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Old 03-29-2017, 04:56 PM   #11
Michael Thayne
 
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Default Re: [High-Tech] Military Equipment: Global War on Terror edition

Another aircraft:

AC-130 Gunship

3e stats for this can be found in GURPS Special Ops. Converting to 4e requires some guess work, but I think we're looking at something like:

ST/HP: 182
Hnd/SR: +1/3
HT: 11f
Move: 3/180
SM: +7
Occ: 13SP
DR: 3
Range: 2,530
Loc.: g3WWi
Stall: 58

Weapons include a howitzer, similar to the RIA M2A1 in High-Tech. I've heard conflicting things about the exact specifications of the AC-130's howitzer, High-Tech seems to think it's a shortened version, but Wikipedia suggests a longer gun. As a GM, I'd just use the RIA M2A1 as-written at least until I found better information.

Other weapons include M61 autocannons and the Bofors M2A1 40mm cannon. The latter has stats in Special Ops, which converted to 4e come out as something like Dmg. 6d6 (0.5) p++ + linked 3d [4d] cr ex, Acc 5, Range 3,000/9,600, RoF 2, Rcl 2. Also in Special Ops is the GE GAU-12/U Equalizer, 25137mm cannon. Converted to 4e, it would have something like Dmg. 6d4 (0.5) pi++ + linked 1d [2d] crushing explosive, Acc 5, Range 2,500 / 7,500, Rof 30, Rcl 2.
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Old 03-29-2017, 04:57 PM   #12
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Default Re: [High-Tech] Military Equipment: Global War on Terror edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Thayne View Post
I think improved accuracy was the main point in both cases, I don't know if reliability was improved as well.
Improved accuracy or a longer effective engagement range being a design goal unfortunately doesn't suffice to give a weapon Fine (Accurate) in GURPS terms. The range of Acc numbers for real weapons is not wide and the breakpoints aren't granular enough to differentiate between many weapons that demonstratably have different performance envelopes in the real world.

Consider that Acc 4 covers anything from the MP5 through a wide variety of carbines in 5.56x45mm/.223 Remington, the AKM rifle and the SKS, the Barrett REC7 carbine in 6.8mm or the FN SCAR-H in 7.62x51mm in any barrel length shorter than 19.7-inch*. Even pistols like the USP Match in 9x19mm or an AMT Hardballer Longslide in .45 ACP have functionally the same Acc bonus when held in two hands (Braced) as a high-end carbine in a military rifle chambering fired from the shoulder.

Acc 5 includes anything from budget .30-30 deer rifles, the Vietnam-era M16 firing M193 5.56x45mm and the RPK in 7.62x39mm up to such high-end, accurate and long ranged rifles as the G36, L86A2 Light Support Weapon, Steyr AUG with 24-inch barrel, Remington Model 700 in .308, FN BAR Magnum in .300 Win Mag and the FN SCAR, both in the 5.56x45mm Mk 16 MOD 0 Sniper Variant (18" barrel) and the 7.62x51mm Mk 17 MOD 0 SV (19.7" barrel).

Acc 6 is basically all sniper rifles.

*I'll admit I can't figure out how the 16-inch barrel SCAR-H in 7.62x51mm rates only Acc 4 while GURPS gives the HK33 and HK93A2 in 5.56x45mm Acc 5 despite the shorter 15.4-inch and 16.25-inch barrels and less powerful, flat-shooting and long-ranged round.
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Last edited by Icelander; 03-29-2017 at 05:07 PM.
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Old 03-29-2017, 04:59 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Varyon View Post
Using Spaceships, the A-10 Thunderbolt's weight is on the low end of SM +5, but too heavy to count as SM +4 (it's roughly 10 tons empty, which is SM +4, but Spaceships vessels are calculated based on loaded weight, which for the A-10 apparently can range from around 15 tons to 20 tons; nominal weight for SM +5 is 30 tons). Note being streamlined means it's targeted as SM +4 when targeted from the front or the back, SM +5 otherwise. SM +5 implies ST/HP 200, although the lower weight of the A-10 might justify around 160 (HP is higher than you've calculated because Spaceships uses a multiplier roughly halfway between Unliving and Homogenous; your number matches better with existing examples, so just go with that). It apparently only has a single armor system, but that's all you need for a streamlined craft anyway. Titanium implies Light Alloy (DR 15, although it's concentrated so might justify a higher DR over less area), although Metallic Laminate may also be an option (DR 20). Hnd/SR is nominally -1/3 (TL 8 is -1, otherwise it would be 0/4), but the thrust/weight ratio (which apparently ends up giving you acceleration in G's) is low enough for -1, for -2/2. Being winged and streamlined* means its atmospheric Hnd/SR (which is all that matters) is actually 2/3, however (+4 Hnd, +1 SR).

