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Old 12-09-2009, 12:03 PM   #1
Nymdok
 
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Default Left 4 Dead Zombies

Im currently running a Zombie Game (World War Z:Alpha Missions) and since Ive just recently picked up a copy of Left 4 Dead, I wanted to throw a few of the 'Special' zombies in the mix. I winged it for the boomer and the Smoker in the last game, but Id like something a little more rigorous.

There are some rough ideas in this thread:

http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=62801

but I was looking for something a bit more rigorous.

Specifically Im looking for stats/answers for

General Infected
Brain is the only vital. (Unliving 20, Has a Brain -5 = 15 sound about right?)

Boomer
http://forums.sjgames.com/showpost.p...3&postcount=66

Hunter
http://forums.sjgames.com/showpost.php?p=895544&postcount=37

Jockey
Not sure how to model the 'steering' ability or what mechanics to apply.

Smoker
Last game I used Quick Contest of Strength with margin of victory moving the looser in the winner's desired direction. Is there a RAW way to handle this tug of war?

Tank
http://forums.sjgames.com/showpost.p...5&postcount=68

Witch
http://forums.sjgames.com/showpost.p...1&postcount=72

Has anyone done this yet or have any answers?

Keep in mind, as these are NPCs Im not really worried about point costs. Im also not worried about skill levels (I'll balance those to suit my players), but skill suggestions are of course welcome! My main concern is that I use the skills/abilities in accordance with the mechanics of the RAW.

Thanks in advance
Nymdok

p.s. Because I think its creepier, Ive changed the smoker to where its not its tongue that shoots out, but its entrails.

Last edited by Nymdok; 12-15-2009 at 10:22 PM.
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Old 12-09-2009, 12:13 PM   #2
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Default Re: Left 4 Dead Zombies

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nymdok View Post
Im currently running a Zombie Game (World War Z:Alpha Missions) and since Ive just recently picked up a copy of Left 4 Dead, I wanted to throw a few of the 'Special' zombies in the mix. I winged it for the boomer and the Smoker in the last game, but Id like something a little more rigorous.

There are some rough ideas in this thread:

http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=62801

but I was looking for something a bit more rigorous.

Specifically Im looking for stats/answers for

General Infected
Brain is the only vital. (Unliving 20, Has a Brain -5 = 15 sound about right?)

Hunter
Whats the range on the Jump?

Smoker

Last game I used Quick Contest of Strength with margin of victory moving the looser in the winner's desired direction. Is there a RAW way to handle this tug of war?

Boomer

Jockey
Not sure how to model the 'steering' ability or what mechanics to apply.


Has anyone done this yet or have any answers?

Keep in mind, as these are NPCs Im not really worried about point costs. Im also not worried about skill levels (I'll balance those to suit my players), but skill suggestions are of course welcome! My main concern is that I use the skills/abilities in accordance with the mechanics of the RAW.

Thanks in advance
Nymdok

p.s. Because I think its creepier, Ive changed the smoker to where its not its tongue that shoots out, but its entrails.
Hunter Jump is about 30 feet, all-told. So 15 yards? Smoker entrails, I see you're a Troper. As for the Jockey, skill-riding at 18 or so, Wrestling at 16? (If you don't want a complete hijacking as per the game, try 12 or 14, but I'm better for L4D info than I am GURPS suggestions.)

EDIT: Also, regarding the Boomer, if you haven't checked already I recall someone making a thread a bit back asking 'how to stat an enemy that pukes on you and draws nearby enemies.' Sounds like something relevant.
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Old 12-09-2009, 12:27 PM   #3
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Default Re: Left 4 Dead Zombies

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ubiquitous View Post
Hunter Jump is about 30 feet, all-told. So 15 yards? Smoker entrails, I see you're a Troper. As for the Jockey, skill-riding at 18 or so, Wrestling at 16? (If you don't want a complete hijacking as per the game, try 12 or 14, but I'm better for L4D info than I am GURPS suggestions.)

EDIT: Also, regarding the Boomer, if you haven't checked already I recall someone making a thread a bit back asking 'how to stat an enemy that pukes on you and draws nearby enemies.' Sounds like something relevant.
No, thats just me trying to gross out a bunch of 17 year olds..which is no mean feat! :)

Yes, but by what mechanic do I decide who is 'driving' the jockey-charachter totem pole?

Riding vs Strength? vs DX?

