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Old 08-26-2017, 03:17 PM   #31
philreed
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Default Re: The Dungeon Fantasy box set is great! But now I hunger for more...

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Originally Posted by Ulairi View Post
I'm going to pre-order an extra box set at my FLGS. I'd suggest that's where we purchase gifts/extra copies. That way the intermediaries see the demand and order more.
Sales at your local game store will likely have a stronger impact than any purchases online. Online sales are near-invisible for the local game stores out there.

And, better still, take the game after you buy it at your local shop and ask if you can play in the store. Then ever more people get a look at the game.
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Old 08-26-2017, 04:16 PM   #32
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Default Re: The Dungeon Fantasy box set is great! But now I hunger for more...

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If all of the copies sell out before the end of the year, well, let me just be the first to say that I'll do all I can to push a sci-fi boxed set onto our schedule and make it happen.
Surprised to hear given my guess is if DFRPG sells well, then there will be more DFRPG. That would fill up the schedule again.
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Old 08-26-2017, 04:37 PM   #33
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Default Re: The Dungeon Fantasy box set is great! But now I hunger for more...

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Hard core sir.




And that DS9 was completely redone as a response to B5? DS9 was originally supposed to the Voyager series, but when they heard that B5 was being made Star Trek decided to get the jump on it and dusted off their other idea and rushed it to press.
Worse than that, Paramount "heard" about B5 because Straczynski (the show's creator) shopped the concept around to many studios, including Paramount. And then had to make changes so people wouldn't accuse him of stealing from DS9. Mimbari were originally to be an androgynous shape-shifting race; sound familiar?
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Old 08-26-2017, 06:48 PM   #34
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Default Re: The Dungeon Fantasy box set is great! But now I hunger for more...

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The problem with that is that those are some vastly different sub-genre's to support. They vary drastically on the realism slider, on the power level slider, on the "weird powers" slider, importance of Space Battles, and even on the technology slider. Star Wars dials most of those up to 11, while Star Trek falls somewhere in the middle, and Battlestar Galactica dials them down to 2-3. I don't think you can capture all of that in a book that's anything like Dungeon Fantasy or Monster Hunters which removes the toolkit and provides a defined genre to play in. Ultimately, that's the big failing of the idea of a "Space Opera" box set, because you either need to make it so broad that it's still a tool kit - and thus fails to do the simplification that makes the Dungeon Fantasy RPG Box a good idea - or you have to narrow it down and annoy some people. I'd much rather see something like a Tales of the Solar Patrol box set, as that would at least narrow the subject down to something that can be played right out of the box.
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I'd disagree here, actually. I think there's a bit less distance between the genres than is usually perceived.

<snip a lot of stuff I agree with.>

And yet, I'd argue that Star Wars is the middle ground, say at about an 8 on the dial, Star Trek is a 9, and Galactica (original, not the really lousy new series (great graphics, terrible story)) is maybe a 7.5.

Buck Rogers is somewhere in between them.

All the rest is cosmetic, or far enough below the resolution of mechanics that they may as well be cosmetic.

I'll also note that to most people outside of these forums, Star Wars/Trek pretty well define the middle point of space science fiction.
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Old 08-26-2017, 11:48 PM   #35
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Default Re: The Dungeon Fantasy box set is great! But now I hunger for more...

Between Paizo's new d20-based Starfinder, Modiphius' imminent Star Trek Adventures, and Pinnacle's upcoming Flash Gordon license for the Savage Worlds system, not to mention ongoing Star Wars furor, that segment of the (already small) RPG market is about to get rather crowded.

Among such heavy-weight established systems and settings, a generic space boxed set would have to sell itself pretty hard. Which is certainly possible, but still a big gamble.

P.S. Didn't I also hear about an Expanse RPG in development?
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Old 08-27-2017, 01:08 AM   #36
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Default Re: The Dungeon Fantasy box set is great! But now I hunger for more...

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I'll also note that to most people outside of these forums, Star Wars/Trek pretty well define the middle point of space science fiction.
I think most people (at least, most who would even consider buying a SF RPG box set) are at least aware of a few mainstream examples near each extreme: Star Wars and Star Trek on one end, 2001 and The Martian on the other. A lot of them may be largely unaware that there's a full spectrum in between, and examples outside of those bounds.
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Old 08-27-2017, 01:24 AM   #37
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Default Re: The Dungeon Fantasy box set is great! But now I hunger for more...

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Monster Hunters is another excellent choice with a lot of potential. I'm not sure it's the best choice, monster hunting and dealing with the paranormal weirdness is certainly something that still lives heavily in the zeitgeist.