*Its low top speed (439 mph) implies less streamlining than nominal Streamlined (which would have a top speed of 1500 mph), but more than nominal Unstreamlined (which would have a top speed of 150 mph).
I'm not really using Spaceships at all here on the grounds that existing published stats for vehicles don't. Instead, they seem to go by length.
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Old 03-29-2017, 05:02 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Icelander View Post
Improved accuracy or a longer effective engagement range being a design goal unfortunately doesn't suffice to give a weapon Fine (Accurate) in GURPS terms. The range of Acc numbers for real weapons is not wide and the breakpoints aren't granular enough to differentiate between many weapons that demonstratably have different performance envelopes in the real world.

Consider that Acc 4 covers anything from the MP5 through a wide variety of carbines in 5.56x45mm/.223 Remington, the AKM rifle and the SKS, the Barrett REC7 carbine in 6.8mm or the FN SCAR-H in 7.62x51mm in any barrel length shorter than 19.7-inch*. Even pistols like the USP Match in 9x19mm or an AMT Hardballer Longslide in .45 ACP have functionally the same Acc bonus when held in two hands (Braced) as a high-end carbine in a military rifle chambering fired from the shoulder.

Acc 5 includes anything from budget .30-30 deer rifles, the Vietnam-era M16 firing M193 5.56x45mm and the RPK in 7.62x39mm up to such high-end, accurate and long ranged rifles as the G36, L86A2 Light Support Weapon, Steyr AUG with 24-inch barrel, Remington Model 700 in .308, FN BAR Magnum in .300 Win Mag and the FN SCAR, both in the 5.56x45mm Mk 16 MOD 0 Sniper Variant (18" barrel) and the 7.62x51mm Mk 17 MOD 0 SV (19.7" barrel).

Acc 6 is basically all sniper rifles.

*I'll admit I can't figure out how the 16-inch barrel SCAR-H in 7.62x51mm rates only Acc 4 while GURPS gives the HK33 in 5.56x45mm Acc 5 despite the shorter 15.4-inch barrel and less powerful, flat-shooting and long-ranged round.
Good point(s). It's possible they're essentially normal M16s at the level of granularity GURPS accounts for.
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Old 03-29-2017, 05:14 PM   #15
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Default Re: [High-Tech] Military Equipment: Global War on Terror edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Thayne View Post
Good point(s). It's possible they're essentially normal M16s at the level of granularity GURPS accounts for.
At the very least, we probably shouldn't give them higher Acc than the FN SCAR and HK416/HK417 rifles that are meant to replace such stop-gap weapons in Australian, UK and US service unless there is some evidence that the purpose-built rifles are substantially less accurate than the modified M16/M4 rifles like the Mk 12 SPR and similar weapons.

Personally, I think there is room to make some sub-MOA sniper rifles in flat-shooting calibers with good ballistics Acc 7. This would allow some of the high-end long-barrelled DMR and Sniper Support rifles to have Acc 6, as, indeed, the SR-25 and M110 SASS already do.

I'd also like to see some of the high-end 12-16" barrel recce rifles and carbines get Acc 5, as I don't really think that an inch or three more of barrel should make all commercial .223 rifles with 16-18" barrels much more accurate and effective than the 'M4 Sniper' with 14.5" barrel, the SCAR-L with 13.8" barrel, the HK416D145RS that Delta actually uses for recce rifles/DMR these days, let alone the FN SCAR-H with a 16" barrel that many SMUs seem to favour in the role nowadays.

In game terms, I think that Fine (Accurate) would make sense for some of the carbines that GURPS currently makes Acc 4. Some 12" barrel carbines with rounds that perform better than .223 at long range might qualify, like the 6.8 SPC or the .50 Beowulf. And I think that many of the newest and shiniest assault rifle/carbine families ought to as well, if only to prevent in-unit gunsmithed stop-gap measures adopted until these were available from being clearly mechanically superior in GURPS.

