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pawsplay 08-05-2020 11:05 PM

Re: Cribing Notes From Star Wars
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Varyon (Post 2337095)
I think even the movies implied it took more than a moment to travel through hyperspace (I can't find a clip online, but I'm pretty certain after the Millennium Falcon jumped to hyperspace Han wasn't like "Alright, we jumped to lightspeed and... we're here"), and outside of the movies there's usually a big deal made about hyperspace speed (heck, that's even what made the Falcon special, it's just that George Lucas apparently thought "parsec" was a measurement of time when he wrote Han's dialogue), so I don't think treating the time to travel as negligible is appropriate. Certainly, Star Wars travel is very much "speed of plot," but that doesn't lend itself well to making an RPG setting.

Given that we see the Rebels launch a few ships from their own bases basically into the Empire's lap, it appears that even long-distance travel can be accomplished in hours, provided you have clear lanes. Whereas when Luke, Leia, Lando, and Chewie were leaving the Cloud City, it seems that it takes days if not weeks to travel the murk of the more distant systems.

Certainly in the sequel movies, it seems to take only a few hours to muster a small vanguard of ships to delay the Empire.

Phantasm 08-06-2020 01:08 AM

Re: Cribing Notes From Star Wars
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin (Post 2337078)
That's about as optimistic as is physically possible. The most detailed and scientific figure I've seen on these forums was more like 200 ly betwen each habitable planet.

It doesn't actually matter. The farther apart the habitable planets are the faster you make your drive. It's just that if you make them too close together somebody like me will know that's not possible.

As we're cribbing from Star Wars, we can let reality sleep.

Quote:

Originally Posted by scc (Post 2337146)
You forgot to account for the fact that things will scale by the cube here, so 60 ly means 27 times the stars!

I also did not account for the three dozen red dwarf and handful of detected brown dwarf stars - nor the two A-type stars (Sirius and Altair) in our neighborhood. And of those M-type red dwarfs, I would be very wary about putting inhabitable planets around any but the M0 to M2 types, even if they're in the habitable zone (see: Proxima Centauri and TRAPPIST-1).

So yeah, there's a lot more stars, as the M types outnumber the combined K, G, F, and A types a minimum of three to one.

AlexanderHowl 08-06-2020 01:57 AM

Re: Cribing Notes From Star Wars
 
Honestly, Garden planets are likely quite common, as photosynthesis is probably inevitable in any system with K through F stars. I would not be surprised if the 10% of K through F stars have one or two (around 2.25% of stars). That would mean that there should be 45 Garden planets within 50 ly of Sol (including the Earth). The only reason we have not seen them yet is because we lack the technology to see low mass planets that orbit their stars at a reasonable distance unless they transit their star (which is unlikely).

Of course, Venus and Mars may have been Garden planets until a billion years ago, so you would probably find more former Garden planets than existing Garden planets, probably 20% of K through F stars have former Garden planets. Potential Garden planets, like Earth a billion years ago, are probably as common as former Garden planets with probably 20% of K through F stars having potential Garden planets. It is these two groups that will form most terraforming candidates (around 180 such planets within 50 ly of Earth, including Venus and Mars).

Prince Charon 08-06-2020 12:29 PM

Re: Cribing Notes From Star Wars
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Varyon (Post 2337113)
I guess this was eventually forgotten, then, seeing as it was true in both Legends canon (it involved traveling around a cluster of black holes, but Solo had managed to weave between them and shorten the distance) and the new Disney canon (which was similar, but also had some sort of weird space storm going on).

IIRC, the problem was that the writers didn't all talk to each other, and the West End Games writers didn't have enough communication with Lucasfilm, but the people who wrote the comics and novels published after the first edition of the Star Wars RPG came out sometimes read that, and some of the other writers read the works of the writers who read the RPG's sourcebooks, et cetra.

Phantasm 08-06-2020 04:13 PM

Re: Cribing Notes From Star Wars
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Prince Charon (Post 2337255)
IIRC, the problem was that the writers didn't all talk to each other, and the West End Games writers didn't have enough communication with Lucasfilm, but the people who wrote the comics and novels published after the first edition of the Star Wars RPG came out sometimes read that, and some of the other writers read the works of the writers who read the RPG's sourcebooks, et cetra.

This is why many novels gave blasters a range of 30-35 meters, and hyperdrive classes had a larger number for slower drives - and some writers who tried to reverse that trend got yelled at by the fan base, particularly when the Falcon would always have a class 0.5 regardless of which camp the writers fell into.

