Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-03-2017, 11:45 AM   #1
Kelly Pedersen
 
Kelly Pedersen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Saskatoon, SK, Canada
Default Detect Advantage: Transient or Switchable?

I was building an ability using Detect, and it occurred to me that I'm not sure whether Detect is normally transient (that is, it works once when activated, does its thing, and turns off on its own) or switchable (meaning, its activated by the user, and stays on until they choose to turn it off again).

I think the description in Basic leans more towards transient - you get one Sense roll, which potentially finds whatever, then turns off. If you want to keep sensing stuff, you have to keep making new rolls every turn. But I could see an argument to be made for switchable, allowing you to make one Sense roll when you first turn Detect on, and then, as long as you keep concentrating, you can keep detecting things inside your range, "noticing" them whenever they come within the range established by your first Sense roll.

What do people think? Is Detect transient or switchable by default? And if it's transient, what would be the appropriate value of an enhancement to make it switchable? I'm thinking +50%, personally, but that's just a hunch.
Kelly Pedersen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2017, 12:43 PM   #2
Imion
 
Imion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Germany
Default Re: Detect Advantage: Transient or Switchable?

Quote:
But I could see an argument to be made for switchable, allowing you to make one Sense roll when you first turn Detect on, and then, as long as you keep concentrating, you can keep detecting things inside your range, "noticing" them whenever they come within the range established by your first Sense roll.
I think vanilla Detect is more akin to a single sonar 'ping'.

Quote:
And if it's transient, what would be the appropriate value of an enhancement to make it switchable?
Reflexive, +40% with Switchable, +10% for +44%, perhaps?
__________________
Feel free to add 'IMO' where appropriate.
Imion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2017, 12:46 PM   #3
Refplace
 
Refplace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Yukon, OK
Default Re: Detect Advantage: Transient or Switchable?

I think its Transient but you can keep it up with concentration so a series of transient like if your trying to locate something.
Reflexive is good for making it more continuous since it becomes self activating.
__________________
Looking for group in my area
REFPLace GURPS Landing Page
My List of GURPS You Tube videos (plus a few other useful items)
Pyramid Writers Group Pt II
Refplace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2017, 12:58 PM   #4
Donny Brook
 
Donny Brook's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Default Re: Detect Advantage: Transient or Switchable?

As written, it's transient (and pretty useless).
Donny Brook is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2017, 03:01 PM   #5
Kelly Pedersen
 
Kelly Pedersen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Saskatoon, SK, Canada
Default Re: Detect Advantage: Transient or Switchable?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Imion View Post
Reflexive, +40% with Switchable, +10% for +44%, perhaps?
What's the logic for Switchable, here? I can see Reflexive (though I'd argue that a switchable Detect wouldn't necessarily have to have Reflexive's "activate upon stimulus" element), but I don't see what Switchable on it is "turning off"?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Refplace View Post
I think its Transient but you can keep it up with concentration so a series of transient like if your trying to locate something.
Reflexive is good for making it more continuous since it becomes self activating.
Would you say you still have to make Sense rolls every turn with Reflexive on Detect, though?
Kelly Pedersen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2017, 03:11 PM   #6
Refplace
 
Refplace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Yukon, OK
Default Re: Detect Advantage: Transient or Switchable?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen View Post
What's the logic for Switchable, here? I can see Reflexive (though I'd argue that a switchable Detect wouldn't necessarily have to have Reflexive's "activate upon stimulus" element), but I don't see what Switchable on it is "turning off"?



Would you say you still have to make Sense rolls every turn with Reflexive on Detect, though?
I don't see any logic for Switchable myself, clearly (IMO) Detect is already Switchable.
As to having to make Sense rolls it depends on what your doing. As long as you maintain Concentration and the subject does not hide or somehow conceal itself normal Detect wont require a new Sense Roll.
Reflexive just takes care of the Concentrate/Ready Requirement such that it is a Free Action to keep an eye on something.
If looking for something new than I would require a new Sense roll.
Reading Reflexive (Powers, p. 109) helps here as it is goes into detail in working specifically with Detect.
__________________
Looking for group in my area
REFPLace GURPS Landing Page
My List of GURPS You Tube videos (plus a few other useful items)
Pyramid Writers Group Pt II
Refplace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2017, 03:21 PM   #7
Kelly Pedersen
 
