04-24-2011, 09:02 PM | #11 | |
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Central Europe
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Re: Dueling Long Shield [LT]
Quote:
I don't remember the shields being discussed in the playtest- Low Tech is a big book!
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04-24-2011, 10:14 PM | #12 |
Join Date: Sep 2007
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Re: Dueling Long Shield [LT]
A martial art style for the shields would be interesting.
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04-25-2011, 08:45 AM | #13 | |
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Canada
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Re: Dueling Long Shield [LT]
Quote:
Unless someone can offer better advice, I figure I'll use it as follows - Shield Bash at thr cr, or use it as a Dueling Polearm for thr cr+2/swing cr+2. Using the calculations from LTC2, I get a ST score of 13 to use this as a weapon, but given that it's well balanced and controlled near the striking surfaces, I'd probably lower that to 12. What I'm not clear on is whether one could parry with it when wielding it using Staff skill. It would be cool to have a Martial Arts style for the use of this weapon/shield; if no one better qualified to do so steps up, I'll try to throw something together. Edit: Having watched this playlist of five videos which show the dueling shield in use, some main tactics appear. When using it in one hand, it is generally rested on the ground, and used to Beat. When wielded in two hands, the cutouts can be used to Hook, and otherwise you can do a Shield Bash, or thrust with the spikes. One interesting thing that comes up in the first two videos is when one fighter wields the dueling shield in two hands while still holding his sword. The fourth video shows what looks like a variant on the dueling shield, as it is smaller (DB 2), and has more of the Staff exposed - I'm not going to worry about this one at this point. The last video starts discussing the dueling shield at 1:44, and gives a good discussion and demonstration of how it might have been used. So, a very preliminary write-up: Dueling Long Shield Skills: Shield (Buckler); Staff; one of Axe/Mace or Broadsword. Techniques: Disarming (Staff) Feint (Buckler); Hook (Staff); Retain Weapon (Staff); Sweep (Staff). Cinematic Skills: Blind Fighting; Power Blow; Pressure Points; Push. Cinematic Techniques: Dual-Weapon Attack (Staff); Dual-Weapon Defense (Staff). Perks: Akimbo; Exotic Weapon Training; Form Mastery; Grip Mastery; Off-Hand Weapon Training. Optional Traits Advantages: Ambidexterity; Enhanced Block (Buckler). Skills: Axe/Mace; Brawling; Broadsword; Techniques: Kicking (Brawling). Comments?
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04-26-2011, 04:42 AM | #14 |
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Canada
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Re: Dueling Long Shield [LT]
Apologies for the double post, but I would like to get some feedback on the Style I drafted above, particularly from those who have some knowledge of this weapon.
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04-26-2011, 10:52 AM | #15 |
Wielder of Smart Pants
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ventura CA
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Re: Dueling Long Shield [LT]
Have you looked at Talhoffer? His is the only Fechtbuch that I'm aware of that teaches this unusual weapon. I've read somewhere that the point of dueling shields was that because they were so weird, the courts reasoned that nobody would bother training in them, and therefore justice wouldn't be subverted by professional duelists as they believed was happening with conventional weapons used in judicial duels at the time. Unfortunately I'm unable to recall the source, sorry (EDIT: actually it may have been in the commentary to the Talhoffer Fechtbuch I read).
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04-26-2011, 05:45 PM | #16 | |
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Canada
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Re: Dueling Long Shield [LT]
Quote:
It did occur to me an interesting character would be one that had wronged enough people (and survived the judicial trials) that he became proficient with this unusual weapon, and that he might then go on to teach others of his ilk how to make use of it.
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04-26-2011, 06:15 PM | #17 |
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Central Europe
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Re: Dueling Long Shield [LT]
I would include "Broadsword or Axe/Mace" in the style because these were always used with a Longsword or a Knobbed Club. I think it two of the Germanies had different customs.
Sounds like a good backstory, although it looks like people were teaching how to use these shields very shortly after they became customary. Talhoffer, Paulus Hector Mair, and some of the anonymous South German treatises cover them.
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04-26-2011, 07:01 PM | #18 | |
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Canada
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Re: Dueling Long Shield [LT]
Quote:
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04-26-2011, 08:56 PM | #19 |
Wielder of Smart Pants
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ventura CA
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Re: Dueling Long Shield [LT]
Yeah, that's my point; if it was intended as something nobody would bother to train then the German judiciary seriously underestimated the willingness of the professional martial culture to train in anything.
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04-28-2011, 04:36 AM | #20 |
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Canada
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Re: Dueling Long Shield [LT]
Humans ingenuity should never be underestimated! Any more suggestions for the style I drafted above (or for stats for the weapon)?
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