Asking opinions about preaching

[Daigoro]

Originally Posted by jeff_wilson

If you want a sincere convert, generally you look for people who are unhappy with their present circumstances and don't have many friends (Psychology, Detect Lies, Body Language). Explain how your cult will give them new hope (Diplomacy, Public Speaking), and deliver on it by being their best new friend (Acting, Sex Appeal) and providing the things their old way of living didn't supply (Carousing, and I'm sure you can imagine more).

Odd as it may seem, the skill for prosetylising one-on-one could be Merchant. In a sense, you're trying to convince someone to "buy into" (convert) their "product" religion. It's the same process, just the product and the currency are a bit different. Door-to-door salesmen and door-to-door Mormons are basically doing the same activity.

[Orion Deckrect]

Originally Posted by jeff_wilson

That's not a very productive way to motivate strangers to help you.

No. And because its not abou motivation, but organization. Or endless side tracks discussions will rise. Management.

The topic i offered was very specific. The situation deals where a character aproches an NPC offering the possibility to become part of the religion. This situation assumes the NPC is already devoted to the religion. In fact, its a quite active member of the community.

This is the reason i used the other example with Bob.

I suppose much more interesting will be later, discuss abot how a priest may actually convert new followers! I confess i am dealing with this trouble for months and cannot find a suitable answer.

But after detoxing a little and reading and playing other RPG systems, new ways to face Gurps comes to my mind. Sometimes, players and DMs feels its a litle unfair to have an achievement just rolling one skill. But i think use lots of skills combined are not the only way to make things complicated.

Once, Kromm told me the rection table is just a guideline and should not be used to any particulary powerfull effect.

In fact, i think its a matter of semantics. I understood what he was telling me at the time, but now, to face this problem in particular, something tells me that one of the possible answers may be on this reaction table afterall!

About converting people, i have a few opinions to add to what was said, but i do prefer to discus it after we have found a way to deal with the "invitation" issue!

[Orion Deckrect]

Daigoro, i do really think that your Mormon thinking is right and sounds a nice aproach. i just dislike the use of Merchant skill because you may understand very well the intentions of this particular skill on the skill's description.

[jeff_wilson]

Originally Posted by Daigoro

Odd as it may seem, the skill for prosetylising one-on-one could be Merchant. In a sense, you're trying to convince someone to "buy into" (convert) their "product" religion. It's the same process, just the product and the currency are a bit different. Door-to-door salesmen and door-to-door Mormons are basically doing the same activity.

That might work if the person and the religion are primarily concerned with getting ahead commercially. In a lot of ways protestant churches can be like that, in that they function as social clubs and business associations controlled by the deacons with a minister hired to provide religious services and PR.

[jeff_wilson]

Originally Posted by Orion Deckrect

No. And because its not abou motivation, but organization. Or endless side tracks discussions will rise. Management.

The topic i offered was very specific. The situation deals where a character aproches an NPC offering the possibility to become part of the religion. This situation assumes the NPC is already devoted to the religion. In fact, its a quite active member of the community.

This is not the impression that I got from your original post. It did not mention the NPC's previous state of devotion at all, and the subsequent Bob example specified that the prospective recruit had never thought of himself as a soldier, implying no previous connection to the organization in question.

If the person is already a sympathetic convert, they usually concentrate on the comraderie of the priesthood, personal fulfillment helping perform works for the faith, and emphasize the advantages for pursuing one or more of the person's personal interests: this again involves Psychology to determine the best ways to appeal to the prospect.

The Merchant approach is somewhat viable in this scenario without being utterly crass: "I will see to it that your family is provided for while you are away seeking to serve X in the priesthood," with dickering over where Providence will fall between fully supported and merely compensated for the absence of the candidate.

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by Orion Deckrect

The topic i offered was very specific. The situation deals where a character aproches an NPC offering the possibility to become part of the religion. This situation assumes the NPC is already devoted to the religion. In fact, its a quite active member of the community.

And the answer is quite simple.

Any Influence skill may be used. Depending on the social mileu in which the characters find themselves, their prior relationship and the nature of the faith, some may be more or less likely to succeed than others (and should get a positive or negative modifier for particularly suitable or unsuitable approaches).

Diplomacy, as the Influence skill which is appropriate for all mileus and in all cases, would be the best skill to use if we do not know anything more specific. This would cover an interaction between two characters where one is trying to get the other to adopt a certain course of action.

This roll, of course, could well receive bonuses for use of such skills as Religious Ritual and Public Speaking to impress the NPC beforehand and it should naturally be permissable for the PC to roll his Theology skill to get a bonus to the roll.

After the NPC has accepted his new calling (gotten a good enough Reaction), such skills as Teaching and Leadership will make him learn his new job faster and use of Body Language and Psychology (Applied) can keep an eye on his mental state and if necessary, Public Speaking, Diplomacy, Leadership and other Influence skills could be used to keep him on the straight and narrow.

[Maz]

Ok I read the OP as if the PC wanted to convert and persuade an NPC who wasn't really interested.



Maybe a better way to look at it is to ask "why wouldn't the NPC just say yes"?
Why is it that the devout NPC when aproached with the opportunity to join the clergy, does not just say yes? When you can answer that question I think you will have a much easier time figuring out what skill to use.

Some of the simple persuation tools might have nothing to do with skill but with availeble wealth and rank. "If you jon you get power and money"... that has nothing to do with merchant, diplomacy or anything else.

[Dangerious P. Cats]

It depends on how she's trying to convince the person really. They only need propaganda skill if their coming up with arguments themselves and not even then if they are talking one on one. Generally they'd use fast talk or diplomacy to try and convince someone of something, or just plain IQ, if their dealing with them one on one. Propaganda is more for a mass audience, as is public speaking. In those cases you'd need propaganda to make the message but public speaking to deliver it.

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by Maz

Some of the simple persuation tools might have nothing to do with skill but with availeble wealth and rank. "If you jon you get power and money"... that has nothing to do with merchant, diplomacy or anything else.

Uh, yes.

The ability to offer a deal that is in the NPC's favour gives a positive modifier to any Influence roll. It doesn't remove the need to roll.

[Maz]

Originally Posted by Icelander

Uh, yes.

The ability to offer a deal that is in the NPC's favour gives a positive modifier to any Influence roll. It doesn't remove the need to roll.

Are you saying that any transaction involves a reaction roll?
I agree that the stuff I mention does indeed give a bonus to any roll. But as a GM I would only require a roll if the person was somehwo unwilling or wanted to "haggle".

In this situation, I would only require any rolls if the NPC was somehow unwilling to join. The OP states that the riligion the PC is part of have some moral issues that might be hard to accept to some, but at the same time the NPC is already a devout follower and people of that faith have already helped out in the local community. Unless the NPC has a good reason to not just accept, I wouldn't require any rolls.