What GURPS needs... now

[ericbsmith]

Originally Posted by Refplace

I agree.
Wishing for a hot property to become a licence is a waste of time. If it happens it will be luck and other factors than us wanting it.
However lets look at the existing GURPS settings so we know we have workable options. Which settings are good ones to expand on and what products do they need?
Adventures, Bestiaries, Meta plots, etc.

One that has already gotten a 4e threatment and that would lend itself greatly with all of those (particularly Meta plot) is Reign of Steel. It taps into a still popular zeitgeist (rise of the machines), has a unique spin take on the genre. There is a lot that could be expanded there and a lot of intrigue to be had. It could even be worked to incorporate microcosms of other genres (After the End in the Wastelands somewhere, Cyberpunk in a couple of the zones where humans are still allowed to live, etc). It could use some revamping of the setting and would need a major artwork upgrade, but it has a lot of possibilities.

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by ericbsmith

One that has already gotten a 4e threatment and that would lend itself greatly with all of those (particularly Meta plot) is Reign of Steel.

Reign of Steel sounds good to me.
A Psionic Campaign setting to take advantage of those books.
A SteamPunk setting to take similar advantage to those recent books, including one coming out soon.
Maddness Dossier seems like a winner.
We need a Fantasy one too.

[evileeyore]

Originally Posted by ericbsmith

One that has already gotten a 4e threatment and that would lend itself greatly with all of those (particularly Meta plot) is Reign of Steel. It taps into a still popular zeitgeist (rise of the machines), has a unique spin take on the genre. There is a lot that could be expanded there and a lot of intrigue to be had. It could even be worked to incorporate microcosms of other genres (After the End in the Wastelands somewhere, Cyberpunk in a couple of the zones where humans are still allowed to live, etc). It could use some revamping of the setting and would need a major artwork upgrade, but it has a lot of possibilities.

Oh, très sexy!

Originally Posted by Refplace

Reign of Steel sounds good to me.
A Psionic Campaign setting to take advantage of those books.
A SteamPunk setting to take similar advantage to those recent books, including one coming out soon.
Maddness Dossier seems like a winner.
We need a Fantasy one too.

And here lies a problem... too many settings to be done by a small publisher.

They will need to focus in on one area. When that takes off, maybe open another, and so on.

[dbm]

Originally Posted by Rasputin

Frankly, I don't think most gamers care at all about a company setting; few Pathfinder players actually care about Golarion, for example.

I've strongly considered buying Paizo adventure paths as some of them are well regarded as sand box type games material. I don't play Pathfinder and I'm not interested in Golarion: what I want is something to save me preparation time. That's why I keep asking for a campaign-in-a-box rather than a game world specifically. This product would have an implied setting, naturally, but it wouldn't be the focus of it. So with a little bit of modification I would be able to insert it into any campaign world that I prefer.

Contrast that against taking a 3rd party module or mega-module and re-stating it for GURPS. Having an easily portable, high quality, play-rich product would be a great way to get over the hurdle that people who are not already using GURPS have about 'what do it do with this toolkit to produce a great gaming experience?'

IMO, naturally. I am not a marketeer.

[evileeyore]

Originally Posted by dbm

I've strongly considered buying Paizo adventure paths as some of them are well regarded as sand box type games material.

I don't know who has been claiming they are sandboxes (or what definition they are using) but they are not sandboxes.

This product would have an implied setting, naturally, but it wouldn't be the focus of it. So with a little bit of modification I would be able to insert it into any campaign world that I prefer.

So you're looking for stuff more along the lines of the old (and new) L series (Lendore Isles) for D&D which is a set of adventures set in Greyhawk (but could be anywhere) but which are pretty much separate from the rest of the Greyhawk stuff?

[kabson]

Phew! This thread has consistently been growing beyond my ability to read it, but I'm just about caught up.

