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Old 05-01-2018, 04:26 PM   #1
lachimba
 
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Default Making dragons slightly tougher

The dragons in DFRPG (particularly non spell casting ones) seem a little too likely to go down to 10D missile spells, 4D skull hits and the like.


Any particular upgrades out there people recommend?
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Old 05-01-2018, 04:47 PM   #2
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Default Re: Making dragons slightly tougher

What sort of fight do you want a fight against a dragon to be? GURPS tends towards fights that are resolved by a small number of decisive hits, but there are a lot of ways you can make dragons more durable if that's what you want. I recommend injury reduction over simple DR increases.
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Old 05-01-2018, 05:54 PM   #3
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Default Re: Making dragons slightly tougher

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What sort of fight do you want a fight against a dragon to be? .

One in which the Knight doesn't deceptive attack the Dragon to the skull on the first turn roll 20 damage - DR, stun the dragon then proceed to beat down on it while the Scout puts arrows into its eyes for 10-DR damage
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Old 05-01-2018, 06:18 PM   #4
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One in which the Knight doesn't deceptive attack the Dragon to the skull on the first turn roll 20 damage - DR, stun the dragon then proceed to beat down on it while the Scout puts arrows into its eyes for 10-DR damage
Hm. How experienced are those characters? While DF dragons aren't terribly physically powerful (if I were writing up dragons, I'd go with "pick a size in hexes. ST 5, DR 1 per hex"), that still seems like high damage.
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Old 05-01-2018, 06:33 PM   #5
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Default Re: Making dragons slightly tougher

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Hm. How experienced are those characters?
Um starting DF Characters?

Knights can easily roll 3d damage + weapon master bonuses with ST 16 plus Striking ST 2. A few of the remaining points into skill covers the penalties.


Charging up spells with 3d to 4d per turn is entirely possible with a starting Wizard.


A Scout with a decent ST and fine arrows can roll 1d+5/6 and run up to the Dragon while its in Stun lock so there is no range penalty.



This is bread and butter DF.

And that's with three PCs, make it six and a couple of henchmen and a small Dragon looks very overmatched.


If thats the way its meant to be I have no complaints I just am looking for alternatives for tougher dragons.

Last edited by lachimba; 05-01-2018 at 07:01 PM.
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Old 05-01-2018, 06:56 PM   #6
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And that's with three PCs, make it six and a couple of henchmen and a small Dragon looks very overmatched.
Small Dragons are at a power level of about 1 per PC. DF dragons aren't brute force opponents. Alternate 'boss fight' dragons are not a terrible plan.
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Old 05-01-2018, 07:03 PM   #7
Turhan's Bey Company
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Default Re: Making dragons slightly tougher

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a small Dragon
Do note that medium dragons are cited as an example of a monster which could potentially challenge a (poorly prepared) party of delvers; see the last sentence on Monsters, p. 22. Small dragons can't individually take on batches of delvers; they need to come in groups.
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Old 05-01-2018, 11:55 PM   #8
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Default Re: Making dragons slightly tougher

Is there a reason the Dragon isn't casting Gloom (Starlight) or Darkness (followed by Darkvision) and then just owning the adventurers?

Or slapping Blur and Armor on itself if it wants to go Claw/Claw/Tail/Breath Weapon all up in melee? (Or honestly leading with Darkness, then Dark Vision, then Armor, then Blur just in case)


For non-casting Dragons...

Why, when it went first (and it did go first right?), didn't it slam the Knight to the ground and do some sweet Overrunning? Along with the Knight's puny friends (especially the squishy Wizard). Remember a Knight on the ground is a Knight you can chomp at leisure (1 - It's Close Combat so the Knight is screwed out of his strongest weapons, 2 - The Knight is Prone, so -4 to making attacks)



My real issue is it's low attack skills. If it's honestly supposed to be a challenge to a party, it should have skills in the low twenties, at least a 20 so it can easily smack heads or Deceptive Attack at -2 to the PC's defenses.
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Old 05-02-2018, 12:57 AM   #9
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Is there a reason the Dragon isn't casting Gloom (Starlight) or Darkness (followed by Darkvision) and then just owning the adventurers?
Because Darkness on an area big enough to conceal a dragon and Dark Vision on a SM +4 Monster is a serious spell casting commitment in terms of time, skill and FP that could easily lead to spell failures even with a decent skill?
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Old 05-02-2018, 01:43 AM   #10
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Default Re: Making dragons slightly tougher

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Because Darkness on an area big enough to conceal a dragon and Dark Vision on a SM +4 Monster is a serious spell casting commitment in terms of time, skill and FP that could easily lead to spell failures even with a decent skill?
What are you even talking about? There is no increase of time or skill penalty for casting over a large area or on a large target.

As for FP, that's what it's Energy Reserve of 35 is for. Even at a mere skill 16 (IQ 14 + Magery 4) it's only 19 FP to cover a 10 radius area. That's well over it's SM 4.

As for Dark Vision (19 FP/ER), as the GM you should either just be waving the cost multiplier (because it's cool for Dragons to buff themselves) or have it cast Infravision on itself for 11 ER.


I forgot there is no Gloom in DFRPG. I use it in my games, but then I use a lot of spells that were removed.
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