Super ST and a Weapon's ST score?

[Phantasm]

Not sure if this has been addressed before.

Let's take a look at Thor. He's superhumanly strong; for argument's sake let's give him ST 20 and Super ST +13/+300, for ST 33/320 (Super ST Damage 33d/35d, p. SU146, which roughly corresponds to his OHOTMUDE entry of being able to bench-press 100 tons). He wields a hammer (Mjolner) that has the same effective stats as a mace (ST 12), adjusted for thrice the weight due to the way matter is in Asgard (adjusted ST 17). (The hammer has a few other traits, which won't factor into this, such as the Returning Weapon enchantment and some lightning power.) The maximum effective ST that the weapon can be used before damage is capped is thrice that of the ST score (p. B270); in Mjolner's case, that's ST 51.

Now, Thor is clearly able to perform some truly spectacular blows with his hammer. His "normal" ST of 33 is well within the weapon's maximum ST, but he's been shown to use his hammer in blows that are well beyond that as opposed to just using his fists.

Is there anything that would let him use his full Super ST 320 with the hammer?

[Yako]

As it is a superhero we are talking about, why not just stat Mjölnir as a ST based attack, which would be melee capable, not melee only?
That way, he can use it at any strength level and you have the returning effect pretty much built in.
Make it have some nuisance effects that cover having to recall it (-10% I would say, same as recharge, with the fact that it costs him a ready maneuver balanced by not needing to do it in melee) and maybe can be stolen since I think the hammer could be wrested from him by a sufficently strong foe...

Really, most superhero gadgets on the high power end of the spectrum work best as advantages with gadget limitations, as they are usually neither freely available, nor very "realistic", even by the standards of magic items.

[Refplace]

Yeah I would stat it as a power, though not stealable as only he can hold it.
The few times someoen else grabbed the hammer were just plot specials so dont count.

[Phantasm]

Okay, I only used Thor as an example because he's probably the most notable, and the new movie out has him on my mind.

However, I'm thinking in a more general sense: someone with superhuman strength who is able to use his weapon with his Super ST which is far beyond that of the weapons maximum ST score, regardless of what that weapon actually was; he could conceivably wield a broadsword, greataxe, or spear, and have its damage based off his Super ST score rather than the more mundane ST.

Any way to pull this off? Perhaps a new Imbuement skill I missed?

[Nereidalbel]

I'd peg it as a magical property of the weapon. It's just a special enchantment that these weapons can ignore the usual limit of 3x minST.

[DangerousThing]

Originally Posted by tbrock1031

Okay, I only used Thor as an example because he's probably the most notable, and the new movie out has him on my mind.

However, I'm thinking in a more general sense: someone with superhuman strength who is able to use his weapon with his Super ST which is far beyond that of the weapons maximum ST score, regardless of what that weapon actually was; he could conceivably wield a broadsword, greataxe, or spear, and have its damage based off his Super ST score rather than the more mundane ST.

Any way to pull this off? Perhaps a new Imbuement skill I missed?

Mjolnir is special even in the original legends. It was made in a contest as to who could make the best weapon, the gods or the dwarves. The gods made Gugnir, Odin's spear and the dwarves made Mjolnir. The dwarves won and it was given to Thor.

In the MU Mjolnir is made of Ur-Metal (I may not have the spelling right, or I may be several origins behind as I don't follow many titles), which is much stronger than any Earthly metal.

Using a normal weapon at his full ST, Thor would probably break the weapon against a hard target.

[Psychotime]

Originally Posted by tbrock1031

However, I'm thinking in a more general sense: someone with superhuman strength who is able to use his weapon with his Super ST which is far beyond that of the weapons maximum ST score, regardless of what that weapon actually was; he could conceivably wield a broadsword, greataxe, or spear, and have its damage based off his Super ST score rather than the more mundane ST.

Any way to pull this off? Perhaps a new Imbuement skill I missed?

I've thought about this once or twice.

As far as I know there's no official advantage or skill or that lets you bypass that rule outside of just ignoring it in play.

If I were to just make one up, I think it's an Unusual Background type of advantage around 15 points, I guess. Half the cost of an advantage like Trained By a Master that allows you to bypass certain rules.

Never managed to make up a name for it...

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by tbrock1031

Okay, I only used Thor as an example because he's probably the most notable, and the new movie out has him on my mind.

However, I'm thinking in a more general sense: someone with superhuman strength who is able to use his weapon with his Super ST which is far beyond that of the weapons maximum ST score, regardless of what that weapon actually was; he could conceivably wield a broadsword, greataxe, or spear, and have its damage based off his Super ST score rather than the more mundane ST.

You can't do it with a mundane weapon; a mundane weapon will break if wielded with full strength by a high-end brick. You need to define the weapon as super, and buy it as an innate attack. Then you use modifiers to reflect the ability to add ST damage.

Bill Stoddard

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by whswhs

You can't do it with a mundane weapon; a mundane weapon will break if wielded with full strength by a high-end brick.

While this is true, '3x min ST' is a pretty arbitrary limit if you assume it's a function of weapon breakage. Also, a character who can do ridiculous damage with any weapon isn't an unreasonable concept; perhaps some sort of Imbuement skill.

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Anthony

While this is true, '3x min ST' is a pretty arbitrary limit if you assume it's a function of weapon breakage. Also, a character who can do ridiculous damage with any weapon isn't an unreasonable concept; perhaps some sort of Imbuement skill.

Pretty much any rule that's simple enough for game use is going to look arbitrary. It's like "adulthood": Do you become an adult at your bar mitzvah, at 18, at 21, when you get your Ph.D., when your same-sex parent dies, or what? You could pick any of those, and there will clearly be people who are assigned to the wrong category. But still, there are people who haven't become adults, and there are also force levels at which a weapon will break.

Bill Stoddard