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Old 11-08-2017, 01:44 PM   #21
Kfireblade
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Default Re: Making more ammo stuck on a low tech world.

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Originally Posted by acrosome View Post
Out of curiosity, what is the exact TL8 weapon that this character is trying to feed? It will be a lot easier if it's a shotgun, frex, and some weapons might actually tolerate black powder as a propellant very well, especially if corned. Whereas e.g. an M16 absolutely will not...
I am, in fact, needing to make more ammo for M16's.
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Old 11-08-2017, 02:04 PM   #22
sir_pudding
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Default Re: Making more ammo stuck on a low tech world.

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Originally Posted by Kfireblade View Post
I am, in fact, needing to make more ammo for M16's.
Well the M855 might be one of the hardest rounds to do this with, but it is far from impossible. It mostly means that your quality control is very important.

As others have said, industrial processes like the Haber process are only needed for industrial production. You can make everything you need with lab bench scale chemistry for cottage production.
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Old 11-08-2017, 02:21 PM   #23
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Default Re: Making more ammo stuck on a low tech world.

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Originally Posted by sir_pudding View Post
Well the M855 might be one of the hardest rounds to do this with, but it is far from impossible. It mostly means that your quality control is very important.

As others have said, industrial processes like the Haber process are only needed for industrial production. You can make everything you need with lab bench scale chemistry for cottage production.
Though if you're planning to conquer a low tech world, building a fertilizer plant might be a good investment anyway.
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Old 11-08-2017, 02:23 PM   #24
Kfireblade
 
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Default Re: Making more ammo stuck on a low tech world.

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Originally Posted by sir_pudding View Post
Well the M855 might be one of the hardest rounds to do this with, but it is far from impossible. It mostly means that your quality control is very important.

As others have said, industrial processes like the Haber process are only needed for industrial production. You can make everything you need with lab bench scale chemistry for cottage production.
well, sounds like as long as I get the supplies I can start production in limited quantities. Now, given the time and resources what would it take to produce ammo on a large scale?
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Old 11-08-2017, 02:27 PM   #25
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Default Re: Making more ammo stuck on a low tech world.

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Originally Posted by Kfireblade View Post
well, sounds like as long as I get the supplies I can start production in limited quantities. Now, given the time and resources what would it take to produce ammo on a large scale?
See Building Up Local Technology p. B513.
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Old 11-08-2017, 02:31 PM   #26
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Default Re: Making more ammo stuck on a low tech world.

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Originally Posted by sir_pudding View Post
See Building Up Local Technology p. B513.
Yeah, if you have industrial scale production of nitrates and refined metal you're well on the way to TL 6.
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Old 11-08-2017, 05:57 PM   #27
mlangsdorf
 
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Default Re: Making more ammo stuck on a low tech world.

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Originally Posted by Kfireblade View Post
well, sounds like as long as I get the supplies I can start production in limited quantities. Now, given the time and resources what would it take to produce ammo on a large scale?
You need a chemistry plant to make your nitrates and such, and then eventually turn them into nitrocellulose and mercury primers. The first industrial plants for producing ammonia and nitric acid look like they took 1-2 years to build in the early 1900s.

You're also going to need a factory to make bullets. Again, you're probably going to spend 1-2 years just building the physical plant.

You're going to spend a couple of years training the machinists and chemists necessary build all the parts you're going to need to replicate all your machines so they can build and run the chemistry plant and factory.

Like Sir_Pudding alludes to with the book reference, this is a multi-decade process. Your PC may know how to do all of this stuff, but to industrialize it, you've got to pass that knowledge on to a lot of different people and that takes a lot of time and effort.

You may want to scale back your goals: you can build a cartridge blackpowder repeating rifle, and while it's not as amazing as an M-16, it's better than any hand weapon available at TL4-TL5. Black powder mills aren't easy to build either, but it's somewhat less work than a smokeless powder plant.
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Old 11-08-2017, 06:06 PM   #28
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Default Re: Making more ammo stuck on a low tech world.

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Originally Posted by mlangsdorf View Post
You may want to scale back your goals: you can build a cartridge blackpowder repeating rifle, and while it's not as amazing as an M-16, it's better than any hand weapon available at TL4-TL5. Black powder mills aren't easy to build either, but it's somewhat less work than a smokeless powder plant.
And if you're in a TL4+ low tech world, you can hire locals to do it without needing to retrain them.

Downgearing is a must in most scenarios where you want to provide broad uplift rather than just keep your personal fancy gear serviceable.
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Old 11-08-2017, 06:11 PM   #29
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Default Re: Making more ammo stuck on a low tech world.

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Originally Posted by mlangsdorf View Post
You may want to scale back your goals: you can build a cartridge blackpowder repeating rifle, and while it's not as amazing as an M-16, it's better than any hand weapon available at TL4-TL5. Black powder mills aren't easy to build either, but it's somewhat less work than a smokeless powder plant.
Aren't repeating cartridge rifles TL5?

They should already have the powder mills anyway.
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Old 11-08-2017, 06:20 PM   #30
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Default Re: Making more ammo stuck on a low tech world.

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Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth View Post
And if you're in a TL4+ low tech world, you can hire locals to do it without needing to retrain them.
No you can't. The only way you don't need to retrain them is if they are already trained. However, the amount of training required may be modest.
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Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth View Post
Downgearing is a must in most scenarios where you want to provide broad uplift rather than just keep your personal fancy gear serviceable.
Though not always. Sometimes the higher tech option is just plain better and was only not used at lower tech because they didn't come up with it (either because it requires concepts they were lacking, or because they just didn't think of it). Guns mostly aren't in that category, though; an awful lot the concerns have to do with purity and tolerances.
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