Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > The Fantasy Trip

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-09-2018, 11:53 AM   #221
tbeard1999
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Tyler, Texas
Default Re: The Fantasy Trip

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skarg View Post
Ty, your house rule had the feature of a second roll to see what sort of effect on extreme rolls, which IMO is nice (and especially wanted for your blasphemous d20's). An "exploding dice" system of some sort could also be a useful option, though of course original TFT had nothing like that so might be considered blasphemous too.
Well, I'm more of an apostate than a blasphemer, but I suppose the two aren't mutually inconsistent :D

And I warn you - the road to apostacy is paved with "minor tweaks".

Thanks for pointing out that this was somewhat addressed in ITL. I honesty had forgotten that. And interestingly enough, when I was reading your post, I also thought about the "roll a second die" thing. So it turns out that if you roll 5- on 3d6, here's are your odds:

10% chance of triple damage
30% chance of double damage
60% chance of automatic hit only

So you could simply roll a second die if an automatic hit or miss is rolled.

A less blasphemous d10 is the obvious choice for those unafraid of being burned as apostates. 1-triple or broken weapon; 2-4-double or dropped weapon; 5+ automatic hit/miss only.

Or 2d6 - 2-3 is triple damage; 4-6 is double damage; 7+ is automatic hit.

You'd still have to remember the two auto-success/fail numbers for 4, 5, 6 dice, etc. And there's an easily recalled progression: +3 and +4. I.e., add 3 to the auto success number for each additional die; add 4 to the auto fail number for each additional die.

But you wouldn't have to remember the four other numbers for each roll.

Last edited by tbeard1999; 01-09-2018 at 06:28 PM.
tbeard1999 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2018, 11:54 AM   #222
larsdangly
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Default Re: The Fantasy Trip

The rolls with larger numbers of dice are not hard to adjudicate; just calculate the odds and set equivalent thresholds. Or if you wish to increase or decrease the odds of good or bad outcomes for 4d, 5d, etc. rolls, you can nudge the numbers up or down from those base lines.
larsdangly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2018, 01:58 PM   #223
Steve Jackson
President and EIC
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Default Re: The Fantasy Trip

I hope everyone will be good with a LITTLE blasphemy as we edit the Holy Books . . .

/s/ the prophet
Steve Jackson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2018, 02:24 PM   #224
Chris Rice
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: London Uk, but originally from Scotland
Default Re: The Fantasy Trip

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Jackson View Post
I hope everyone will be good with a LITTLE blasphemy as we edit the Holy Books . . .

/s/ the prophet
😂😂😂

Yes, go for it Steve!!!
Chris Rice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2018, 03:58 PM   #225
larsdangly
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Default Re: The Fantasy Trip

Get those creative juices flowing! I already own the ca. 1980 version and am interested to see what you do ca. 2018.

If I were in your shoes, I would be most tempted by the following possible paths to damnation:

- Develop the personality trait idea into 2-3 pages of material, looking at Prince Valiant and Pendragon for inspiration

- Look carefully through GURPS combat to see which innovations make sense as part of advanced Melee. I'm sure you wish to (and should!) avoid re-writing GURPS, but your treatment of armor, damage and parries and dodges in GURPS would have been terrific in Advanced Melee if you'd thought of them a couple years earlier.

- Develop the concept of jobs and their associated risk rolls into something more diverse and flavorful, looking at En Garde! and Flashing Blades for ideas.

- Organize the MH-scale exploration rules into something more structured, resembling the sequence and options of movements and actions in combat

- Ditto for exploration at coarser scales (km or so)

- Organize all the ITL discussion of economics and so forth into some sort of more structured, week-time-scale campaign play, also a'la En Garde!

- Strip out the alternative combat system from AM and replace with a tight little skirmish rules set, sort of aiming at the design space of Lords of Underearth

Good luck!
larsdangly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2018, 04:24 PM   #226
pyratejohn
 
pyratejohn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Columbia, Maryland
Default Re: The Fantasy Trip

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Jackson View Post
I hope everyone will be good with a LITTLE blasphemy as we edit the Holy Books . . .

/s/ the prophet
Yes, but only a little.

:)
__________________
Happily RPGing since 1976.
My Gaming and Reenacting Site (under construction)
pyratejohn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2018, 09:16 PM   #227
JLV
 
JLV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Arizona
Default Re: The Fantasy Trip

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skarg View Post
I'm not sure I communicated what I meant clearly. This is what I meant:

1. I'd use some version of the ITL/Codex curve, perhaps with higher costs for attributes rather than buying talents.

2. For several reasons, I think if you let people buy talents with EP above their IQ, I'd base the cost on their point total, taking into account any such extra talents. (Otherwise some issues happen.)

