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-   -   Large variance of SMs together (http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=157406)

kirbwarrior 05-15-2018 01:51 AM

Large variance of SMs together
 
I've been working on a city in my setting for awhile now and I'm having some trouble imagining things. Here are the core concepts that I'm having trouble with;

There are 9 races (might be more, but this is the focus). One for each SM from -3 to +3, then one each at -6 and +6.
Breaker Vault is an enormous cityscape. There are many methods of travel, but it's assumed to be a week's travel to get from one side of the city to the other.
In this city, all the races live together. It's largely the melting pot of the world. It's less so in other places, but then any other place doesn't get much bigger than "town"

How would buildings be built for such a place? Roads? I like major roads being almost freeways (maybe even above the city) that anyone can easily traverse. Shops could largely be outside stalls so anyone can access them. Apartment complexes could be based around the biggest race, with smaller races having complexes inside the giant complexes (an entire -6 "colony" could exit within an apartment big enough for +6)

I'm still thinking on exact details for each race (largely, the -6 will probably be faeries with Flight). The setting is close enough to TL4^ due to magic. The "simple" answer would be that the city just forces everyone to the same SM, but that seems like a boring solution. I would like the "chaotic" feel of many different sizes having to live together, since I want a "civilized chaos" feel to the city (guild rivalry, alchemy experiments going wrong as a daily experience, etc).

The ideas are vague but I wanted to solve the logistics issue before trying to worry about extra issues that can crop up from racial differences (for instance, there might be a race that talks using Mind Sending instead of voice). Really, a place where a SM -6 faerie, a SM +0 human, and a SM +6 titan can live together is the crux of this, since the intermediate sizes would be less of an issue.

Any help would be appreciated. Thank you ahead of time.

Phantasm 05-15-2018 03:35 AM

Re: Large variance of SMs together
 
I've done some stuff with folks of SM -2 (~ 3 ft tall) through SM +1 (~ 9 ft tall) living in the same city. Public areas - marketplaces, public baths, temples, amphitheaters, etc. - tend to be wide with tall ceilings to accommodate the centaurs and ogres, with the distance between steps on staircases shorter to accommodate the dwarves, halflings, and goblins.

Private residences are built mainly to accommodate the people expected to live there. Houses are built for SM 0 men or elves, SM -1 dwarves, SM +1 ogres, SM +1 centaurs, or SM -2 halfings and goblins, often with entire housing districts built for only one scale. The exceptions are for those wealthy men (and others) that own ogre slaves; then the private areas of the residence (bedrooms, private studies) are built for men, but the central areas (kitchens, dining halls, libraries, etc.) are built so the ogres can maneuver. (Most of the time, the ogres sleep in the stables, which they don't normally mind.)

Nothing like putting SM +6 and SM -6 folks together, though. That's... pretty large giants.

kirbwarrior 05-15-2018 04:12 AM

Re: Large variance of SMs together
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Phantasm (Post 2176332)
Nothing like putting SM +6 and SM -6 folks together, though. That's... pretty large giants.

I like a lot of the points you made, especially about ogre slaves and the housing made for them. But the extremism is what worried me. The stairs issue is fine when it's a 3 SM difference but this is a 12 SM difference.

As for the giants themselves, I've always imagined titans (since I was in grade school) to be 10x height of humans and proportionally as strong (or stronger). There is a separate issue I'm trying to solve about point totals of races (but that's not for this thread).

To go through some of your list;
Temples can be titan-sized no problem, it's not that strange to imagine temples that big in fiction anyway.
Amphitheaters are similar, probably with seating getting smaller the closer to the stage. That stops different races from sitting together, but that's a logistics problem really.
Market places was one issue I knew about going in. Sellers can be of any size selling to any size.
Public Baths might be solved similar to amphitheaters, like how pools have different depths if smaller races want somewhere they can just sit in the water.
Housing, like you pointed out, would be easiest to accommodate the specific resident, and one of the guilds (the one that covers hotels, housing, travel, etc) might build houses in a way that can be deconstructed if they lose a tenant for low cost so they don't ever get too many houses of one race.

I do wonder how travel would work. I was imagining enormous teleporters between key points in the city (effectively magic airports), but maybe many personal ones to help navigate the city could make sense. That would constrain how I would have to do magic in the setting, though.

Tomsdad 05-15-2018 05:18 AM

Re: Large variance of SMs together
 
Its a lot to think about (it one of those situations that once you start thinking about it suddenly a lot of questions spring up and you think about those, and so on).

So OK basic city principles

How does the water and food get in and the waste and rubbish get out

I think you need to give the smaller races increased movement speed* of some kind otherwise they spend ages crossing roads that they have to accommodate the largest citizens and their facilities



*The SM-6 people should probably fly

clu2415 05-15-2018 05:50 AM

Re: Large variance of SMs together
 
Have you seen Zootopia? Itís pretty relevant with the range of sizes living together. Thereís effectively got to be separate facilities for different size ranges. An SM -6 City hall could fit under the stairs leading to a SM+6 city hall.

Bruno 05-15-2018 10:31 AM

Re: Large variance of SMs together
 
What you'll see is not stairs, but ramps, and with a modest slope if possible. Those have the benefit of also being cart-friendly, which is nice in city design. With SM +6 giants available, you effectively have heavy construction equipment. Buildings may have a variety of ascension methods - a ramp (general purpose) and a ladder for SM 0 to -2, and a little dumbwaiter for SM -6 people cranked by a SM 0 or SM 1 resident, for instance.

SilvercatMoonpaw 05-15-2018 10:58 AM

Re: Large variance of SMs together
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by clu2415 (Post 2176346)
Have you seen Zootopia? Itís pretty relevant with the range of sizes living together. Thereís effectively got to be separate facilities for different size ranges. An SM -6 City hall could fit under the stairs leading to a SM+6 city hall.

I think you can even see in one scene apartments for small animals built into the decorative arches of a building for larger ones.

SilvercatMoonpaw 05-15-2018 11:02 AM

Re: Large variance of SMs together
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Phantasm (Post 2176332)
....with the distance between steps on staircases shorter to accommodate the dwarves, halflings, and goblins.

For an extreme size difference it's better to go with separate ascension methods. Otherwise you have to have very long steps (to accommodate titan feet) with very little rise per distance, and that's just not a very efficient stair.

Flyndaran 05-15-2018 01:15 PM

Re: Large variance of SMs together
 
That's a huge difference. It's like having a village set up for humans and mice. How do the larger creatures avoid stepping on the smaller ones? One tiny misstep and instant death.

Toptomcat 05-15-2018 01:17 PM

Re: Large variance of SMs together
 
Does the city have some equivalent of the Americans with Disabilities Act which *forces* people to accommodate radically differently sized creatures in the same facilities?

If not, the city is more likely to fragment into the Giant District, the Ogre District, the Human District, the Halfling District and the Fairy District than develop means for accommodating radically different creatures in the same space.


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