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Old 06-07-2017, 09:52 AM   #1
GWJ
 
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Default "I make him conscious"

One of annoying things for me is when unconsciousness is treated by the players as just "need to sacrifice few seconds". There are any rules (if they're officjal - it's great!) to prevent this or make this much harder? Without just saying to players "no, he can't be made conscious"?

And when "making someone conscious" (by pouring water on him, or slapping in face, or something) should be realistically automatic, when "there is a chance" (roll or something), and when there is "no way!"?
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Old 06-07-2017, 10:02 AM   #2
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Default Re: "I make him conscious"

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Originally Posted by GWJ View Post
One of annoying things for me is when unconsciousness is treated by the players as just "need to sacrifice few seconds". There are any rules (if they're officjal - it's great!) to prevent this or make this much harder? Without just saying to players "no, he can't be made conscious"?
The rules for regaining consciousness from injury are in minutes and hours, not in seconds.
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And when "making someone conscious" (by pouring water on him, or slapping in face, or something) should be realistically automatic, when "there is a chance" (roll or something), and when there is "no way!"?
Those things work on someone who is sleeping and absent drugs or appropriate disadvantages are going to be generally effective within a minute or so, GURPS doesn't really have very centralized rules about how long it takes to wake up from sleep though, unfortunately. These things are generally never effective on someone who has lost consciousness from injury. They may be effective on someone who has lost consciousness due to a failed Fright Check, and IIRC Horror has rules for this.
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Old 06-07-2017, 10:06 AM   #3
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Default Re: "I make him conscious"

Hmm and what about with fighters (MMA, boxers, etc.) after K.O., when they are "treated" in similiar ways to regain consciousness?

Oh, I can't find these rules in Horror :/ You mean 4e Horror? Because I don't have 3 ed Horror...

Last edited by GWJ; 06-07-2017 at 10:10 AM.
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Old 06-07-2017, 10:22 AM   #4
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Default Re: "I make him conscious"

Smelling salts force an inhalation, so if the person is unconscious because they were wearing a corset and suffocating, and you have loosened the corset, they might work - but it's really not good to be huffing ammonia (which is what you get with smelling salts), and can make other sources of suffocation or unconsciousness worse. It's one of those "brilliant" Victorian ideas. It might help a little with someone who's hyperventilated until they passed out and now is not breathing enough but there are better First Aid measures at TL8.

You may get a response from someone who is concussed - but they're not going to be "conscious". Their brain is offline, and trying to stimulate them awake with a dose of adrenaline (which is what cold water, shaking them, or a slap to the face hopes to do) won't fix that. They're not going to be any more oriented to person place or thing than they were when they were unconscious. You may be able to coax them to bear some of their own weight and help you move them, but this is not a combat-time operation.
Worst case scenario you get paradoxical rage (primordial fight/flight response no longer mediated by a functional brain) and get a brain-injury patient trying to murderate you.

Please note that hitting someone with a head injury in the head (frex slapping, shaking) is a terrible idea.

Smelling salts can revive unconsciousness due to mild head trauma, but that's a really bad idea. Someone with head trauma needs to be kept still and evaluated, not sent on their way to do more head-trauma-inducing activity. As with the use of adrenaline, damaged brains still aren't going to be working better after smelling salts, so the pt is more likely to compound their injury with more injuries, and/or get other people hurt.
A particular risk of using smelling salts on someone who's got head trauma is that they may also have a cervical spine fracture. In this case, the reflex to recoil from the odor can break your neck. That c-spine fracture is another good reason not to slap, shake, or dump water on someone with head trauma - you can break their neck yourself, or as with the salts cause the pt to recoil and break their own neck.
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Old 06-07-2017, 10:51 AM   #5
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Default Re: "I make him conscious"

Note that for many real world values of "revived" you are still effectively unconscious in GURPS terms.
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Old 06-07-2017, 10:59 AM   #6
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Default Re: "I make him conscious"

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...trying to stimulate them awake with a dose of adrenaline (which is what cold water, shaking them, or a slap to the face hopes to do) won't fix that...
Actually... cold water causes capillary action (the capillaries contract) forcing blood into the core and brain, thus flooding them with more oxygen.

As you say, it's not much help when someone is concussed, but great for those mornings when you're awake but a bit groggy .
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Old 06-07-2017, 10:59 AM   #7
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Default Re: "I make him conscious"

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Originally Posted by GWJ View Post
Hmm and what about with fighters (MMA, boxers, etc.) after K.O., when they are "treated" in similiar ways to regain consciousness?

Oh, I can't find these rules in Horror :/ You mean 4e Horror? Because I don't have 3 ed Horror...
In many cases, I'd consider a knockout as closer to what GURPS calls stunned. Your knocked down and unable to act for several seconds. Or possibly even a knockdown roll failed by more than 5.
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Old 06-07-2017, 11:02 AM   #8
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Default Re: "I make him conscious"

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In many cases, I'd consider a knockout as closer to what GURPS calls stunned. Your knocked down and unable to act for several seconds. Or possibly even a knockdown roll failed by more than 5.
I agree and a failed roll to avoid knockdown.
Stunned fits the guy on the mat who is out of it and unable to stand for a few seconds,
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Old 06-07-2017, 11:13 AM   #9
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Default Re: "I make him conscious"

In general, I assume that someone who is unconscious due to sleep can be wakened automatically but is mentally stunned as per total surprise. Someone who is unconscious for other reasons generally cannot be made conscious in a combat-relevant timeframe.
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Old 06-07-2017, 11:31 AM   #10
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Default Re: "I make him conscious"

Note that Affliction has Daze, +50%, Sleep +150%, Unconscious +200%
p. 327 under Major Wounds is worth noting though.
p. 328 Recovering goes into more detail and it looks like we have 2 possible forms of knockout.
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Last edited by Refplace; 06-07-2017 at 06:54 PM. Reason: Changed nothing to noting as originally intended
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