Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-22-2016, 07:54 AM   #21
Bruno
 
Bruno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
I don't buy it. I don't like advantages giving unstated disadvantages.
... Kromm didn't say it gives an unstated disadvantage. Just because Can't eat or drink is a 0 point feature doesn't mean that you have to take it.

I'm more curious about the distinction between a oWoD vampire hiding a secret, a bucket-headed robot with no mouth, and the chi master - but this actually isn't a Doesn't Eat Or Drink thing IMO, and isn't entirely covered by Kromm's answer.
  • The Robot has Restricted Diet (batteries, fuel, whatever it runs on).
  • The vampire doesn't always have Doesn't Eat or Drink either - they eat blood, and many have to do it somewhere in the daily-ish range.
  • The immortal chi master does have Doesn't Eat or Drink.

It's been clarified (in IIRC Horror and Zombies) that if you have a physical consumption Dependency of a fairly high frequency, you don't qualify for Doesn't Eat or Drink. A vampire that only has to feed the Dependency monthly or quarterly or whatever still has it, but a vampire that has to feed at least daily is actually under significantly more onerous feeding conditions than a human (missing your daily feeding gives you hourly HP damage!).

The robot can't even TRY to eat at a human dinner party, but also isn't going to face social expectations to eat either.

The oWoD vampire can put food in its mouth, but looks rather disgusted and makes Will rolls to swallow it, and then suffers from something worse than Nausea (rolling Will or HT every minute or so to avoid Retching, even without provoking stimuli). The oWoD vampire does face expectations to eat, and can be assumed to be protecting their Secret (is a vampire).

The chi master can cheerfully sit down to dinner with their hosts and enjoy every bite, within whatever restrictions they might have due to Vows or the like.

The robot can't ingest things, accidentally or deliberately. The vampire and the chi master can both end up ingesting things. However, for the vampire, the food itself is effectively a Secret-destroying metabolic hazard - one that bypasses the vampires Immunity to Metabolic Hazards, no less! The chi master isn't going to throw up from a cup of tea.

So what's that second, oWoD-Vampiric Can't Eat Or Drink?

And then there's the ability to burn Energy Reserve (or HP or some other valuable resource) to temporarily suppress the metabolic hazard - but you're still making Will rolls to not look totally grossed out.
__________________
All about Size Modifier; Unified Hit Location Table
A Wiki for my F2F Group
A neglected GURPS blog
Bruno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2016, 08:21 AM   #22
malloyd
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno View Post
So what's that second, oWoD-Vampiric Can't Eat Or Drink?
It should have been a Weakness, but I think there are still no official rules to modify that to inflict an Irritating Condition (Nausea in this case) rather than damage or fatigue. Just use whatever your favorite house rules for allergies are I suppose.

Note that it isn't actually that serious a social problem, especially in the modern world. There are lots of socially acceptable reasons for not eating ranging from severe food allergies that make it unsafe for you to eat food prepared somewhere that might have traces of it to belonging to a caste or religion that never eats with outsiders.

Quote:
And then there's the ability to burn Energy Reserve (or HP or some other valuable resource) to temporarily suppress the metabolic hazard - but you're still making Will rolls to not look totally grossed out.
That one is Not (whatever the disadvantage package is) with Costs Fatigue.
__________________
--
MA Lloyd
malloyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2016, 09:05 AM   #23
Bruno
 
Bruno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

Hm.
Revulsion: Food
Accessibility: Reduced Symptoms.
  • Only apply the lesser penalties if ingested, rather than if touched/inhaled.
  • Roll vs Will every minute or suffer Retching for 60 seconds (or if you prefer, 6d6 * 3), using the greater "ingestion" penalties instead of the usual Retching penalties.
  • Symptoms end once you Retch, not after 10 minutes.
__________________
All about Size Modifier; Unified Hit Location Table
A Wiki for my F2F Group
A neglected GURPS blog
Bruno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2016, 09:26 AM   #24
RyanW
 
