Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-26-2017, 05:53 PM   #1
Gnome
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Cambridge, MA
Default [Magic/Powers] Can you use Blink to escape a grapple?

Pretty much what the title says. You can't Concentrate while grappled, but Blink is a Blocking spell/instant use ability, and you can make active defenses while grappled. So can you blink away if an enemy has you grappled?
Is the answer different for Blink (the spell) vs. using Warp (the advantage)? What if I take Warp with Active Defense, -40%?

EDIT: Just realized you can't actually apply Active Defense to Warp. I was thinking of some kind of "blink only" version of Warp, more similar to the spell.
Gnome is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2017, 06:31 PM   #2
mlangsdorf
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Austin, TX
Default Re: [Magic/Powers] Can you use Blink to escape a grapple?

So you can Blink in response to a grapple attack, and if you Blink in response to the initial grapple, you Dodge it and it doesn't land.

After that, I'd be strongly tempted to rule that it doesn't cancel the grapple, just evades the current attempt. You bring your grappler with you on the successful Blink. Of course, since you probably have Body Sense and they may not, that may be enough to break the grapple when they're stunned. So I might give them the option of letting you go rather than risk it.
__________________
Read my GURPS blog: http://noschoolgrognard.blogspot.com
mlangsdorf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2017, 06:36 PM   #3
Anaraxes
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Default Re: [Magic/Powers] Can you use Blink to escape a grapple?

I think you're thinking of the Reflexive Enhancement to turn Warp into a defense, activating automatically without taking a Maneuver. (Concentrate and Ready are prohibited if you're grappled, so this point matters for escaping the grapple.) Even base Warp allows you to use the ability as a Dodge, albeit at a -10 to activate.

The teleporter isn't yet grappled on the very first attack, and so can blink away from that one; the question doesn't apply until after the defense has failed at least once. So, we're talking about blinking away from a followup attack, either from an ally of the grappler, or from the grappler himself.

Just because it seems better to keep a handle on abuse of the power, I'm inclined to say the grapple doesn't break. Grappling someone makes you count as extra encumbrance for them. By that reasoning, the blink would always take the grappler along as well as the rest of the teleporter's stuff, as long as the blinker had sufficient carrying capacity. (Else the blink fails, just as it would if you tried to escape with a ton of gold.) Pile on enough mooks, and they won't be able to teleport away (Reflexively or not). If the teleporter has the carrying capacity, the whole dogpile moves, but relocation in and of itself doesn't make the grapplers let go.

Those mooks are unlikely to be highly trained in Body Sense, so the blink itself can potentially stun them and make them fall down, and likely costs them their ability to act, though they can defend themselves. GURPS "stunning" doesn't mean to go limp and become unable to move, so doesn't seem to break grapples, either. (Perhaps there's a reference in MA or TG that would so state, in which case the teleporters have an improved chance to escape.)
Anaraxes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2017, 06:48 PM   #4
Flyndaran
Untagged
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Forest Grove, Beaverton, Oregon
Default Re: [Magic/Powers] Can you use Blink to escape a grapple?

Wouldn't that mean that a blinker is unable to escape a pile of rocks, underwater, etc. unless they can carry the mountain or ocean?
That seems like a very non-thematic limitation. I always assumed teleportation powers were almost all about escape anyway.

