoming ACW). In naval matters, this world is TL5+2. France and the USA both have been investing in submarines (but submarines have long been a reaction to British naval supremacy).

This world has Low Manna and the Cabal is active. Although the Cabal is actively working on building up the 19th century Occult revival they seem to have more of their agents in the USA. The Spiritualism craze was deepened by the Civil War but is there something more? It's beginning to look like Verne-5's ACW is going to be an extra hellish mix of the ACW and the Western Front in WWI. Could the expanded horrors lead to some monstrous opportunity for the Cabal?

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Verne-8


Like most of the Verne worlds Verne-8 diverges with Cugnot's steam wagon. In this world, two Princes of the Blood witnessed the event. Like everything else in their lives, it started an endless series of arguments.

The King and his ministers, who liked winding the brothers up and watching them go, joined in the arguments. At some point or other someone brought up the advantages of running wagons on rails. Over time this led to a consensus that steam-powered railroads would work and bring powerful economic and military advantages to France. This led to Cugnot being called to court and being given the mandate and funding to design steam wagons for rail transport.

The local year is 1810, Napoleon's France is bound together by his steam roads. Sure, the average speed is twenty-five miles per hour, but this is vastly better than anyone else can do. The French Imperial Gandy Dancers have built railroads to Seville, Naples, Vienna, Venice, Berlin, Skagen, Budapest, and Warsaw. The railroad to Istanbul is being built. The Empire runs on steel!

This is a Napoleonic setting with Le Emperor having a network of railroads to move his armies across Europe at unprecedented speeds. Areas of Europe closed to Homeline's Napoleon are open to Verne-8 Napoleon because of his rails.

This world is TL5, but some areas of engineering are about thirty years ahead of Homeline's 1810. Centrum, not pleased with a French speaking world government. But it will certainly accept this empire. Meanwhile, Homeline's France is over the moon about another Napoleonic world. At the same time, Homeline's Russia dislikes the idea that a rail line to St. Petersburg is being started and another is being planned for Lutsk and then Kiev. In this world, Russia might not be saved by General Winter.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

This Q6 world diverges in the late 1500s when a Japanese Admiral isn't killed in the aborted attempt to conquer Korea. Instead, he's an early supporter of Tokugawa Ieyasu.

The Admiral loved collecting maps and understood their implications. He noticed how near the west coast of America, or at least Alaska, really was. He got permission to set up a few fishing bases on the coasts of America.

The fishing base that took was set up on what in Homeline is Whidbey Island in Puget Sound. Founded in 1632, long after the Admiral's death, it was neglected by the central government of Japan. However, a Buddhist monastery, prompted by an Abbot's dreams, relocated to the area in 1635 and provided governance and direction for the colony.

The local year is 1809. Louis and Clarke have come and gone. The locals know that Japan barely acknowledges they exist. Russia from the North, Spain from the South, Britain from the Sea, and the USA from the East all claim the Oregon Country and them with it. What are they going to do?

The colony is prosperous and stable. Most people are farmers and craftspeople. The monasteries rule the area fairly loosely. Villages run their internal affairs. There have been fights with the Native Americans but trade predominates. The oldest and largest monastery temples are centers of culture and education. Scholars exiled from Japan have brought their skills and libraries, and even the Puppet Theater. But they lack either the central government or military resources to avoid absorption into someone's territory. What do they do?

Another quick and dirty one: Yamato Banzai!
 

Yamato was discovered by unmanned drones, and one of the first things they saw was a Yamato-class battleship, yet radio traffic indicated that it was the late 1950's, the cold war between the USA and USSR was in full swing, and overall, it seemed similar to homeline.

Looking deeper, it wasn't as similar as it seemed.

Late May, 1944:

British night bombers drone over Germany, dropping their deadly payloads on a Luftwaffe base. Goering and several other VIPS are touring the base, when an accident that will change the course of the war occurs. A stick of bombs smashes open a storage facility of Mustard Gas, and numerous people are gassed—including Goering. However, the fact that this was a storage depot for gas was lost in the outrage and confusion—the German High Command placed the blame squarely on the British—a deliberate attempt to assassinate Goering with gas.

Mid June—Germany retaliates. Using Mustard Gas, Germany launches a massive attack on the Allied Beachhead. In some places, the attack is devastating—in others, the Allied forces hold using their own gas masks. But…those units get attacked with the nerve gasses. In a matter of days, Germany has advanced, smashing the beachhead—and capturing huge amounts of equipment. The war in the west has just got uglier.

In the Pacific…fewer resources after D-Day disaster, but still, America is advancing. Russia is screaming, as Germany is dropping gas on them, too, and driving the Red Army back. (The Red Army’s retreat will only be temporary—but even so, it hurts the Soviets badly.)