Author: "A class 0.3 hyperdrive? That's almost as fast as the Falcon!"
Fan-Base: "No way! It's faster! How dare you?!"

scc 08-07-2020 12:46 AM

Re: Cribing Notes From Star Wars
 
So I'm changing some numbers around for speeds, dropping travel times a lot, but two more questions travel related:
1) How should I scale FTL engine cost? If a more powerful Hyperdrive can get you to your destination 9 times faster, should it be 9 times more expensive?

2) I'm going to have hypergates scattered around the place that allow for even faster travel then normal, anyone got any ideas just how rare they should be? Out of the roughly 100 known worlds in the local cluster how many should have them?

AlexanderHowl 08-07-2020 01:10 AM

Re: Cribing Notes From Star Wars
 
Star Wars FTL should probably have a velocity of (1,000,000/[Hyperspace Factor])c through charted hyperspace channels and (1,000/[Hyperspace Factor])c outside of charted hyperspace channels. For example, the Millennium Falcon possesses a Hyperspace Factor of 0.5, making her one of the fastest ships in the galaxy, as she can move at 2 million c through charted channels and 2000 c outside if charted channels.

The importance of the hypergate depends on where it goes. If it accesses a star system outside of any hyperspace channels, it is not that impressive unless there are a lot of unusual artifacts (like a Ringworld). If it accesses a hyperspace stream unconnected to the hyperspace stream of the Old Republic, then it would be one of the most important installations in the galaxy. I would suggest only one though, as they are supposed to be really rare.

Varyon 08-07-2020 07:22 AM

Re: Cribing Notes From Star Wars
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by scc (Post 2337397)
So I'm changing some numbers around for speeds, dropping travel times a lot, but two more questions travel related:
1) How should I scale FTL engine cost? If a more powerful Hyperdrive can get you to your destination 9 times faster, should it be 9 times more expensive?

Depends on the paradigm you're going for, but given there is no increase in weight, I'd be inclined to scale the cost by the square of the speed - a hyperdrive that's 9x the speed but the same weight would be 81x the cost. If it's also 9x the weight, then 9x the cost is probably fair.

scc 08-08-2020 04:32 AM

Re: Cribing Notes From Star Wars
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl (Post 2337400)
Star Wars FTL should probably have a velocity of (1,000,000/[Hyperspace Factor])c through charted hyperspace channels and (1,000/[Hyperspace Factor])c outside of charted hyperspace channels. For example, the Millennium Falcon possesses a Hyperspace Factor of 0.5, making her one of the fastest ships in the galaxy, as she can move at 2 million c through charted channels and 2000 c outside if charted channels.

I'm not going an entire galaxy, if for no other reason then it's too much work. Also this idea started worming it's way through my head because of the way the SW universe is set up, it's set up for Game of Thrones tier characters, not smaller scale stuff

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl (Post 2337400)
The importance of the hypergate depends on where it goes. If it accesses a star system outside of any hyperspace channels, it is not that impressive unless there are a lot of unusual artifacts (like a Ringworld). If it accesses a hyperspace stream unconnected to the hyperspace stream of the Old Republic, then it would be one of the most important installations in the galaxy. I would suggest only one though, as they are supposed to be really rare.

Not using channels, hyperspace it a go faster space, and gates allow you to go faster then your ship normally could, and even allow ships without hyperdrive to enter hyperspace, gate is only need at departure point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Varyon (Post 2337428)
Depends on the paradigm you're going for, but given there is no increase in weight, I'd be inclined to scale the cost by the square of the speed - a hyperdrive that's 9x the speed but the same weight would be 81x the cost. If it's also 9x the weight, then 9x the cost is probably fair.

Currently Class 1, 2, and 3 the same size, with Classes 4 and 5 are three times the size, but I'm thinking of changing it to be all the same size

So I've reached some other decisions: Every Half-G of Reactionless Acceleration gives 1/8 of one percent of C in top speed, but there's a minimum of 0.5c and both reactionless engines and hyperdrives are in somewhat limited supply, so most merchant men use a dean drive and a low spec hyperdrive, normally a Class 3, and supplement it with a reaction engine if they need more speed.

