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Old 07-15-2016, 11:27 AM   #11
Rindis
 
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Those Other Spells...

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Originally Posted by Refplace View Post
I have gone with Illusion with hefty limitations on utility and Triggered.
Add a duration limiation if you like.
A less restrictive Illusion still should be pretty cheap and let you make different types of warnings.
Doesn't really get at what I'm going for. It's a good idea (as a general-use power), but part of what I'm trying to go for in these builds is that magic is an arbitrary and not well understood thing. D&D spells have all sorts of strange effects and limitations, which makes them hard to emulate if you're going to be 'proper' about the entire process, but that strangeness is part of what I'm trying to get at here.

That said, some sort of flexible 'power structure' based off of Illusion seems much better than trying to emulate a 1e Illusionist straight. :D

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Originally Posted by Anders View Post
Thinking outside the box here... how about doing it as an Ally spell? It is a Conjuration spell, isn't it?
I've actually seen another write up that did just about what you're proposing. And actually, it's an Abjuration spell (wards and protection).

It's a valid method, but not one I care for. It feels 'wrong' to me to create a 'character' for the single purpose of explaining a special effect. Going with that method, I'd leave out the Telecommunication; I'm sure that's to counter being insubstantial, but I know there's published modifiers to counter that just to speak/moan/etc.

And again, I'm actually very happy with the existing write up, other than the 'once only' part. I think I'm going to have to sit down and see if I can come up with a modifier set I like for that (and I just had idea, but I'll need to be able to sit down and see if it could work).
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Old 07-15-2016, 12:10 PM   #12
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Those Other Spells...

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Originally Posted by Rindis View Post
And again, I'm actually very happy with the existing write up, other than the 'once only' part.
This might the point to ignore the "once only" part and just note that it's different in GURPS. But I understand the intellectual challenge of trying to get exactly the thingy you wanted.

Re Alarm and all effects happening at location XYZ: Protection And Warning Spells makes these kinds of effects (like Watchdog) Ranged Area Detects - shifting the people notified from the caster to "everyone in the area" seems like an acceptable trade-off.
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Old 07-15-2016, 01:04 PM   #13
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Those Other Spells...

Half of the point is the intellectual exercise, so getting hung up on details is a feature, not a bug. :)

I've been strongly tempted to just say, 'Fine, the area has four hours of car alarm syndrome, move along,' but I think the idea of 'Once Only' as a timed trap feature could be handy/fun for other uses.

And I've been wondering about whether my +0% 'features' really weren't hiding an abuse I missed (or just some other modifier that implies they wouldn't be +0%), so thanks for the feedback there.

I will mention at this point that I've got another three/four spells in the initial post I'd like to get some ideas on; I'm not nearly as happy with them as with Alarm.

I was just thinking that maybe I should just rate Erase as 'Afflict: Cannot Speak (-25), Permanent, Accessibility: Inanimate objects/writing only' (and Confuse Languages would just use the -15 point version). My instinct is to shy away from allowing Afflicts on non-character objects, but maybe that's not a bad +0% switch too. (What would both be? +100%?) That would just leave pondering what the modifiers between erasing a book and erasing a couple pages would be....
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Old 07-15-2016, 07:23 PM   #14
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Those Other Spells...

I'm not sure about the others, but wouldn't Featherfall just be Catfall with the Feather Fall enhancement and Sorcery limitation attached to it?
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Old 07-15-2016, 09:01 PM   #15
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Those Other Spells...

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I'm not sure about the others, but wouldn't Featherfall just be Catfall with the Feather Fall enhancement and Sorcery limitation attached to it?
No... that just takes five feet off your falling damage, and possibly halves it. The AD&D spell causes you to fall at a rate of about 2'/sec, and (naturally at that rate) take no falling damage. It seems like putting some kind of 'Cannot Move' restriction on Flight is the best approach.
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Old 07-15-2016, 09:22 PM   #16
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Those Other Spells...

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Originally Posted by Rindis View Post
I was just thinking that maybe I should just rate Erase as 'Afflict: Cannot Speak (-25), Permanent, Accessibility: Inanimate objects/writing only' (and Confuse Languages would just use the -15 point version). My instinct is to shy away from allowing Afflicts on non-character objects, but maybe that's not a bad +0% switch too. (What would both be? +100%?) That would just leave pondering what the modifiers between erasing a book and erasing a couple pages would be....
This is also a weird build because the books already have Cannot Speak. So afflicting Cannot Speak shouldn't have any effect. Also, Cannot Speak explicitly allows the character to use writing to communicate. So it wouldn't have this effect even if it were cast on a living subject.

