Hippopede and Level 9

[josh_dog2]

I was at level 9 during a game tonight and drew the Hippopede monster (Level 20). It states that "If you successfully run away, go up a level." During the fight it was leveled up beyond my combat points forcing me to attempt to run away. However, if I were to successfully run away I would gain a level. The rules state (with a few exceptions) that you cannot gain the winning level unless you defeat a monster. Also you it has been stated that no player can refuse to take a level. In this scenario, would I have been forced to suffer the bad stuff (death in this case), since any successful run away attempt would have put me at level 10?

[Andrew Hackard]

You can still try to Run Away. If you succeed, you get away but you cannot get the level.

[josh_dog2]

Thanks for the answer Andrew although I find the ruling a bit interesting. Other rules would have led me to believe it would be the other way around in which a successful run away attempt would not be possible due to the level gain.

I would have based that off of a couple of things.

1. As far as I know, at level 9 you cannot play a GUAL card and not take the level in attempt to get rid of it. This might be applicable in an instance where you are trying to avoid charity.

2. In a previous ruling on a post of mine, you stated something similar in that you can not refuse to take a level from a fight. http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=145216

Also if I may piggyback on the original question. Lets say I was at level 8 and instead of rolling to run away, I used one of the various automatic escape cards, would that count as a successful runaway in order to gain the extra level?

[MunchkinMan]

This is not the same situation as intentionally playing a card that is specifically designed to give you a level. Those cards can't be played when you are at Level 9. Also, I can't see a way to justify that someone can't Run Away from a Monster just because the Bad Stuff or other effects can't be applied to them. There are also many cases where a secondary side effect of some action that gives a level that doesn't say that level can be the Winning Level can still be played.

Think more along the lines of a Curse/Trap that is played on you, or Bad Stuff from a Monster when you can't suffer the effect. As an example of what I mean, Curse! Lose Your Race from the original Munchkin tells you to discard any Race(s) you have in play, but has no effect on you when you have no Race(s) in play. Finding a Curse that doesn't affect you doesn't change the game play (i.e., you don't get to ignore that card and kick down another door), nor are you prevented from playing an ineffective Curse on another player. Another good example from the original Munchkin game is Shrieking Geek, with Bad Stuff that makes you lose Race and Class cards you have in play: if you have neither of these things, nothing happens to you. In no way does that mean you can't Run Away from the Monster, nor does that mean you are automatically successful in running away.

[josh_dog2]

Originally Posted by MunchkinMan

...I can't see a way to justify that someone can't Run Away from a Monster just because the Bad Stuff or other effects can't be applied to them.

Thank you MunckinMan, that was more of an answer I was seeking, in that the intent of the secondary effect was to never stop someone from running away in a scenario like that.

I also took a look at the rules sheet (as I should have done in the first place) and in the Conflicts between Cards and Rules section it does state to ignore any card effect that would contradict one of the 4 commandments of munchkin.