Now here is what the Millennium Falcon would look like in this setting:
FIREFLY
Code:

TL  Spacecraft  dST/dHP  Hnd/SR  HT  Move  LWt.    Load    SM    Occ    dDR  Range  Cost         
10^    Firefly      30    +0/4  13  2G/c  100  17.3 [1]  +6  8ASV [2]  10    3x  $9.53M

Length: 20 yd. (60 ft.)
Power Points: +2 / -5
Space Performance: sAccel: 2Gs FTL Rating: FTL-3
Air Performance: aAccel: 2Gs (44 mph/s) aSpeed: 350 mph (0.1 mps) Hnd/SR: +0/4


SHIP SYSTEMS
Code:

  FRONT         
[1]      Armor - Nanocomposite       
            dDR 10       
[2]      Comm/Sensor Array - Tactical       
            Array level: 7       
[3]      Weapon Battery - Medium       
            3 Weapon Mounts       
[4-6]    Cargo Hold       
            15 Tons / SM+2 Bay Doors       
[Core]    Control Room       
            Comp: C7 / Comm/Sensor: 5 / 2 Stations

Code:

CENTER         
[1]      Armor - Nanocomposite       
            dDR 10       
[2]      Habitat       
            1 Cabin / Normal Life Support       
[3]      Weapon Battery - Medium       
            3 Weapon Mounts       
[4-6!!!]  Stardrive - Hyperdrive       
            FTL-3       
[Core]    Habitat       
            1 Cabin / Normal Life Support

Code:

  REAR           
[1]      Armor - Nanocomposite       
            dDR 10       
[2]      Defensive ECM       
            -2 to Hit       
[3]      Engine Room       
            1 Control Station / 1 Workspace       
[4]      Power Plant - Fusion Reactor       
            2 Power Points / 200 yr Fuel [3]       
[5-6!!]  Reactionless Engine - Hot       
            2Gs

Design Switches, Features, & Notes: 2 Airlocks (Capacity: 2 people each), Ammunition Cost: $1,960,000
[1] Load includes: 0.8*tons of Crew & Passengers, 1.5*tons of Steerage Cargo, 15*tons of Cargo Hold
[2] Crew Requirement (6 total): 3 Control Stations (1 Pilot, 1 Sensor Operator, 1 Tactical Officer), 1 Technician, 2 Gunners,
FUEL USED: [3] Hydrogen/Helium Isotopes

0
HABITATS
Code:

Qty.  Location    Type    SM    Notes         
  1  Center [C]  Bunkroom  +0  4 person       
  1  Center [2]  Bunkroom  +0  4 person

WEAPONS TABLE
Code:

          Range Scale:    Basic Combat Ranges    Turn Length:    20-sec         
Qty.        Mount                Weapon            Options      Options  Size    Damage        sAcc    Rcl.    RoF    Shots  MPS  Accel      SM      Range         
  2  Center [3] - Medium    Conventional Gun  Very Rapid Fire          2.5 cm  3d+2(2) cr    -10 (+8)    3  200 [4]  2,800  1              -7        C       
  1  Front [3] - Medium    Conventional Gun  Very Rapid Fire          2.5 cm  3d+2(2) cr  -8 (+8) [2]    3  200 [4]  1,400  1              -7        C       
  2  Front [3] - Medium    Missile Launcher                              20 cm  6dx5(2) cr  +4 (+0) [2]    1    2 [3]    14    10    5G      -1        X

[1] Parenthetical value is the Rapid Fire bonus (p. SS1:60), [2] Includes +2 sAcc for Fixed Mount, [3] Already multiplied by number of mounts, [4] Includes x2 for Improved
Created using GURPS Spaceship Design Spreadsheet v2.0 RC 9. GURPS Spaceships Design Spreadsheet is copyright 2009-2020 Eric B. Smith. This spreadsheet is based on information contained in the GURPS Spaceships series of books.
This ships dates back to an earlier age of start travel when interstellar trade was very wild west and she's very heavily modified.

maximara 08-08-2020 09:16 AM

Re: Cribing Notes From Star Wars
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl (Post 2337075)
Star Wars is high superscience. I would suggest using cosmic power systems, cosmic weapons and force screens, etc. As for STL speed, use boost drives, giving you a maximum velocity and insane maneuverability. As for FTL speed, it is fast along charted hyperspace routes (something like 1,000,000c for military ships and 100,000c for civilian ships), but difficult to suicidal for uncharted hyperspace routes.

For a large extent Star Wars sits at TL10/(6+4)^ with "Blasters" possibly being TL(6+5)^

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl (Post 2337075)
A good rule of thumb is that 10% of the systems in the Galactic Arms are connected through the same system of routes and that 10% of them have been charted. This gives you over a billion systems to work withm Of those, 10% may have been human dominated and 10% may have been part of the Old Republic.

IMHO this is a sever low balling. Remember the Old Republic/Galactic Republic existed for 5,000 years minimum. With FTL it would be insanely easy to have the entire galaxy mapped out by time the events of a New Hope occur which the wookieepidia confirms.

The coverage of the Old Republic/Galactic Republic/Empire is very extensive. I would say 90% of all systems have been charted.


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