Gurps Vampire vs Hunter balance concerns.

[Flyndaran]

Originally Posted by mr beer

Gender imbalances are unfair because evolution isn't concerned about justice. So in some ways you don't deserve to win but that's life.

Not just sex differences as I'm noticeably stronger than all my military brothers.

[Boge]

Originally Posted by N.H.Alicia

What about "super abilities" that require training to acquire? Magic tends to fall under this, as does chi. Anyone fit and dedicated enough can learn supernatural martial arts in a setting that features them, and the same is usually true of magic, without the "fit" condition.

Nothing you couldn't do in real life.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Boge

Nothing you couldn't do in real life.

Then you really probably shouldn't play, because nothing this campaign is likely to be about is going to be a historical simulation of the late Baroque.

[N.H.Alicia]

Originally Posted by Boge

Nothing you couldn't do in real life.

Then why bother mentioning "earning" abilities?

I agree with Sir_Pudding. Either swallow your pride and accept supernatural elements or leave the game - even if your character is perfectly mundane, you will not enjoy this campaign.

[Boge]

Originally Posted by N.H.Alicia

Then why bother mentioning "earning" abilities?

I agree with Sir_Pudding. Either swallow your pride and accept supernatural elements or leave the game - even if your character is perfectly mundane, you will not enjoy this campaign.

If I said anything about earning abilities, it was probably referring to the vampires.

I know I won't enjoy this campaign. But it's not about me. I've already said that like 4 times in this topic.

[Kelly Pedersen]

Originally Posted by Boge

I know I won't enjoy this campaign. But it's not about me. I've already said that like 4 times in this topic.

I think people are repeating the advice of not playing so often because it's pretty clear that playing in this game will be a bad idea, not only for you, but for your friends as well. You may think you're doing your friends a favour by playing with them, but I'm pretty sure you're not. Your presence, if you don't enjoy the campaign premise as much as you're claiming, will not improve their experience, and is very likely to worsen it. Having played in games where one person wasn't enjoying things, I can tell you, their general feeling was usually pretty obvious. And if the people you're playing with are your friends, then you being unhappy is going to make them unhappy, or at least diminish their enjoyment.

Personally, I think the best thing you can do to make the game more fun is to tell your group "Hey, folks, thanks very much for thinking of me, but I'm really not interested the whole concept of this game. I appreciate the idea that you won't play without me, but it's really not necessary. Just have the campaign, I'll do something else those nights, and maybe next campaign, I can pitch a concept I'm more into."

Trust us, playing in a game where you actively hate the concept, and are contemptuous of the other players' concepts is not likely to be fun, either for you or for them.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Boge

I know I won't enjoy this campaign. But it's not about me. I've already said that like 4 times in this topic.

Are they paying you?

Because if they aren't, it isn't a job, it is a hobby and there isn't any point in it if you hate it.

However for $20/hr I will happily play Cyborg Commando. There probably is a price point for FATAL but it might exceed the GDP of Nigeria.

[trooper6]

Originally Posted by Boge

I honestly have no idea. I've never liked super powers. I don't know why. I like the idea of an ordinary person doing extraordinary things rather than someone having those advantages to do them. It's like it's unfair in my mind and I don't want to accept that. It's like it's an unearned handout. They don't deserve the victory because they didn't earn it, their super abilities did.

I have a question so I can understand you a bit better, and maybe give better advice. What sort of campaigns have you enjoyed playing in? What do you like? Are you only into historical games? Sci-Fi with no psionics? Do you dislike Fantasy because it includes magic?

Boge, you've mentioned the things you don't like...but could you say more what you do like? What power levels do you like?

Also, do your fellow players like the genre and style of gaming that you like?

[Boge]

My friends are fully aware that I don't like vampire stuff. I've expressed it very strongly to them. They still want to play with me and will NOT play without me. I'm not going to take that away from them. Hell, I'll even ask them and see what they say just so I can prove it to you all...hopefully I can butter them up about it after...

Originally Posted by trooper6

I have a question so I can understand you a bit better, and maybe give better advice. What sort of campaigns have you enjoyed playing in? What do you like? Are you only into historical games? Sci-Fi with no psionics? Do you dislike Fantasy because it includes magic?

Boge, you've mentioned the things you don't like...but could you say more what you do like? What power levels do you like?

Also, do your fellow players like the genre and style of gaming that you like?

I have enjoyed Old West gurps, fantasy gurps (none of us have played magic users). I could possibly play a Sci-Fi gurps, but not with power users like Jedis or something. I don't dislike Fantasy because of magic. I know I could not enjoy playing as a magic user myself and would probably roll my eyes at another player doing magic. I played one where NPCs would cast healing on us and I didn't enjoy that. It was overpowered.

I recently had my highest point character in a fantasy Gurps. He was around 320. He just started to feel powerful and then we finished the campaign. I think around a 250 is a good "hero" character. You're more than capable, but not invulnerable. We all voted what we were going to play next. We all got to choose a campaign we'd roll off on to see what we'd play. I voted for that fantasy because my character was what I wanted him to be and I didn't get to play him that way. Sword mastery, 22, dual wielding, stealthy. I really like the stealthing and ranged attacks, usually with a bow. That doesn't work well when all your party members just HAVE to go in with you and they botch your hiding because one of them fails their roll.

I like a versatile character and I like to do solo stuff or with just one other player. I like to create a realistic character with a strong personality and then see how he reacts and performs in the various situations you find yourself in in Gurps. If you don't stand any chance of getting out of a hairy situation, then it's no fun. If you can't fail in a hairy situation, then it's no fun. It's all about the deciding on the risks, seeing if you succeed or fail, then adapt to the results. I could deal with the environment and NPCs being supernatural, but I dislike the players being that way. From my experience more often than not, they seriously play out of character (apologies to you guys if you ever see and read this post...I guess it had to be said sometime). Without the fear of failing, they always act overly impulsive because they know they won't die and probably won't even get hurt because they have all these special powers and abilities. I like failing. I find that more interesting in Gurps. I like seeing the other players fail.

There is a great line in the VtM book I was reading (trying to get more familiar with things).

"Occasionally, characters will fall, and the fear of that occurring is essential to maintaining suspense during the game. If the players are not afraid of their character's taking damage from a fall, they will take all sorts of out-of-character risks."

I belive it's actually talking about falling, but replace it with fail and that's how I heard it in my head. This happens in our gurps when our characters get too powerful. I try to stay in character as much as possible, but some of the other players don't do so good with this. It's especially bad when they have powers like with Vampire gurps or a Supers gurps. That's probably the biggest reason I'm not excited about this, that and I just never liked the vampire, werewolf thing.


None of this will help anyone give me anymore advice. What advice to be given has been given and I've heard it. I'll do what I can. We're playing Friday, so most everything is already set and in place. I appreciate you guys for trying to help. I really don't want to post in this topic anymore, but some of you keep asking questions and I feel obligated to answer them. But I feel I've already answered everything and I'm just repeating myself now.

[trooper6]

Thanks for taking the time to answer Boge.