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Old 12-09-2009, 12:38 PM   #4
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Default Re: Left 4 Dead Zombies

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Originally Posted by Nymdok View Post
General Infected
Brain is the only vital. (Unliving 20, Has a Brain -5 = 15 sound about right?)
General Infected are extremely fragile, there's just a lot of them. I'd probably stay away from IT for them. Two pistol shots to the chest are enough to take them down.
In fact, I'd probably stay away from IT: Undead in general. The Left 4 Dead "zombies" seem to be more of the "crazy contagion" rather than "undead" variety. The fact firearms are extremely effective against them adds validity to this. If you do make your zombies undead, expect either a lot of high-caliber weapons or melee... or just a whole heck of a lot of headshots (assuming you don't give them IT: No Brain).

Quote:
Hunter
Whats the range on the Jump?
Ubiquitous' estimate seems about right here. Definately a flying tackle.

Quote:
Smoker
Last game I used Quick Contest of Strength with margin of victory moving the looser in the winner's desired direction. Is there a RAW way to handle this tug of war?
Not explicitly RAW, but RPK's Retractable Enhancement for Binding would work nicely.

Quote:
Boomer
I swear I've seen something on this, with Affliction (Enemy) or something to that effect.


For the others, the Witch and Tank definately have Injury Tolerance (Damage Reduction).
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Old 12-09-2009, 12:40 PM   #5
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Default Re: Left 4 Dead Zombies

I play too much L4D and L4D2.

Quote:
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General Infected
Brain is the only vital. (Unliving 20, Has a Brain -5 = 15 sound about right?)
I would skip Unliving; these guys go down faster than survivors, and bullets work just fine . . . whereas Unliving seriously gimps bullet damage (see p. B380).

I'd treat common infected like humans with reduced IQ and, to tell the truth, the Wild Animal meta-trait (p. B263). They also have the Doesn't Breathe and Injury Tolerance (No Vitals) advantages, and the Fragile (Unnatural) disadvantage. We're not given enough information to know about vulnerability to poison and disease, but Immunity to Metabolic Hazards could fit. As far as I can tell, they have to eat (people) and sleep (well, stand around stunned), they do feel pain (or at least recoil when hit), and they're entirely vulnerable to blunt trauma, bullets, decapitation, explosions, flame, etc. They would not have special abilities there.

Also, note that they aren't slow, but they are weak. Even someone as slight as Rochelle can slam three or four of them away at once. I'd lower their ST (and HP to go with it, since they blow apart easily), but leave Move alone.

Finally, they climb stupidly well. Give them all Climbing at 16+. Even Clinging, really.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nymdok View Post

Hunter
Whats the range on the Jump?
Standing broad jump is around 30 feet, so you'll want Super Jump. A good Versus player can jump up a lot farther with double-jumps and by jumping from high places. You should add Acrobatics and Jumping skills at 16+, and probably tack on the Catfall advantage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nymdok View Post

Smoker
Last game I used Quick Contest of Strength with margin of victory moving the looser in the winner's desired direction. Is there a RAW way to handle this tug of war?
Use the rules for a lariat on p. B411. Target the neck. The primary difference is that the lariat is a tongue, not a rope! I'd give the smoker ST useful only with this attack (via Accessibility); he always wins Contests of ST with survivors, yet does pathetic claw damage up close. Clearly, he isn't strong overall.

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Originally Posted by Nymdok View Post

Boomer
We had a thread about this somewhere already. My search fu is failing me. It would be simple enough to treat it as an Affliction that grants Enemy, or simply a horrid way to use Allies with Summonable

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Jockey
Not sure how to model the 'steering' ability or what mechanics to apply.
It isn't wrestling. How would wrestling explain forcing someone to walk, even if he wants to stand still, whilst controlling only his head and neck by sitting on his shoulders? I'd call it Mind Control with a big limitation, like "Only to control movement."
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Old 12-09-2009, 12:49 PM   #6
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Default Re: Left 4 Dead Zombies

Quote:
Originally Posted by SuedodeuS View Post
... If you do make your zombies undead, expect either a lot of high-caliber weapons or melee... or just a whole heck of a lot of headshots (assuming you don't give them IT: No Brain).

Ubiquitous' estimate seems about right here. Definately a flying tackle.

Not explicitly RAW, but RPK's Retractable Enhancement for Binding would work nicely.

I swear I've seen something on this, with Affliction (Enemy) or something to that effect.

For the others, the Witch and Tank definately have Injury Tolerance (Damage Reduction).
We went the 'Heck of a lot of Headshots' and Undead route. They're mostly a bunch of gun bunnies anyway :) They all have Rifle/Pistol/SMG/Shotgun skills in the 16-20 range and I've got the Basic Move tweaked to balance.

Agreed on Flying tackle. Now just to stat it up.

The boomers I think Ive got. As GM its alwyas up to me to decide who the infected attack anyway :) About the only questions I have with the boomers is how long do the effects last? Whats the SIze modifier, and do you think Fragile(Explosive) covers it (With damaged scaled down of course)?