If it only matters if you're being held by a person, then that opens up a different set of issues.
__________________
Beware, poor communication skills. No offense intended. If offended, it just means that I failed my writing skill check.
Flyndaran is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2017, 07:13 PM   #5
Anthony
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
Default Re: [Magic/Powers] Can you use Blink to escape a grapple?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gnome View Post
Pretty much what the title says. You can't Concentrate while grappled, but Blink is a Blocking spell/instant use ability, and you can make active defenses while grappled. So can you blink away if an enemy has you grappled?
Absent some other constraint, yes (certain types of restraint will prevent using magic rituals, which will prevent spellcasting) -- 'cannot concentrate' has no effect on abilities that don't require you to do so. The blink spell doesn't address what goes with you; the teleport spell (presumably related) allows items up to heavy encumbrance, and says you 'can' take someone else, but doesn't address what happens if you exceed your encumbrance limit. The warp power also doesn't address the point specifically, but the Naked limitation implies that you can leave things behind.
__________________
My GURPS site and Blog.
Anthony is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2017, 07:26 PM   #6
Anaraxes
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Default Re: [Magic/Powers] Can you use Blink to escape a grapple?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
Wouldn't that mean that a blinker is unable to escape a pile of rocks, underwater, etc. unless they can carry the mountain or ocean?
No. Being in contact with something is not the same as being grappled by it.

If simple touch were the relevant condition, then only extreme builds or careful manipulation of your situation would allow a Warp. The Warper is, after all, generally in touch with the ground, and unlikely to have the carrying capacity to take the Earth with him. And if he could, then by definition he wouldn't move relative to the Earth at it moves with him, though he could move the planet around the galaxy. But teleporting to various different places on a planet would be an impossible power.

Conversely, the fellow smartypants around the table will simply counter-argue that you're never actually touching anything. It's just van der Waals forces and electrostatic repulsion, maybe with a touch of Pauli Exclusion Principle. At best, you'd take an outer layer of electrons along with you. And the same would be true of Warping when you wanted to take things with you, like your clothes. The only possible Warp power would be Naked Only.

But even that's problematic, as the various parts of your own body aren't actually touching each other, either. Your center of consciousness vanishes from the rest of your body, leaving you dead, or perhaps in spirit form, depending on your metaphysics. You'll have to invoke a psychic definition of "my body" to know what to take.

Trying to rules-lawyer along those lines makes the supposed inconsistency worse, not better.
Anaraxes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2017, 10:12 PM   #7
Flyndaran
Untagged
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Forest Grove, Beaverton, Oregon
Default Re: [Magic/Powers] Can you use Blink to escape a grapple?

The only difference between a person grappling you and a pile of rocks is conscious intention.
I assumed that one could Blink away from under a pile of debris.
This is a pretty big feature I didn't know about.
__________________
Beware, poor communication skills. No offense intended. If offended, it just means that I failed my writing skill check.
Flyndaran is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2017, 10:55 PM   #8
D10
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: In Rio de Janeiro, where it was cyberpunk before it was cool.
Default Re: [Magic/Powers] Can you use Blink to escape a grapple?

I cant really look for it now, but im sure kromm said you cant cast blocking spells if you cant concentrate
D10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2017, 11:23 PM   #9
Calvin
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Calgary
Default Re: [Magic/Powers] Can you use Blink to escape a grapple?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
The only difference between a person grappling you and a pile of rocks is conscious intention.
I assumed that one could Blink away from under a pile of debris.
This is a pretty big feature I didn't know about.
To the same point, any mage that casts blink is going to be in contact with the ground. He's not bringing the earth with him every time he blinks. Depending on your interpretation the same could be said for the air in contact with the caster.
Calvin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2017, 07:32 AM   #10
Anaraxes
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Default Re: [Magic/Powers] Can you use Blink to escape a grapple?

You could have a reasonable and consistent interpretation where the caster chooses every time they blink. They'll often want to leave things behind. Sometimes they'll want to bring their attacker with them (blinking up into the air to drop their attacker, etc), which they could do if they had the proper Enhancements for carrying capacity and Affects Others. (It's a free extra attack, since this is a Reflexive ability used in defense.) So they could just specify what comes along every time they blink.

However, the makes an already-powerful ability even more powerful. It's not merely that grappling becomes useless, but merely touching the teleporter becomes extremely risky. Imagine not that you're playing the teleporter, but the strong and highly-skilled in martial arts attacker. How frustrated do you feel? Hence my inclination to go the other way, and limit the abuse before it shows up in the game.
Anaraxes is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
blink

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:48 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.