Game Ownership

ScaredofScissors · 12-24-2010, 07:03 AM

So who actually "owns" IN? I assume it's still Croc, though he doesn't produce the game anymore AFAIK. How much longer does SJGames have licensing rights?

Rocket Man · 12-24-2010, 07:18 AM

Archangel Beth is probably the best person to answer this, but my understanding is that SJG has the rights to the American version more or less in perpetuity. (Or as long as the copyright lasts, anyway.) The situation might have been different if it had been a straight-up translation, but my understanding is that there are significant differences between the French MV/INS and the American IN, to the point where they're more or less two different games that share some names and imagery.

(I asked something like this about a year or two ago, since I was concerned that the slow pace of new supplements was due to a license expiring. I was very relieved by the answer I got then.)

Archangel Beth · 12-25-2010, 07:37 PM

Unless I've hopped timelines (it's been known to happen!), Rocket Man is correct -- the license for the adaptive work, In Nomine, isn't expiring anytime soon. I believe that we do not have a license for a direct translation of anything else that Croc made for INS/MV, so we couldn't pull over the various adventures and such for it -- but they don't really fit "IN/SJG" very well, most times, anyway.

Any particular reason, or just curious? O:>

robkelk · 12-26-2010, 08:39 AM

Blue-sky idea, and I probably can't afford to do it anyway (but it never hurts to ask...) Does SJGames have the right to award sublicenses for IN products?

Yes, I know there are extremely few licensed works for SJGames products, but successfully sublicensing the line could speed up release of the Superiors books - if quality-control can be kept in place. (That's the part I'm most worried about, after the cost of the sublicense itself.)

Archangel Beth · 12-26-2010, 11:16 AM

I don't know if there's any sub-licensing allowed. I am strongly suspicious that there is not. Or else I might be inclined to be asking some questions about that m'self. *grin*

ScaredofScissors · 12-27-2010, 10:30 AM

Mostly idle curiosity unless I win the lottery. I merely thought it might be fun, since Asmodee isn't publishing the original anymore, to see a supplement using some of its stuff.

Also, I'm interested in seeing Emily Dresner's Fate adaptation expanded.

Archangel Beth · 12-28-2010, 08:30 AM

Ahhh. We really can't snaffle any of Asmodee's stuff, far as I know. That's theirs.

Doing official Fate adaptations might require getting permissions from the Fate developers -- I did a quick look and didn't find whether it's OGL or not. (And then there'd be whether Em's even interested in doing the work.)

Elberon · 12-28-2010, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archangel Beth

Ahhh. We really can't snaffle any of Asmodee's stuff, far as I know. That's theirs.

Doing official Fate adaptations might require getting permissions from the Fate developers -- I did a quick look and didn't find whether it's OGL or not. (And then there'd be whether Em's even interested in doing the work.)

Fate 2.0 is OGL " Fate is available under the Open Gaming License!" taken from here: http://www.faterpg.com/dl/.

I don't know about Fate 3, the chaps at Evil Hat are writing it as part of their post Dresden Files RPG schedule.

Not that I'm, you know, encourage the creation of a Fate version of In Nomine.... <Still need to get my head around In Nomi-Way conversion>

Chris

Kuroshima · 12-28-2010, 01:16 PM

Fate 3rd ed (The one in The Dresden Files RPG) is OGL, and so are the derivatives (Legends of Anglerre, Strands of Fate, etc etc). Of course, some parts are Product Identity.

Archangel Beth · 12-28-2010, 09:19 PM

Far be it from me to discourage anything that encourages people to buy the existing materials. O;> (I would, of course, be a bit unhappy at something that discouraged people to buy the existing materials!)

Edit: I do note, this is "within reason" -- no matter how many sales certain things might generate, if if takes extreme liberties with copyright (the right of the IP owner to control how things are copied and distributed), it should be passed by SJ first. Of course, if it was obviously going to generate lots of sales, I suspect he'd be interested. *grin*

12-24-2010, 07:03 AM	#1
ScaredofScissors Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Western MA	Game Ownership So who actually "owns" IN? I assume it's still Croc, though he doesn't produce the game anymore AFAIK. How much longer does SJGames have licensing rights?