The Tank Ill definately use, but the Witch is one I cant get my head around. I honestly cant figure out a reason for her to be in that game so I probably wont use her at all.

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Old 12-09-2009, 01:00 PM   #7
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Default Re: Left 4 Dead Zombies

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the Witch is one I cant get my head around. I honestly cant figure out a reason for her to be in that game so I probably wont use her at all.
She's the zombie equivalent of a posted minefield. Her job is to deny an area visibly and audibly. Placed in a chokepoint – like in a door the survivors must go through or on a bridge they must cross – she forces the survivors either to find another way or, if they can't, to deal with her. Dealing with her is a simple matter of one headshot, done right, but of course it's easy to do it wrong.

What's hard to model about the witch in GURPS terms is that a high-powered rifle hit to the head can't kill her in one shot, while a shotgun blast can. That requires sort of the opposite of an armor divisor, something that makes big attacks less likely to kill her than lots of small ones. Leaky IT (Damage Reduction) might do it . . . give her IT (DR) at some huge level and a rifle bullet will do 1 point while 9 shotgun pellets will do 9 points, which becomes 4 vs. 36 with the ×4 for the skull.
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:03 PM   #8
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Default Re: Left 4 Dead Zombies

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Leaky IT (Damage Reduction) might do it . . . give her IT (DR) at some huge level and a rifle bullet will do 1 point while 9 shotgun pellets will do 9 points, which becomes 4 vs. 36 with the ×4 for the skull.
Leaky IT? What is that?
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:05 PM   #9
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Default Re: Left 4 Dead Zombies

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I play too much L4D and L4D2.

....they aren't slow, but they are weak. Even someone as slight as Rochelle can slam three or four of them away at once. I'd lower their ST (and HP to go with it, since they blow apart easily), but leave Move alone.

Finally, they climb stupidly well. Give them all Climbing at 16+. Even Clinging, really.

Standing broad jump is around 30 feet, so you'll want Super Jump. A good Versus player can jump up a lot farther with double-jumps and by jumping from high places. You should add Acrobatics and Jumping skills at 16+, and probably tack on the Catfall advantage.

Use the rules for a lariat on p. B411. Target the neck. The primary difference is that the lariat is a tongue, not a rope! I'd give the smoker ST useful only with this attack (via Accessibility); he always wins Contests of ST with survivors, yet does pathetic claw damage up close. Clearly, he isn't strong overall.

We had a thread about this somewhere already. My search fu is failing me. It would be simple enough to treat it as an Affliction that grants Enemy, or simpy a horrid way to use Allies with Summonable

It isn't wrestling. How would wrestling explain forcing someone to walk, even if he wants to stand still, whilst controlling only his head and neck? I'd call it Mind Control with a big limitation, like "Only to control movement."
I found a thread here somewhere where you mentioned your love of the game. I am a recent but devout convert. Glad to hear your thoughts!

Climbing at some suitable level for the commons and Im thinking Clinging for the Hunters/Smokers that seem to be able to climb ANYWHERE. Acrobatics and Catfall are good ideas!

For the Jockeys, Im actually thinking its just a shift the center of gravity in one direection to make the opponent keep his balance. Ill allow the opponent to CHOOSE to fall instead of the contest. I'm still just not sure of whether it should be Zombie Sumo/Wrestling etc vs Opponent Strength (strong back means that the Zombie must move himself WAY off center while keeping human grappled to force the opponent off balance) or Zombie skill vs Opponent DX (Good reaction time and nimble foot work help keep human balanced without moving hexes.)

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Old 12-09-2009, 01:10 PM   #10
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Default Re: Left 4 Dead Zombies

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Originally Posted by Kromm View Post
She's the zombie equivalent of a posted minefield. Her job is to deny an area visibly and audibly. Placed in a chokepoint – like in a door the survivors must go through or on a bridge they must cross – she forces the survivors either to find another way or, if they can't, to deal with her. Dealing with her is a simple matter of one headshot, done right, but of course it's easy to do it wrong.

What's hard to model about the witch in GURPS terms is that a high-powered rifle hit to the head can't kill her in one shot, while a shotgun blast can. That requires sort of the opposite of an armor divisor, something that makes big attacks less likely to kill her than lots of small ones. Leaky IT (Damage Reduction) might do it . . . give her IT (DR) at some huge level and a rifle bullet will do 1 point while 9 shotgun pellets will do 9 points, which becomes 4 vs. 36 with the ×4 for the skull.
Done it wrong many times!

I see your point about her utility as a tactical device. I may have to reconsider her for this reason. That and the fact that the Guy trying to unleash the zombie virus in my game needs to be evil. Undead waif teenage children turned into zombies sure fits the bill!

Nymdok

p.s. 57 hours in the last 2 weeks! Thats a part time job! :)

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