RyanW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southeast NC
Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MWnRNC View Post
Personally, I would find someone I spent regular time with and never saw eat or drink to be unusual. Think of how many meetings, particularly evening ones, that go down at restaurants or bars.
I assume in most cases (assuming supernatural creatures that can't eat or drink are not public knowledge) an obscure prohibition against sharing food with anyone not of your religious group would work as a cover.
__________________
RyanW
- Actually one normal sized guy in three tiny trenchcoats.
RyanW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2016, 05:17 PM   #25
Flyndaran
Untagged
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Forest Grove, Beaverton, Oregon
Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno View Post
... Kromm didn't say it gives an unstated disadvantage. Just because Can't eat or drink is a 0 point feature doesn't mean that you have to take it.
...
I still don't see why it would be a zero point feature. It removes character choice and that's always a disadvantage in every other situation.
__________________
Beware, poor communication skills. No offense intended. If offended, it just means that I failed my writing skill check.
Flyndaran is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2016, 05:46 PM   #26
roguebfl
Dog of Lysdexics
 
roguebfl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Melbourne FL, Formerly Wellington NZ
Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
I still don't see why it would be a zero point feature. It removes character choice and that's always a disadvantage in every other situation.
As Kromm stated that lack of choice is balanced against you can't be tricked into swallowing a tracker or some other baleful effect.
__________________
Rogue the Bronze Firelizard
Gerald Grenier, Jr. Hail Eris!
Rogue's Weyr
roguebfl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2016, 05:52 PM   #27
Anthony
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

Quote:
Originally Posted by roguebfl View Post
As Kromm stated that lack of choice is balanced against you can't be tricked into swallowing a tracker or some other baleful effect.
In order to be tricked like that, you have to actually be making the choice to eat -- just because you can eat doesn't mean you will. Kromm seems to be bundling together Perk (Can Eat) and Quirk (Eats even though it's unnecessary).
__________________
My GURPS site and Blog.
Anthony is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2016, 06:14 PM   #28
VariousRen
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony View Post
In order to be tricked like that, you have to actually be making the choice to eat -- just because you can eat doesn't mean you will. Kromm seems to be bundling together Perk (Can Eat) and Quirk (Eats even though it's unnecessary).
It goes beyond being tricked, you physically can't be forced, which removes a potential entry point for poisons or other hazards. Sounds like a Perk to me.
__________________
I run a low fantasy GURPS game: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdo...YLkfnhr3vYXpFg
World details on Obsidian Portal: https://the-fall-of-brekhan.obsidian...ikis/main-page
VariousRen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2016, 06:26 PM   #29
Anthony
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

Quote:
Originally Posted by VariousRen View Post
It goes beyond being tricked, you physically can't be forced, which removes a potential entry point for poisons or other hazards.
Most things with doesn't eat or drink aren't concerned, and having things forced down your throat is well into the 'less than once per campaign' rarity (the only time it's ever come up for me, as player or GM, was using facehuggers. Which would have happily found an alternative orifice anyway).
__________________
My GURPS site and Blog.
Anthony is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2016, 07:07 PM   #30
Otaku
 
Otaku's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: South Dakota, USA
Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

I mean, I am fine treating Doesn't Eat or Drink as including "Cannot Eat or Drink" by default and making it require Switchable to turn it off for characters that sometimes do need/want to eat or drink but...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony View Post
Most things with doesn't eat or drink aren't concerned, and having things forced down your throat is well into the 'less than once per campaign' rarity (the only time it's ever come up for me, as player or GM, was using facehuggers. Which would have happily found an alternative orifice anyway).
I was wondering about this as well. Plus by assuming this, we might make the math easy now, but especially as we are dealing with a fantastic ability what happens when we get to the examples where it just doesn't hold true?

There might be an alternate way for whatever in question is there to harm the character, to the point being safe from it is barely worth being a Perk. Then there are characters that already paid elsewhere, like a character that can't be forced to Eat or Drink and has Resistant: Immune to All Metabolic Hazards. Now assuming that by default he or she cannot even feign eating only carries the advantage that someone can't force feed them ground glass or something similarly dangerous.
__________________
My GURPS Fourth Edition library consists of Basic Set: Characters, Basic Set: Campaigns, Martial Arts, Powers, Powers: Enhanced Senses, Power-Ups 1: Imbuements, Power-Ups 2: Perks, Power-Ups 3: Talents, Power-Ups 4: Enhancements, Power-Ups 6: Quirks, Power-Ups 8: Limitations, Powers, Social Engineering, Supers, Template Toolkit 1: Characters, Template Toolkit 2: Races, one issue of Pyramid (3/83) a.k.a. Alternate GURPS IV, GURPS Classic Rogues, and GURPS Classic Warriors. Most of which was provided through the generosity of others. Thanks! :)

Last edited by Otaku; 01-22-2016 at 07:11 PM.
Otaku is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
advantages, disadvantages, doesn't eat or drink, forcefeeding

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:15 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.