Upgrading an M4A1 to Fine (Accurate and Reliable) through two days of work and less than $500 in parts shouldn't be clearly mechanically superior to buying the latest $1,500+ carbine that JSOC and SOCOM selected instead. I'm fine with it being equivalent, but I'm leery of stats that essentially say that anyone with Armoury 12+ can easily do better with a basic workshop than top-notch industrial engineers ever do with the best high-tech factories.
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Last edited by Icelander; 03-29-2017 at 06:11 PM.
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Old 03-29-2017, 05:26 PM   #16
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Default Re: [High-Tech] Military Equipment: Global War on Terror edition

Now on to the bombers:

B-1 Lancer

ST/HP: 208
Hnd/SR: +1/3
HT: 11f
Move: 4/413
SM: +8
Occ: 4SP
DR: 3
Range: 5,900
Loc.: g3WWi
Stall: 64

Can carry a payload of 125,000 lbs. of bombs.

B-2 Spirit

Everyone's favorite stealth bomber.

ST/HP: 195
Hnd/SR: +1/3
HT: 11f
Move: 2/315
SM: +6
Occ: 2SP
DR: 3
Range: 5,900
Loc.: g3WWi
Stall: 70

Can carry a payload of 40,000 lbs. of bombs. Stealth technology should probably give -2, maybe -3 to enemy Electronics Operation (Radar) rolls to detect it.

B-52

ST/HP: 205
Hnd/SR: +1/3
HT: 11f
Move: 3/325
SM: +8
Occ: 5SP
DR: 3
Range: 10,145
Loc.: g3WWi
Stall: 85

Payload is 70,000 lbs. of bombs. Used to use an M61 as a tail gun, but according to Wikipedia this has been removed from all currently-operational aircraft.
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Old 03-29-2017, 06:05 PM   #17
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Default Re: [High-Tech] Military Equipment: Global War on Terror edition

Fighters: I'm not going to put too much effort into stating them out right now, since basic types are already covered in the "Dogfight Action!" Pyramid article I keep citing. An exception is the F-22 Raptor. Here's my attempt at stating it:

F-22 Raptor

ST/HP: 136
Hnd/SR: +3/4
HT: 12f
Move: 10/750
SM: +6
Occ: 1SP
DR: 3
Range: 1,840
Loc.: g3WWi
Stall: 60

Exact maximum speeds and stall speeds don't appear to be publicly available, though I've seen estimates of 1,500 mph for top speed, and stall speed is reportedly "very low". The AIM-120 missile is an important weapon for it, but I'm having trouble guessing at the statistics—I'm assuming it's ABF like the Sidewinder, but I'm not 100% certain, and if it is ABF we have very few examples to extrapolate from.

Edit: Before I forget, the F-22 should have the same -2 to -3 radar stealth as the B-2 Spirit.

Last edited by Michael Thayne; 03-30-2017 at 08:55 AM.
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Old 03-29-2017, 06:40 PM   #18
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Default Re: [High-Tech] Military Equipment: Global War on Terror edition

The UK and NZ marksman's rifles are desendants of the AR-10.
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Old 03-29-2017, 06:53 PM   #19
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The UK and NZ marksman's rifles are desendants of the AR-10.
Indeed, though the UK, at least, also uses the 5.56x45mm L86A2 in the role.

In any case, I would never assign the L129A1 Acc 4 just because it had a 16" barrel and I can't figure out how the SCAR-H rates only Acc 4.

These weapons are at least as mechanically accurate as any M16/AR-15 type rifle firing stock 5.56x45mm ammunition (more, in fact, as the M885 is only rated 2-3 MOA, no matter what rifle it's fired from), their 7.62x51mm rounds have superior ballistics and therefore a longer effective engament range and the SCAR-H, at least, seems to have excellent ergonomics.
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Old 03-29-2017, 07:36 PM   #20
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Default Re: [High-Tech] Military Equipment: Global War on Terror edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Thayne View Post
Okay, here's my first go at stating a current US military vehicle:

A-10 Thunderbolt


Weapons-wise, the stats for the 30mm autocannon from Pyramid #3/53: Action ("Dogfight Action!") should work for the main gun. .
I don't have that issue so I can't tell you if this is right but unless the 30mm there is pretty explicitly the GAU-7 it's not. The GAU-7 is a unique weapon with barrels twice as long as common 30mms and it uses those long barrels to fire also unique full caliber DU rounds that weigh twice as much as normal 30mm rounds.

I believe there may have been a 3e write up but without much looking I can't tell you where. I may also just have seen Hans give stats for it once.

But if your stats are for the 30mm from the AH-64 Apache of just for a "generic" 30mm the GAU-7 is a much more formidable weapon.
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