Scope of Bestiary for GURPS 4e?

[thastygliax]

I'm currently reading GURPS Fantasy, and have seen references to GURPS Bestiary there and on the GURPS page, but neither of those sources gives any info on what its contents will be. (The main GURPS page doesn't even have a link to a Bestiary page yet, just a bullet item.)

My main question is, what is the scope of the 4e Bestiary? Given the move towards larger books for 4e, will it combine the 3e Bestiary, Fantasy Bestiary, and Space Bestiary? Or some subset of that vast range?

How many of the creatures in the 4e Basic Set, Fantasy, and Magic will be reprinted in the Bestiary? Or will we need to have all those books for completeness' sake?

Finally, any idea yet on the release date?

[tiger_in_mans_clothing]

I only hope they have material on creating believable eco-systems. It always annoyed me that one game was so unrealistic as having a large dragon living deep in an underground complex with stairs to small for the dragon to leave. Whet does the dragon live on? Why adventurers, of course. Or the epic: Blink dogs in room 17 and kobolds in room 18 (across the hall from each other). Wouldn't the Blink dogs just kill all the lesser monsters? They are good, after all.

Yeah, I want something about creating food chains and size of area to feed this or that predator.

GM rolls for random encounter: You are ambushed by 26 lions.
Player 1: Didn't we kill 18 lions just over the hill?
Player 2: And 21 lions just a couple miles before that?
GM: This is a different pride.
Player 3: But isn't that too many lions for such a small area? What are they all hunting?
GM: Hey! I'm the GM and the table says there are 3d10 lions so there are 3d10 lions.
Player 2: That's stupid.
GM: You don't like it go play GURPS.

[gojira]

Hmm, I'm going to weigh in here as well. Please take all of the following as constructive critisism.

Probably my worst ever gaming purchase was GURPS Beastiary 2nd ed. First, not a lot of beasts, period. Not even half the book, iirc. Second, cut and paste from GURPS Aliens and Supers. Thanks guys, I had those already. Third, sucky beasts. Snooflegator? Jackalope? Seriously guys, wtf? Fourth, more rules. Like GURPS needs this.

Ok, positive ideas for B4e:

1. MUCH more beasts. Fill the damn book up.

2. BETTER beasts. I suggest that you get a few more supplements and worlds out, then see what ideas you can generate from those. Having some specific worlds in mind might keep sucky ideas like "jackalope" out of B4e. I think "urban legend" is right out.

3. NO NEW RULES. Just stop already.

4. Organize by genre, geography, and threat level. The threat level is important, imho. In Dnd you can quickly size up a monster by checking it's level, in GURPS you have to be much more careful. Also, looking for low, med and high threat critters is a pain. Add a table in the back organized by threat level (oranized as mentioned, as well as one big list by power level) where I can find stuff more quickly.

5. Since GURPS is generic and universal, consider adding critters for other properties. Traveller, Hellboy, Transhuman Space, In Nomine. Not critters that would require a license, just "generic" stuff that would be useful.

Some generic genres:

• horror
• fantasy
• cyberpunk
• modern day (real world)
• time travel (more than just dinosaurs, a cave bear and a wooly mamoth. Try to add more, interesting time periods, and maybe different stages of developement for extra solar worlds too.)
• space - various tech levels too
• space-opera (some rehashed race from Aliens would be ok here)
• historical ... horror, fantasy, etc. Gimme critters from a few different timelines, but make it a complete list from each timeline.

Don't forget to go back to traditional sources (books, movies) for ideas. I don't want zombie fish. Include some stats for fish-men off the New England coast, dark things from the ocean depths, and other "atavisms". Plus stuff like nillishtic androids a la Blade Runner, stuff from Schismatrix, Bab5 etc.

[DoctorRomulus]

Preach it brother!! AMEN!!!

Originally Posted by gojira

Hmm, I'm going to weigh in here as well. Please take all of the following as constructive critisism.

EDIT: Trimmed overquoted stuff --AB

[thastygliax]

Originally Posted by gojira

Third, sucky beasts. Snooflegator? Jackalope? Seriously guys, wtf? [...] Having some specific worlds in mind might keep sucky ideas like "jackalope" out of B4e. I think "urban legend" is right out.

I'm not sure I'd ever use them in a game, but those "urban legends" are perfectly fine material for some games (light-hearted tabloid investigation, anyone?). I'd much prefer meatier cryptozoology, myself, like the treatment of the Jersey Devil and Mothman in GURPS Monsters.

[etherflyer]

Originally Posted by tiger_in_mans_clothing

I only hope they have material on creating believable eco-systems.

Seconded. Something like the ecological pyramid from 2300 would work well...

[Taliesin]

Well, after the GURPS beastiary I never bothered to buy the fantasy or space ones. I started with Man to Man and intended to buy every GURPS book as they came out (I was a real Fantasy Trip fanatic) but after several of the beginning books (esp the beastairy) were poorly executed I became very choosy.
How can the same game line that produced GURPS Japan and Gurps Celtic Myth produce such terrible books I will never understand. Just like this 4e blurb, "The physical quality of the line took a big jump with the Fourth Edition. All books now on the schedule (and we're scheduling three years ahead) will be hardcover, with full-color interiors. And we won't accept any art that's not gorgeous" (Bold face mine) Sorry, guys. You've already dropped the ball big time on this one and you've only got four books out. Maybe someone different should be selected to approve the artwork. Someone with different taste.

[Hex]

gojira said a mouthful, but I tend to agree. There are tons of beasts that could be done, so do it right. Even consider doing a Beastiary II, III. If done right I'd buy the books to round out any of my campaigns.

[Hobbes]

All I'd like to see in Beastiary is an intensive, comprehensive survey of Earth creatures from dinosaurs to modern, including ecology. Save Fantasy and Space Beastiary for their own books, as there are nearly endless supplies of those types of creatures.

[Luther]

Originally Posted by Taliesin

Just like this 4e blurb, "The physical quality of the line took a big jump with the Fourth Edition. All books now on the schedule (and we're scheduling three years ahead) will be hardcover, with full-color interiors. And we won't accept any art that's not gorgeous" (Bold face mine) Sorry, guys. You've already dropped the ball big time on this one and you've only got four books out. Maybe someone different should be selected to approve the artwork. Someone with different taste.

I agree. Sadly.