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Old 07-10-2017, 08:32 AM   #11
Ulzgoroth
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Default Re: Shields, explosions, area effects, cones and large area attacks

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Originally Posted by evileeyore View Post
I allow a Dodge and Drop and a Block (and foregoing any further defenses for the turn), and if both are successful then the Character managed to position themselves behind their shield to protect against non-explosive 'expanding' Area attacks.
Why not against explosive ones? Cover works against explosions.
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Old 07-10-2017, 08:57 AM   #12
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Default Re: Shields, explosions, area effects, cones and large area attacks

I think I would allow a Block roll to add the shields DR and some of it's HP to the DR against the attack.
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Old 07-10-2017, 09:23 AM   #13
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Default Re: Shields, explosions, area effects, cones and large area attacks

As written, large-area attacks are resisted by the average of the target's torso armor, and their lowest DR location (usually the face) (B400).

I would allow a successful Block to substitute the shield's Cover DR (B484) for the lowest DR location.
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Old 07-10-2017, 11:44 AM   #14
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Default Re: Shields, explosions, area effects, cones and large area attacks

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Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth View Post
I don't believe they ever bothered to actually publish rules for using a shield as cover, unfortunately.

But yes, it's logically possible with a large enough shield and the right positioning.
Maybe something like this will eventually emerge in Pyramid :)
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Old 07-10-2017, 12:08 PM   #15
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Default Re: Shields, explosions, area effects, cones and large area attacks

You should check out T-bone's games diner. I think that's where I saw optionalhttp://www.gamesdiner.com/rules-nugg...elds-and-cover shield rules.
Something in pyramid #34 (by Tbone) and Low Tech also.
My phone isn't as good at running searches as my netbook :(
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Old 07-10-2017, 12:22 PM   #16
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Default Re: Shields, explosions, area effects, cones and large area attacks

However this gets resolved, I could see the results as a candidate for a shield-based technique (and consequently a power-up for DF).
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Old 07-10-2017, 12:25 PM   #17
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Default Re: Shields, explosions, area effects, cones and large area attacks

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Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth View Post
Why not against explosive ones? Cover works against explosions.
I allow it fine against fragments, but not against the initial over-pressure of the explosion.

I've toyed with the idea of allowing it to treat the character as though they were 1 yard further out... which combined with a Dodge and Drop/Dive For Cover might put them "outside" the blast. But I've only toyed with it. Also, I don't require them to drop to Prone, I allow them to drop to Kneeling.
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Old 07-10-2017, 12:34 PM   #18
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Default Re: Shields, explosions, area effects, cones and large area attacks

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Originally Posted by evileeyore View Post
I allow it fine against fragments, but not against the initial over-pressure of the explosion.

I've toyed with the idea of allowing it to treat the character as though they were 1 yard further out... which combined with a Dodge and Drop/Dive For Cover might put them "outside" the blast. But I've only toyed with it. Also, I don't require them to drop to Prone, I allow them to drop to Kneeling.
Again, cover (and armor) does work against explosions as the general GURPS rule.
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Old 07-10-2017, 01:24 PM   #19
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Default Re: Shields, explosions, area effects, cones and large area attacks

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Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth View Post
Again, cover (and armor) does work against explosions as the general GURPS rule.
And the standard "dive for cover" / "dodge and drop" rule seems to work just as well for hiding behind your shield. The diving for cover example is "like a trench" as the sort of cover you might dive for that's a step away, but it's hardly exclusive to slit trenches. And the shield is even closer than one step. "Hiding behind my shield" is just fluff text for why you get the Dodge bonus.

Cover also reduces damage from large-area injury by shielding entire hit locations behind the cover, which applies to area and cone attacks (and even has dragon's breath cited as an example).

It's not obvious to me that a new rule is even needed; Basic seems to cover (er...) the situation, even though it doesn't spend a lot of time detailing how the rules apply with medieval equipment to dragon attacks. The wording has the fairly natural default assumption that it's most relevant in a modern-day setting full of hand grenades and artillery.

Per the existing dive-for-cover rule, the cover DR itself doesn't apply to the attack that caused you to hide, though it does to subsequent attacks. You still get the bonus to Dodge for avoiding the attack, but some people will probably be unhappy about applying this clause.

Note that since the shield-bearer gets the DB as a bonus to all his Active Defense rolls, that includes the Dodge that's the dodge-and-drop, so the shield-bearer will in fact be better at hiding from area attacks than equally dodgy people without shields. (I point this out in anticipation of player complaints, as presumably they're looking for a special bonus just for their character, not a reason to justify doing something anyone could do.)

The Overpenetration rule explicitly applies to shields even if you're not tracking damage to shields. (Cover DR is DR + HP / 4, as for any Homogeneous object).

Also note that cover (including shields) counts against the calculations for large-area attacks.
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Old 07-10-2017, 01:36 PM   #20
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Default Re: Shields, explosions, area effects, cones and large area attacks

I'm not convinced you can dive behind a shield that you are holding or wearing.

It might be a reasonable generalization, but it's not really a one-to-one match...
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