Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > Roleplaying in General

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-08-2018, 01:32 PM   #81
jason taylor
 
jason taylor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Portland, Oregon
Default Re: A character type for a Star Trek game

Quote:
Originally Posted by ak_aramis View Post
Fantasy does NOT depend upon animism - many forms of fantasy are non-animistic.

Animism
1 the attribution of a soul to plants, inanimate objects, and natural phenomena.
2 the belief in a supernatural power that organizes and animates the material universe.

Some forms of fantasy are naturalistic - no magic, just alien worlds. Several recent RPGs are of this nature. Non-technological, non-magical, but with exotic creatures.

Some forms are technological in basis but contain violations of fundamental physics, or even just high improbability. EG: Pern, John Carter of Mars.
Perhaps a better way to put it is that fantasy is inconceivable without pagan mythology. Pern did have feudal overlords, bards, and of course dragons after all.
__________________
"The navy could probably win a war without coffee but would prefer not to try"-Samuel Eliot Morrison
jason taylor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 02:03 PM   #82
ak_aramis
 
ak_aramis's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Alsea, OR
Default Re: A character type for a Star Trek game

Quote:
Originally Posted by jason taylor View Post
Perhaps a better way to put it is that fantasy is inconceivable without pagan mythology. Pern did have feudal overlords, bards, and of course dragons after all.
And a science-based explanation for the Dragons. It makes no clear references to pagan mythology, either. Nor to Christian mythology either.
ak_aramis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 02:30 PM   #83
jason taylor
 
jason taylor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Portland, Oregon
Default Re: A character type for a Star Trek game

Quote:
Originally Posted by ak_aramis View Post
And a science-based explanation for the Dragons. It makes no clear references to pagan mythology, either. Nor to Christian mythology either.
The scientifically explained dragons were reptillian, flew, had bat wings, and breathed fire. The need for genetically constructed equivs to forest service airtankers was McCaffrey's idea. But the shape of the dragons really did not alter much.
__________________
"The navy could probably win a war without coffee but would prefer not to try"-Samuel Eliot Morrison
jason taylor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 04:51 PM   #84
David Johnston2
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Default Re: A character type for a Star Trek game

Quote:
Originally Posted by ak_aramis View Post
Fantasy does NOT depend upon animism - many forms of fantasy are non-animistic.

Animism
1 the attribution of a soul to plants, inanimate objects, and natural phenomena.
2 the belief in a supernatural power that organizes and animates the material universe.

Some forms of fantasy are naturalistic - no magic, just alien worlds. Several recent RPGs are of this nature. Non-technological, non-magical, but with exotic creatures.

Some forms are technological in basis but contain violations of fundamental physics, or even just high improbability. EG: Pern, John Carter of Mars.
I've said it before and I'll say it again. Science fiction no more stops being science fiction because the science is bad than romance stops being romance because the sex scenes are terrible and the relationships abusive. John Carter of Mars is not fantasy. It's pulp planetary romance science fiction based on a model of Mars that was on the way to being discredited but still had defenders.
David Johnston2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 05:38 PM   #85
jason taylor
 
jason taylor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Portland, Oregon
Default Re: A character type for a Star Trek game

Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish Wolf View Post
The mention of Occultism snagged my eye. In Star Trek, there is no occult, simply levels of scientific understanding we haven't achieved yet.
There are however episodes with mysticism that justifies the word even in OS(Amok Time strikes one) and certainly Bajoran characters could be said to be occultish. Not to mention Spock's brother. It is perfectly legitimate for a Star Trek character even if it looks a bit odd in a Starfleet officer.