Some Japanese see an opportunity to get out with some slight saving of face, and Togo and company are deposed. With much back alley discussion, surrender is finally negotiated, mere days before the Japanese are to send Yamato to Okinawa. (The prospect of gas coming to the Pacific played a part in the decision, as the American public was clamoring for the gassing of Japan now that the Axis had supposedly started it. The moderates were able to recruit some support among fence sitters when reports of American gas shipments to the Pacific started cropping up in Tokyo.)

Terms: Nearly unconditional surrender, with just enough to allow a semblance of saving face.

Emperor to remain on the throne.
Japan to withdraw from China on America’s timetable
Japan to keep only the home Islands, Okinawa to be held under (officially) joint control, demilitarized. In reality, it’s under American control.
American observers to be posted with the Japanese military.
The leaders who brought Japan into the war to be turned over to the Americans for trial. A quietly dickered understanding, never written down, was that the people on the list would be allowed to kill themselves.
The ones that chose not to kill themselves were “assisted” to do so.
Only a bare handful went to trial.
Japan’s army to be a token force, confined to the home islands. Japan may retain a limited number of tanks and other armored vehicles. Likewise, aircraft are limited
Japan’s fleet to consist of one battleship, 2 light cruisers, and 15 destroyers—NO amphibious craft or aircraft carriers.

In late 1945, there is an instant sunrise over Germany, and the war comes to an end. By that time, the Allies have landed in France again, and vast areas of Europe are more of a wasteland than before.

As peace returns to the world, Japan is a distinctly minor power (And subject to American influence in a BIG way), but one with the world’s greatest battleship. Yamato is a source of national pride, and gets every attention lavished on it. As Japan becomes more important in the cold war, the time comes when American aid is available. Modernization is less and less practical—but building a replacement is out of the question, so the ship gets the attention…

If you thought that 16” shells make a big hole in the ground, wait until Yamato delivers 18” HE shells to targets in Korea…

It's Germany that has the deep hatred of nuclear weapons that Homeline's Japan has. On a much grimmer note, there is much less confidence that gas won't get used again. There's treaties banning it--but there were similar treaties in 1944. It's been used in some minor wars, and both the Arabs and Israelis are ready to unleash vaporous hell at any moment.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

The make a future war worse is the conclusion the Time Corps agents come to in Operation Archduke (Infinite Worlds 227-229)

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Chamberlain-1 is a world where the Munich Accords never happened. Instead Britain, France, Poland, Czechoslovakia and the USSR all cooperated to bring down Nazi Germany in a conflict that was still pretty nasty but only lasted a couple of years. the United States took down down the Japanese a few years later after three years of fighting. Britain invented the first atomic weapons and used them in a nuclear exchange with the USSR that pretty much ended both sides as major players in the early 60s.

The current year is 2009 and with eugenics never having been discredited back in the 80s the United States adopted a heavy handed solution to its health care problems with health care free, with the catch that you have to undergo an evaluation for heritable conditions and sterilization if you are deemed likely to have children who will develop expensive conditions during their lives. The result is a thriving market in black market medical care that a Homeline trader finds very profitable since Chamberlain has superior computers.

Re: New Reality Seeds
 

Try this one...

Fair weather in Western Europe in late 1944 and early 1945. No Battle of the Bulge. American and British forces decisively cross the Siegfried Line Jan. 2nd 1945. The Germans seem unprepared and the allies talk of getting to give Hitler a Valentine. Stalin is furious. Even with the agreed spheres of influence the Western Allies getting to Berlin first by several months is unbearable.

Centrum and Homeline know that the Cabal changed the weather on this Q6 Low Manna world, but why? Stalin is crazier than normal even for him and FDR's health is vastly better than it should be, meanwhile, both Churchill and de Gaulle are sick. Is there some bizaar power grab planed?

Kaiserin
 

Kaiserin

The year is 1943, and the Gerrman Empire is locked in a state of lukewarm war with the Soviet Union. Every power in the world is terrified that this will erupt into another world war, but cannot decide which side to back as both factions terrify them.

The division point came in 1881. In OTL, Princess Elizabeth of Hesse and by Rhine was proposed to by her cousin, Prince Wilhelm of Prussia (the future Kaiser Wilhelm II), but she declined. In Kaiserin, she accepted.

The only child of the union, Princess Michaela Victoria, was born in 1883. In 1888, on the ascension of her father to the Imperial Throne, Micheala was created German Crown Princess, Crown Princess of Prussia, Hesse, and by Rhine.