I'd love to see a Space Opera. On the one hand now would be the perfect time to do a Traveller box set - if only the license weren't lapsed. On the other hand, a more galaxy spanning high-tech space opera, with blasters and force fields, bug eyed monsters and some interesting alien races would be really nice to see.


I mentioned the After the End/Reign of Steel crossover in the other thread. I think it has a lot of potential, setting it in the mid-west somewhere and leaving the RoS as a bit of mystical backdrop that can be explored with the RoS expansion if desired (and, you know, planning an actual RoS expansion). I also mentioned that you could carve out some other good niches in the RoS, which would make great additional box sets. A Cyberpunk Box Set with a RoS backdrop in some of the Asian, Russian, and American cities that have been left partially intact by the various zoneminds. And, of course, you can have an ultimate Robot Hunters Box Set where the goal is to wage war against the robots.

Another interesting niche you could carve, depending on how much you want to bend the RoS timeline and world, is a Mars Colony Wars. I'd set it in the RoS timeline as a loose backdrop, but any sufficient disaster to destroy Earth civilization would work (nanovirus plague, super-volcano eruptions, asteroid impact, etc).

Before the rise of the machines some self-sufficient colonies had been planted on Mars by America, Europe, China, and Russia. Then the awakening happened and the colonies are completely cut off, but for various reasons their computers are not affected (time lag delay prevented the original awakened zonemind from infecting the Mars ones, they caught the infection in time and shut down their megacomputers, whatever). Now you have four vying powers on a Mars they need to explore and conquer, either working together or fighting one another. The zoneminds are too worried about fighting each other to worry about Mars, and the colonies are completely cut off so they are effectively on their own.
This would be fantastic. Reign of Steel could easily support a few flavours of After the End plus Cyberpunk, plus, like Eric points out, an early space exporation, colonist survival, politico-military intrigue. With strong visuals/art, this could be a winner.

Space Opera is also a fairly popular genre but unlike Dungeonn Fantasy, it needs a setting to hold together. Of the options, it might require the most work.

Four-colour Super is currently an obvious pop culture darling. Its setting requirement is very low and it has fairly well understood tropes and strong, various distinctions between different character types. It is also a genre where the GURPS rules clearly underperform, which is either a barrier or an opportunity.

Monster Hunters is already well covered and setting requirements can also be fairly low. I suspect of the lot, it would require the least amount of work. It is also the genre that interest me the least.

In order of interest, (for me) it would be a very close call between Super, RoS/AtE and Space with Monster Hunters clearly behind by a wide margin.
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Old 08-27-2017, 02:20 AM   #38
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Default Re: The Dungeon Fantasy box set is great! But now I hunger for more...

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Four-colour Super is currently an obvious pop culture darling. Its setting requirement is very low and it has fairly well understood tropes and strong, various distinctions between different character types. It is also a genre where the GURPS rules clearly underperform, which is either a barrier or an opportunity.
In what way does gurps supers clearly underperform?

I just finished running a gurps supers/Reign of Steel crossover with psionic aliens added to the mix as well and it all seemed to work fine. PC point value was around the 700-800 point mark. Is it higher values where the problems creep in?
I am looking at adding an extra chapter to the campaign that will see the PCs get to 1000+ points so I would like to know if there is anything I should be aware of.
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Old 08-27-2017, 02:47 AM   #39
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Default Re: The Dungeon Fantasy box set is great! But now I hunger for more...

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In what way does gurps supers clearly underperform?

I just finished running a gurps supers/Reign of Steel crossover with psionic aliens added to the mix as well and it all seemed to work fine. PC point value was around the 700-800 point mark. Is it higher values where the problems creep in?
I am looking at adding an extra chapter to the campaign that will see the PCs get to 1000+ points so I would like to know if there is anything I should be aware of.
Super strength to match up with the expectations of a "brick" type super costs more than other powers of comparable utility. A lot more. Even with the Super Strength Enhancement kludge it doesn't really get affordable.

Me, I would reprice ST's _base_ cost to 1/level for Supers genre treatment, especially four-color.
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Old 08-27-2017, 02:53 AM   #40
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Default Re: The Dungeon Fantasy box set is great! But now I hunger for more...

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In what way does gurps supers clearly underperform?
The GM has to take a much heavier hand in what abilities to allow into the game, and he must know the game intimately. Even then there are some abilities, or combinations of abilities, that are just vastly underpriced when compared to other abilities.

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Me, I would reprice ST's _base_ cost to 1/level for Supers genre treatment, especially four-color.
I'm not sure I'd got that far, or else everybody will wind up with ST 20 or 30 (though that does almost fit some comic books). I'd probably do a sliding scale or just put a cap on after which it becomes drastically cheaper (perhaps 1/level).
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