Kelly Pedersen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Saskatoon, SK, Canada
Default Re: Detect Advantage: Transient or Switchable?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Refplace View Post
As to having to make Sense rolls it depends on what your doing. As long as you maintain Concentration and the subject does not hide or somehow conceal itself normal Detect wont require a new Sense Roll.
What about new subjects, though? I'm picturing someone slowly (because they can only move 1 yard at a time while Concentrating) moving around while maintaining the Detect. Say they made their original Sense roll by 5 (thus, they could sense something out to 15 yards, using standard range penalties), and something within the ambit of their Detect enters their range. Do they automatically sense it?

For that matter, Detect actually says you sense the "nearest" source of the substance, not all sources. It's been clarified that you can "screen out" sources you already know about or that fall below your chosen significance threshold (so Detect Life isn't actually useless, always detecting yourself or the bacteria on your skin), but once you've activated Detect, can you continue to sit there and Concentrate, each second finding another source? Or do you have to keep re-rolling Sense rolls every second, each time specifying that you're ruling out all the sources you've already discovered?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Refplace
Reflexive just takes care of the Concentrate/Ready Requirement such that it is a Free Action to keep an eye on something.
Reflexive, though, just says that it eliminates the Concentrate requirement to activate Detect. That's what this all hinges on - does Detect require one action to activate, and then remain on while you concentrate (switchable)? Or does it require repeated activations (transient)?
Kelly Pedersen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2017, 04:25 PM   #8
Refplace
 
Refplace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Yukon, OK
Default Re: Detect Advantage: Transient or Switchable?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen View Post
What about new subjects, though? I'm picturing someone slowly (because they can only move 1 yard at a time while Concentrating) moving around while maintaining the Detect. Say they made their original Sense roll by 5 (thus, they could sense something out to 15 yards, using standard range penalties), and something within the ambit of their Detect enters their range. Do they automatically sense it?
I would require a new Sense/Per roll each time looking for something new or as 'visibility' changes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen View Post
Reflexive, though, just says that it eliminates the Concentrate requirement to activate Detect. That's what this all hinges on - does Detect require one action to activate, and then remain on while you concentrate (switchable)? Or does it require repeated activations (transient)?
The second part of Reflexive comes into play here where it acts as a Level of Reduced Time. So instead of Concentrating to look for new things you can do so with a Free Action.
I pretty much consider Reflexive to turn Detect into a normal passive sense like vision or Hearing (Though its still a Vague sense, per Powers: Enhanced Senses.
__________________
Looking for group in my area
REFPLace GURPS Landing Page
My List of GURPS You Tube videos (plus a few other useful items)
Pyramid Writers Group Pt II
Refplace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2017, 04:53 PM   #9
Imion
 
Imion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Germany
Default Re: Detect Advantage: Transient or Switchable?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen View Post
What's the logic for Switchable, here? I can see Reflexive (though I'd argue that a switchable Detect wouldn't necessarily have to have Reflexive's "activate upon stimulus" element), but I don't see what Switchable on it is "turning off"?(...)
The way I see it is that Detect with Reflexive scans each and every round automatically, thus is quasi always on. With Switchable you can deactivate that automatic scanning. As you wanted to 'activate' your ability, it seemed like a sensible choice.

EDIT: Switchable, in this case, is meant to modify Reflexive, not Detect itself, if that is what bothers you.
__________________
Feel free to add 'IMO' where appropriate.

Last edited by Imion; 05-03-2017 at 05:08 PM.
Imion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2017, 05:22 PM   #10
Refplace
 
Refplace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Yukon, OK
Default Re: Detect Advantage: Transient or Switchable?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Imion View Post

EDIT: Switchable, in this case, is meant to modify Reflexive, not Detect itself, if that is what bothers you.
Go with Selectivity than as that is specifically what it is for.
__________________
Looking for group in my area
REFPLace GURPS Landing Page
My List of GURPS You Tube videos (plus a few other useful items)
Pyramid Writers Group Pt II
Refplace is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:52 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.