Elizabeth was, despite her birth, a woman of simple tastes and devout piety. Wilhelm was a raging egomaniac and militarist. The whipsaw upbringing left their mark on the young Princess Michaela, giving her the urge to compete and dominate of her father combined with the focus and willpower of her mother. She was also greatly influenced by her great-grandmother Queen Victoria of England, who taught her about independence and how to spot manipulators.

Considered, like her mother, one of the most beautiful women of her generation as well as the heir to the throne of one of the Great Powers, Michaela was considered a rare catch. This made Michaela more determioned to demonstrate her independence. At age 17, using her royal influence, she arranged a shooting exhibition wherin she defeated the nine Gold Medalists of the 1900 Olympics shooting competitions. Then announced her intention to compete in the 1904 Olympics shooting competition, causing a controversy of global proportions. Michaela became a figurehead and advocate for Women's Rights, much to the disdain of her parents and great-grandmother. She also backed other forms of civil rights, seeing the treatment of various social groups asw analogous to the restriction of women to "brood mare status" in her own social circle. Still, she had a devoted folowing of German citizens of all walks of life.

In 1908 at age 25, she married Duke Wilhelm of Schweig-Holstein, a man who was enamored of her strong will and shared her active lifestyle. Those hoping that she would be calmed by her marriage and two subsequent children were disappointed. (Duke Wilhelm, like Michaela, never existed in OTL; his mother was Princess Augusta Victoria, who in OTL was Kaiser Wilhelm's wife.)

World War I started right on schedule, over Michaela's strenuous and public objections, which finally drove her into exile in England in late 1916. She worked for peace as a shadow diplomat and refused to be used for the more vulgar forms of propaganda. She also publicly traveled on a number of ships, which ended up being escorted by German U-Boats instead of being attacked.

When the Armistice was signed and Kaiser Wilhelm II sent into exile, the old Empire was broken up into it's constituent states. Michaela became Queen of Prussia under a new constitution which stripped the Throne of most of it's powers. But after years of being a shadow diplomat, possessed of an indomitable will and a mentality that did not accept submission or defeat, she began exerting herself almost immediately.

Fighting the Treaty of Versailles in the courts of nations, the League of Nations, and the courts of public opinion, Queen Michaela finally managed by 1922 to get the massive reparations (or "brigandage and plunder" as she called it) reduced substantially in return for military restrictions and sections in the Prussian Constitution preventing Prussia from declaring war unless invaded or holding overseas colonies.

Meanwhile, Michaela organized the broken-up sections of the old Empire covertly, creating a "shadow empire". The low-visibility assistance the various Germanic states gave each other stabilized the broken-up empire enough so when the Great Depression came in 1929, the Germans only lost 12% of their industrial output and suffered barely 6% unemployment. The reasonably stable economy and government (and Queen Michaela occasionally putting down the iron boot) prevented the rise of radicalism.

By 1932, the German Empire reorganized and on New Years Day 1933, Michaela became Her Imperial and Royal Majesty, Empress of Germany, Queen of Prussia. This caused a lot of international fit-throwing, but was carried out by the instituting of a constitution that, like the Prussian one, forbade offensive warfare and overseas colonies. The fact that Michaela was still a person greatly loved and admired throughout the world also helped.

At once, the German Empire was in conflict with the Soviet Union. As a niece of the late Empress Alexandra of Russia and through her mother personally close to the late Tsar's family, Empress Michaela had a personal grudge against the Communists. And Stalin blamed Michaela personally for the collapse of the German Communist Movement (which she was, both personally and indirectly). This carried over to a heavily-armed border. The French and British had no qualms about backing Germany as a buffer state.

Then in 1939, Poland requested annexation by the Empire, and when it was granted, the Soviets called it "resurgent German Imperialism" and invaded Poland. The Empire responded, and two years of war devastated Poland. When the Russians were expelled, international pressure kept Germany from pursuing the Red Army into their homeland.

The two powers now face each other across a devastated No Man's Land with occasional flareups of violence. Two years of negotiations have gone nowhere. Stalin has blamed the Germans for several assassination attempts. Empress Michaela has also been subjected to attempted assasinations, killing three assassins herself.

Ther other powers of the world do not like the idea of Germany conquering Russia, becoming a juggernaut that could dominate the world. At the same time, they absolutely hate the idea of Stalinist Russia having a European Empire. And the idea of attacking both sides opens the spectre of the two factions joining forces against them. They're paralyzed with indecision.

Meanwhile the two years of stalemate with low-level military activity have allowed the arsenals of the Empire and the Soviet Union to climb to insane levels, with amazing developments in military technology. And there are rumors of radical developments coming out of Heidelberg University, connected to names like Slizard and Einstein ...

TL is mid-6 in military, late 5 otherwise. Europe is holding it's breath as The German Valkyrie and the Russian Man of Steel have their sabres locked, waiting for the other one to blink.