12-24-2010, 07:18 AM	#2
Rocket Man Petitioner: Word of IN Filk Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Longmont, CO	Re: Game Ownership Archangel Beth is probably the best person to answer this, but my understanding is that SJG has the rights to the American version more or less in perpetuity. (Or as long as the copyright lasts, anyway.) The situation might have been different if it had been a straight-up translation, but my understanding is that there are significant differences between the French MV/INS and the American IN, to the point where they're more or less two different games that share some names and imagery. (I asked something like this about a year or two ago, since I was concerned that the slow pace of new supplements was due to a license expiring. I was very relieved by the answer I got then.) __________________ “It's not railroading if you offer the PCs tickets and they stampede to the box office, waving their money. Metaphorically speaking” --Elizabeth McCoy, In Nomine Line Editor Author: "What Doesn't Kill Me Makes Me Stronger"

12-25-2010, 07:37 PM	#3
Archangel Beth In Nomine Line Editor Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Frozen Wastelands of NH	Re: Game Ownership Unless I've hopped timelines (it's been known to happen!), Rocket Man is correct -- the license for the adaptive work, In Nomine, isn't expiring anytime soon. I believe that we do not have a license for a direct translation of anything else that Croc made for INS/MV, so we couldn't pull over the various adventures and such for it -- but they don't really fit "IN/SJG" very well, most times, anyway. Any particular reason, or just curious? O:> __________________ --Beth Shamelessly adding Superiors: Lilith, GURPS Sparrials, and her fiction page to her .sig (the latter is not precisely gaming related)

12-26-2010, 08:39 AM	#4
robkelk Untitled Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: between keyboard and chair	Re: Game Ownership Blue-sky idea, and I probably can't afford to do it anyway (but it never hurts to ask...) Does SJGames have the right to award sublicenses for IN products? Yes, I know there are extremely few licensed works for SJGames products, but successfully sublicensing the line could speed up release of the *Superiors* books - if quality-control can be kept in place. (That's the part I'm most worried about, after the cost of the sublicense itself.) __________________ Rob Kelk “Every man has a right to his own opinion, but no man has a right to be wrong in his facts.” – Bernard Baruch, Deming (New Mexico) Headlight, 6 January 1950 No longer reading these forums regularly.

12-26-2010, 11:16 AM	#5
Archangel Beth In Nomine Line Editor Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Frozen Wastelands of NH	Re: Game Ownership I don't know if there's any sub-licensing allowed. I am strongly suspicious that there is not. Or else I might be inclined to be asking some questions about that m'self. grin __________________ --Beth Shamelessly adding Superiors: Lilith, GURPS Sparrials, and her fiction page to her .sig (the latter is not precisely gaming related)

12-27-2010, 10:30 AM	#6
ScaredofScissors Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Western MA	Re: Game Ownership Mostly idle curiosity unless I win the lottery. I merely thought it might be fun, since Asmodee isn't publishing the original anymore, to see a supplement using some of its stuff. Also, I'm interested in seeing Emily Dresner's Fate adaptation expanded.

12-28-2010, 08:30 AM	#7
Archangel Beth In Nomine Line Editor Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Frozen Wastelands of NH	Re: Game Ownership Ahhh. We really can't snaffle any of Asmodee's stuff, far as I know. That's theirs. Doing official Fate adaptations might require getting permissions from the Fate developers -- I did a quick look and didn't find whether it's OGL or not. (And then there'd be whether Em's even interested in doing the work.) __________________ --Beth Shamelessly adding Superiors: Lilith, GURPS Sparrials, and her fiction page to her .sig (the latter is not precisely gaming related)

12-28-2010, 01:16 PM	#9
Kuroshima MIB Pyramid Contributor Mad Spaniard Rules Lawyer Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: The ASS of the world, mainly Valencia, Spain (Europe)	Re: Game Ownership Fate 3rd ed (The one in The Dresden Files RPG) is OGL, and so are the derivatives (Legends of Anglerre, Strands of Fate, etc etc). Of course, some parts are Product Identity. __________________ Antoni Ten MIB3119 My GURPs character sheet My stuff on e23

12-28-2010, 09:19 PM	#10
Archangel Beth In Nomine Line Editor Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Frozen Wastelands of NH	Re: Game Ownership Far be it from me to discourage anything that encourages people to buy the existing materials. O;> (I would, of course, be a bit unhappy at something that discouraged people to buy the existing materials!) Edit: I do note, this is "within reason" -- no matter how many sales certain things might generate, if if takes extreme liberties with copyright (the right of the IP owner to control how things are copied and distributed), it should be passed by SJ first. Of course, if it was obviously going to generate lots of sales, I suspect he'd be interested. grin __________________ --Beth Shamelessly adding Superiors: Lilith, GURPS Sparrials, and her fiction page to her .sig (the latter is not precisely gaming related)