If nothing else it is common for Star Trek characters to have off-the-wall interests. Remember Sisko's jazz and New Orlean's culture, or Picard's Earl Gray Tea. Pretty much anything can be justified as a Quirk.
__________________
"The navy could probably win a war without coffee but would prefer not to try"-Samuel Eliot Morrison

Last edited by jason taylor; 04-08-2018 at 06:41 PM.
jason taylor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2018, 11:19 AM   #86
Astromancer
 
Astromancer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: West Virginia
Default Re: A character type for a Star Trek game

Quote:
Originally Posted by jason taylor View Post
There are however episodes with mysticism that justifies the word even in OS(Amok Time strikes one) and certainly Bajoran characters could be said to be occultish. Not to mention Spock's brother. It is perfectly legitimate for a Star Trek character even if it looks a bit odd in a Starfleet officer.

If nothing else it is common for Star Trek characters to have off-the-wall interests. Remember Sisko's jazz and New Orlean's culture, or Picard's Earl Gray Tea. Pretty much anything can be justified as a Quirk.
But, as I said before, this guy is a social science guy amoung other things. The beliefs of others, rational or not, are a legitimate area of interest.
__________________
Per Ardua Per Astra!


Ancora Imparo
Astromancer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2018, 05:58 PM   #87
jason taylor
 
jason taylor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Portland, Oregon
Default Re: A character type for a Star Trek game

Quote:
Originally Posted by Astromancer View Post
But, as I said before, this guy is a social science guy amoung other things. The beliefs of others, rational or not, are a legitimate area of interest.
Certainly which also makes it a legitimate aspect of a Star Trek Character write up
__________________
"The navy could probably win a war without coffee but would prefer not to try"-Samuel Eliot Morrison
jason taylor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2018, 12:26 PM   #88
tanksoldier
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Default Re: A character type for a Star Trek game

Quote:
In Star Trek, there is no occult, simply levels of scientific understanding we haven't achieved yet.
So does that make priests physicists, or does it make physicists priests?

Those with poor understanding think that the more we learn about the universe, the further apart science and faith become.

Those with better understanding realize that the more we understand, the closer faith and science become.

To put it another way, you learning about carpentry and architecture doesn’t mean the contractor who built your house becomes a myth.

Gene Roddenberry had poor understanding... and we only have a few characters perspectives on the place of religion in the ST universe, and human culture, anyway. Just because Jean Luc Picard rejects religion doesn’t mean all humans do.

In a LUG Trek game I played a counselor who was a Jesuit priest.

Last edited by tanksoldier; 04-11-2018 at 12:30 PM.
tanksoldier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2018, 12:52 PM   #89
Flyndaran
Untagged
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Forest Grove, Beaverton, Oregon
Default Re: A character type for a Star Trek game

That is a whole slew of condescending opinion. Please keep things on topic.
Star Trek up until the very genre shift in DS9 regularly called actual spiritualism primitive misunderstanding... all the while having "energy beings" and the Q which are gods in every way save name.
__________________
Beware, poor communication skills. No offense intended. If offended, it just means that I failed my writing skill check.
Flyndaran is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2018, 01:31 PM   #90
tanksoldier
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Default Re: A character type for a Star Trek game

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
That is a whole slew of condescending opinion.
The problem is, that's what you're talking about here: Opinion. Where the line is drawn, or if at all, is based on opinion about science and faith.

Picard would likely politely scorn a priest's beliefs, while the priest would hold that Picard can't see the forest for the trees.

Quote:
Please keep things on topic.
Pretty sure I am. The point is, just because we've seen an opinion expressed by one small subset of beings doesn't mean that it's the only opinion across an entire political and cultural entity spanning hundreds if not thousands of worlds. In fact, members of Starfleet are NOT the norm.

Quote:
Star Trek up until the very genre shift in DS9 regularly called actual spiritualism primitive misunderstanding... all the while having "energy beings" and the Q which are gods in every way save name.
All the way back to TOS the crew regularly encountered "gods"... even some who had been "real" gods on Earth in the past... while asserting at every turn gods don't exist.

As humanity learns more about house building, does that mean building contractors (gods) cease to exist... or is humanity slowly becoming house builders (ascending to godhood) itself?

Last edited by tanksoldier; 04-11-2018 at 01:35 PM.
tanksoldier is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:43 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.