Here's how I would stat it out:

Erase Ink
Keywords: Area(Special)
Full Cost: 11
Casting Roll: None
Range: Touch
Duration: Truly Permanent (not sure if that's appropriate here...)

Description: All ink within a two yard radius is destroyed. This will effectively erase any text in the area of effect if they are written in ink. While the spell is classed as "Truly Permanent" because the text is permanently erased, erased documents can be reused.

Note that indentations created during writing/engraving will remain after the ink is erased. In principle, it is possible to retrieve the original text via these indentations. However, this is difficult if the indentations have been written over. For example, if someone wrote on a piece of paper placed on top of the page of interest. Apply an appropriate penalty based on the medium and how many times the page has been overwritten.

Statistics: Create Ink(2 Levels, Destruction +0%, Reduced Fatigue 1 +20%, Magical -10%) [11]. Note: I decided that ink is a Specific Item. Furthermore, I treated ink as a gaseous element so that I could treat this as an Area spell. Enough mass is affected per level to make this a moot point, anyway.

Erase Writing
Keywords: Area(Special)
Full Cost: 22
Casting Roll: None
Range: Touch
Duration: Truly Permanent (not sure if that's appropriate here...)

Description: All writing within a two yard radius is destroyed. Erased documents can be easily reused because this spell makes the writing surface smooth. Retrieving text erased by this spell is nearly impossible.

Statistics: Create Writing(2 Levels, Destruction +0%, Reduced Fatigue 1 +20%, Magical -10%) [22]. Note: I treated Writing as a Small Category element. Furthermore, I treated Writing as a gaseous element so that I could treat this as an Area spell. Enough mass is affected per level to make this a moot point, anyway.

What do you think?

Last edited by Emerald Cat; 07-16-2016 at 03:11 PM. Reason: Corrected some of the Mistakes in my Writeups.
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Old 07-15-2016, 09:26 PM   #17
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Those Other Spells...

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Originally Posted by Rindis View Post
No... that just takes five feet off your falling damage, and possibly halves it. The AD&D spell causes you to fall at a rate of about 2'/sec, and (naturally at that rate) take no falling damage. It seems like putting some kind of 'Cannot Move' restriction on Flight is the best approach.
My apologies, I misremembered what Feather Fall did.
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Old 07-16-2016, 10:40 AM   #18
Rindis
 
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Those Other Spells...

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Originally Posted by Emerald Cat View Post
This is also a weird build because the books already have Cannot Speak. So afflicting Cannot Speak shouldn't have any effect. Also, Cannot Speak explicitly allows the character to use writing to communicate. So it wouldn't have this effect even if it were cast on a living subject.
Well, I was definitely going for a non-literal use here. Speech is a form of communication, and Cannot Speak prevents it. Writing is a different form of communication, and I'm thinking using Cannot Speak by analogy should put things into the right price range.

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Originally Posted by Emerald Cat View Post
Erase Ink

Erase Writing

What do you think?
I'd forgotten about the 'destruction' mode of Create. The latter one certainly comes a lot closer to the intent, and I agree with the details of the write up.

Though... Reduced Fatigue 2? Create only costs 2FP. That should be '1', and Magical instead of Sorcery.

I was thinking that Erase was a bit more flexible than that, but taking another look, it just erases one scroll or two facing sheets (and not anything else), which works out to a fraction of a level going by gas or solid, which puts me in a familiar situation of not being able to get down to how limited the original spell is.

Create 1 (Writing; Destruction Only +0%; Magic, -10%; Permanent, +300%; Reduced Fatigue 1 +20%; Requires Gestures, -10%, Requires Incantation, -10%) [3.9x10] = 39

A bit expensive, thanks to the truly permanent. Also, the fact that it could erase several books, instead of a tiny fraction of one. Create 1/10 for 4? >.< (No, wait... well. If I rule it as a solid, that's 0.1 pounds of 'writing'... though smoothing out the page can make up the rest. That's annoyingly tempting, and probably too cheap.)

It also still leaves me with the dilemma of Confuse Languages. I'm thinking that my 'by analogy' build is my main option here.