3. I wasn't talking about balancing what people meet in encounters, and yes I'd play out whatever they meet without tipping scales for balance.

4. What I was talking about, was assessing EP awards for combat based on how strong the opponents were compared to how strong you were. Combat talents would count for that. It's a significant thing when you realize that fighting and defeating someone with ST 20 DX 20 IQ 14, magic weapons and armor, combat talents, etc., only gives you as much EP as defeating a couple of ST 10 DX 10 IQ 7 hobgoblins with copper -1 cutlasses, or even ST 10 DX 10 IQ 6 Prootwaddles with clubs, even if you fight them one at a time, and it doesn't matter at all what your attribute totals or equipment are like, despite the fact that the difficulty is all about the differences in all those things.
Okay, that was completely different from the way I was reading it. I see your point, but I have to think about it for a while before I can constructively comment; mostly because I don't think I ever worried about some sort of EP scale for the individual opponents much. It may even be an issue, though no one ever brought it up in any of my campaigns -- a kill was a kill was a kill for my crew, and any bonus came from looting the body of the victim! ;-)
JLV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2018, 09:22 PM   #228
JLV
 
JLV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Arizona
Default Re: The Fantasy Trip

Quote:
Originally Posted by ak_aramis View Post
I feel much the same way. I would hope, however, for the other materials to be reprinted, as well.

I did like the presentation of a beginner box in the from of Dragons of Underearth was a great thing, but too little, too late.
I think Dragons of Underearth is a non-event in SJG's world. That seemed to be HT's attempt to "dumb down" TFT into whatever it was that HT apparently originally wanted from Steve in the beginning (at least, based on Mr. Thompson's complaints at the time), and Mr. Jackson doesn't have copyright to it anyway, so I think it's a moot point at best.
JLV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2018, 09:29 PM   #229
JLV
 
JLV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Arizona
Default Re: The Fantasy Trip

Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles G. View Post
Well, OK. For starters, I've already shown that it doesn't take five talents. Two will do just fine (though three may be better). You've not shown any particular reason why it just *must* be five, no more, no less. (And, really, per Monty Python, the number of the counting shall be THREE... four thou shalt not count, and five is RIGHT OUT...)

Flat disagree regarding violation of the existing game logic, though. It's called "poor game design." What makes UC stand out with TFT is that everywhere else a degree, sometimes fairly well applied, of logic exists. Obviously nothing is perfect, but the spell progression follows a certain logic (indeed, I seem to recall some text in AW stating that there was, in fact, an underlying logic, and if you understood this you as the player would "be a better wizard"), weapon damage (usually) follows a certain logic, all the other talents have a logical plan laid out, and so forth. UC doesn't. But it should, and it just looks poorly thought out, sort of a square peg in a round hole.

Put another way, what you are really saying is you want to be able to create a high level "Grand Master of Flowers" type of AD&D Monk. The UC talents do indeed perform this function well. And the spells in AW do a pretty good job for Wizard types. However, I should like to see a similar ability to make a high level AD&D Superhero/Lord type of fighting man, or Cleric, or thief. Show me the "way to the top" for those? Simply learning all of the weapons talents, even with Fencing, does not really cut it (pun intended). You basically end up with a high degree of low level ability. Sure, I can use any melee weapon, but I don't get much better at offense or defense outside of raw attributes, apart from Warrior/Veteran, Fencing, Missile and Thrown weapon talents. There is no higher level of ability for a pole arm, axe, mace, etc., and to me that is a glaring shortcoming. Hence my recommendation for a Defensive Quickness type of talent, and I would also suggest that higher levels of ability for other weapons be considered.

BTW while I did not look in detail at your proposal in the other thread, in glancing at it I think it pretty much captures what I should like to see.
I think we are verging on establishing "classes" of character here, and while I'll happily tolerate (and even indulge in a little) heresy, this is outright blasphemy! ;-) To me, one of the big selling points of TFT, simplicity wise, was not having to deal with all those nitpicky "class" capabilities and special rule exceptions!
JLV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2018, 09:32 PM   #230
Steve Jackson
President and EIC
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Default Re: The Fantasy Trip

Because I am a troublemaker, I will point out that TFT had two implicit classes: those with magic talent, who got to buy their spells cheaply, and everyone else.

But I am not going to propose the introduction of a class system. I'm not that heretical. I will admit that that kind of system has its points, pun not intended . . . but just no. D&D has that base covered.
Steve Jackson is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
in the labyrinth, melee, roleplaying, the fantasy trip, wizard

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:13 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.