COMMAND POSTS in OGRE...

[Tim Kauffman]

As a Scenario special rule, I was thinking of having all units on the side that looses its CP loose their ability to Combine Fire.

The battlefield this occurs in has 30 Cruise Missile Craters within a map of 116 Hexes. All other hexes are Rubble or Town (not really Town, but represents terrain that has been damaged to that equivalent).

This battlefield would have a lot of background radiation, ect I would assume added to the devastated terrain makes for a battlefield that doesn't really get any worse. It's so bad in fact, only Infantry, Mobile Howitzers and Howitzers operate in it. Possibly bad enough to make such a Scenario specific rule plausible.

This gets into what CPs would be operationally in The Last War and how they affect units in the field.

Any thoughts on this one?

[Mack_JB]

Mobile howitzers are finicky delicate machines. With just M1, they are pretty much unsuited to operations on any broken terrain. If a MHWZ can move in that kind of environment, then by rights anything else should be able to move as well, especially something like a SHVY.

Why would the CP control combined fire at all, as that implies all the unit's comms go through that CP clearinghouse? Therefore, if a CP is destroyed, the remaining units would lose all cohesion, not just combined fire ability.

[Izzy_B]

I see some logic here as the CP has been described in writing as the field commander's center of operations on the battlefield.

OTOH I assume that individual GEV pilots/tank drivers/etc certainly could radio each other (figure of speech) to coordinate attacks even w/o a field commander.

[offsides]

IIRC, I've seen and SSR where loss of the CP results in a temporary (somewhere between 1 and 3 turns?) penalty (though I don't remember if it was no combined fire, or -1 die roll, or what) to represent the confusion caused by the loss of central command, and the time it takes to reestablish some semblance thereof by battlefield commanders. I don't see a problem with preventing combined fire temporarily, but withing a few turns whoever's left on the battlefield will sort out who's in charge and take over for the lost CP.

As to the terrain issues, if a MHWZ can get there, then ANY heavy tracked vehicle (except maybe a crawler, but that's easy to prohibit) should be able to do so, and I wouldn't want to even think about what it would take to bring in a HWZ that wasn't already in place before things got chewed up. I see no problem excluding GEVs via SSR, but other than being worried about getting stuck in swamp, Ogres and SHVYs have the best terrain mobility in the game, followed by HVY and MHWZ (although the latter are otherwise hampered by only having 1MP). If you really want to make it difficult terrain, only allow emplaced, immobile armor and INF...

[Ashley]

IMNSHO Command Post represent the highest level of command. Therefore their function is to coordinate the missions between each of the sub-commands.


So without the CP the infantry are going to have a hard time calling in artillery support that is coordinated with other elements.


So from a rule perspective, A unit of heavy tanks can combine fire, but not with the infantry at the same time as the artillery without the CP.


My two cents worth.

[GranitePenguin]

There are plenty of scenarios that have no CP to begin with. There are no penalties in those scenario, so why should it matter if you have one or not to general tactics?

[TheAmishStig]

Originally Posted by GranitePenguin

There are plenty of scenarios that have no CP to begin with. There are no penalties in those scenario, so why should it matter if you have one or not to general tactics?

I do like the general idea of "thrown into disarray" as a scenario-specific gimmick, and a number of the official targets do have some sort of encouragement to use them as more than a differently-shaped CP / Strongpoint when dreaming up scenarios...so am wondering if a target structure made specifically for the purpose wouldn't work better, to eliminate confusion.

I know it had Jamscreens and Sensor Nets, but didn't Ogre Minis or one of them also have some sort of radar array?

Plop a Radar Array on the map, blow it up to cause some sort of 'disarray' status for 1 whole enemy turn [making it consistent with disabled by combat]. What that effect should be? Unless I have a shower thought, y'all are on your own for that one. But if I think of one, and it playtests well, Drew may get another Ogrezine Query out of it. ;)

[wolf90]

Originally Posted by TheAmishStig

I know it had Jamscreens and Sensor Nets, but didn't Ogre Minis or one of them also have some sort of radar array?

Why, yes. Yes, it did. Sensor Nets and Command Control are both optional rules within Ogre Miniatures, Second Edition.

Originally Posted by TheAmishStig

But if I think of one, and it playtests well, Drew may get another Ogrezine Query out of it. ;)

Now you're just teasing me . . . !

D.

[offsides]

Originally Posted by GranitePenguin

There are plenty of scenarios that have no CP to begin with. There are no penalties in those scenario, so why should it matter if you have one or not to general tactics?

I don't think it's a lack of CP that causes issues, it's the loss of a CP that does. With no CP in the scenario, there's already some sort of decentralized command structure that can recover from individual losses rather easily. But with a CP directing things, it could take a turn or two for that decentralized structure to stabilize once it's lost. At least that's how I was thinking of it. But you certainly raise a good point that a lack of CP shouldn't impede things significantly.

[TheAmishStig]

Originally Posted by wolf90

Now you're just teasing me . . . !

D.

Now now, I wouldn't tease you like that...I'm threatening! ^_-

The problem, as I've found with others I've tried creating, is that pesky balancing act...but when I get any given scenario over that particular hump, either you or the forums will be the first to know...