Confuse Languages:
Affliction 1 (Disadvantage: Cannot Speak, 15%; Extended Duration, x10, +40%; Requires Gestures, -10%, Requires Incantation, -10%; Sorcery, -15%) [1.2x10] + Alternative Ability (Affliction 1 (Disadvantage: Cannot Speak, 15% (Inanimate Only, +0%; Writing Only, +0%); Costs Fatigue (1FP), -5%; Extended Duration, x10, +40%; Requires Gestures, -10%, Requires Incantation, -10%; Sorcery, -15%) [12/5] = 15

I'd do it as one flexible application of Afflicting Cannot Speak, but casting it on a person apparently doesn't keep him from writing something down, and being understood. But letting that happen would be a pair of +100%, and no AA for 36. My instinct is that it's expensive (just wait out the 10 minutes), but... it's really flexible.
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Last edited by Rindis; 07-16-2016 at 10:46 AM.
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Old 07-16-2016, 03:20 PM   #19
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Those Other Spells...

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Originally Posted by Rindis View Post
I'd forgotten about the 'destruction' mode of Create. The latter one certainly comes a lot closer to the intent, and I agree with the details of the write up.

Though... Reduced Fatigue 2? Create only costs 2FP. That should be '1', and Magical instead of Sorcery.
I forgot about that detail. I updated my spells to make them conform better to the rest of Sorcery.

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Originally Posted by Rindis View Post
I was thinking that Erase was a bit more flexible than that, but taking another look, it just erases one scroll or two facing sheets (and not anything else), which works out to a fraction of a level going by gas or solid, which puts me in a familiar situation of not being able to get down to how limited the original spell is.

Create 1 (Writing; Destruction Only +0%; Magic, -10%; Permanent, +300%; Reduced Fatigue 1 +20%; Requires Gestures, -10%, Requires Incantation, -10%) [3.9x10] = 39

A bit expensive, thanks to the truly permanent. Also, the fact that it could erase several books, instead of a tiny fraction of one. Create 1/10 for 4? >.< (No, wait... well. If I rule it as a solid, that's 0.1 pounds of 'writing'... though smoothing out the page can make up the rest. That's annoyingly tempting, and probably too cheap.)
Actually, Create with the Destruction enhancement is already permanent. So you don't need to add duration to the ability. That should make it significantly cheaper.

Fractional levels are the only way to affect a quantity of an item that limited. Note that the Create advantage allows you to affect a smaller area than the maximum based on your level. So the caster doesn't have to worry about erasing their own texts. I gave the spells an area of 2 yards to conform with the rest of Sorcery.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rindis View Post
It also still leaves me with the dilemma of Confuse Languages. I'm thinking that my 'by analogy' build is my main option here.

Confuse Languages:
Affliction 1 (Disadvantage: Cannot Speak, 15%; Extended Duration, x10, +40%; Requires Gestures, -10%, Requires Incantation, -10%; Sorcery, -15%) [1.2x10] + Alternative Ability (Affliction 1 (Disadvantage: Cannot Speak, 15% (Inanimate Only, +0%; Writing Only, +0%); Costs Fatigue (1FP), -5%; Extended Duration, x10, +40%; Requires Gestures, -10%, Requires Incantation, -10%; Sorcery, -15%) [12/5] = 15

I'd do it as one flexible application of Afflicting Cannot Speak, but casting it on a person apparently doesn't keep him from writing something down, and being understood. But letting that happen would be a pair of +100%, and no AA for 36. My instinct is that it's expensive (just wait out the 10 minutes), but... it's really flexible.
Could you add a description for your Confuse Languages spell? The statistics aren't very illuminating as to what the spell is supposed to do.
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Old 07-16-2016, 05:45 PM   #20
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Those Other Spells...

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Originally Posted by Emerald Cat View Post
Actually, Create with the Destruction enhancement is already permanent. So you don't need to add duration to the ability. That should make it significantly cheaper.
Ah ha. I hadn't put all that together when I only skimmed the main part of Create.

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Originally Posted by Emerald Cat View Post
Fractional levels are the only way to affect a quantity of an item that limited. Note that the Create advantage allows you to affect a smaller area than the maximum based on your level. So the caster doesn't have to worry about erasing their own texts. I gave the spells an area of 2 yards to conform with the rest of Sorcery.
Yeah, and I'm more trying to emulate AD&D than the standard Sorcery spells, so I'm trying to impose some of the hard limits on them. Revised, Erase is now 1 point....

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Originally Posted by Emerald Cat View Post
Could you add a description for your Confuse Languages spell? The statistics aren't very illuminating as to what the spell is supposed to do.
The idea is that a target person or object becomes incomprehensible for the duration of the spell. On a person, it's obviously just the -15 point version of Cannot Speak, as they still make noise, they just can't make themselves understood. On an object, it does much the same thing to whatever was written on it, should they be notes, journals, monumental inscriptions.... In AD&D it's actually the reverse of Comprehend Languages, which lets a mage understand any one person or piece of writing (but not speak or write that language).
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