I'm going to go back to some older points:

Other online RPG stores: I get the impression this won't happen, but if I've got my sums right, SJG could release a core set of about a dozen books, then release a GURPS PDF once a week for 5-7 years for what looks like a minimal investment(?). Even if they don't sell, this is a constant flow of advertising to a huge group of gamers that otherwise wouldn't know GURPS (still) exists.
OK, maybe one PDF once a week isn't the best approach and mini-bundles would be better, but there's a huge back-catalogue, and I imagine many of them are barely selling in the single-figures, so why not open up to lower-margin sales with bonus exposure?

Open rules - Even if we'll never get the full (or partial) rules as an open license, SJGs blessing for authors to include stat blocks (with some 'How to' advice) might encourage indie publishers to include GURPS stats alongside other systems. For stronger support, add a requirement to include a link to a review thread in a SJG 'community' forum, where the existing GURPS community can review and suggest improvements in support of indie releases.

Settings - A good, fun, kitchen-sink Action setting would be interesting. It'll never happen, but I've been watching some of the Lego animated series (Ninjago, Nexo Kights) - these have a mix of Martial Arts, Magic, Chi powers, Tech, etc. and have potential to show-off the flexibility of GURPS (yes, I know - not a realistic proposal, and probably the wrong age group, but hey, I can dream).

[ericbsmith]

Originally Posted by evileeyore

And here lies a problem... too many settings to be done by a small publisher.

Yup. There are already a lot of setting books, and more setting articles. The idea here is to have a few well supported settings that can show off a simplified ruleset and draw in new people. Ideally a Fantasy and a Space Opera/Sci-Fi setting would be a good place to start; Traveller used to fill part of that niche (although it never tried to simplify the GURPS rules) but now that the license is gone another Space Opera setting would be good.

Reign of Steel just popped to mind because of the possibilities it offered, including some cross-genre expansion and the relative popularity of the setting.

Originally Posted by kabson

Settings - A good, fun, kitchen-sink Action setting would be interesting. It'll never happen, but I've been watching some of the Lego animated series (Ninjago, Nexo Kights) - these have a mix of Martial Arts, Magic, Chi powers, Tech, etc. and have potential to show-off the flexibility of GURPS (yes, I know - not a realistic proposal, and probably the wrong age group, but hey, I can dream).

Actually, that idea has some legs. With some finagling it could incorporate Dark Horror and secret Psi along with the other things you mention, and secret Illuminati groups pushing different agendas from the different aspects. And maybe some MIB running around trying to put out the brush fires so the public doesn't find out.

This actually has some basic parallels in concept with the World of Darkness where you have Vampire, Werewolf, and Mage societies sharing the same world, all doing their own things amongst themselves, but also with the occasional overlap where a Werewolf runs into a coterie of Vampires or some-such.

[ericbsmith]

Originally Posted by ericbsmith

Actually, that idea has some legs.

Taking off on that idea, here's my "proposal" for how I would do a multi-book series release, were I put in charge of such a thing. I know this will never happen, but I can dream.

GURPS CORE
The Basic Set boiled down to approximately 128 pages. Maybe a little more, but the shorter the better while incorporating all of the important rules (certainly no more than 240 pages; I'd have to start with my axe before figuring this out for sure). GURPS Core will be a subset of the Basic Set, should be geared towards modern day/sci-fi and mundane. All Exotic and Paranormal abilities are removed. Almost all enhancements and limitations would be removed. Combat rules would include just the basic Combat Chapter. The idea here is to get a fully functional rules set which other books can rely on in a slimmed down and easier to digest format. If customers want more there will be the current two-volume Basic Set.

GURPS Core: Adventurers
A book of modern day adventurers. 32 pages. About 12-15 templates built on approximately 125 points, -20 in Disads. Plus a dozen Motivational Lenses built on 25 point with -15 points in Disads. This will cover your standard swath of modern and basic sci-fi character types, the Soldier, Doctor, Police Officer, Pilot, Driver, Techy, etc. They would be built entirely with traits from GURPS Core, and should be flexible enough that, for example, the Techy can double as a ships mechanic or a starter Gadgeteer while the Soldier doubles a Mercenary, all depending on what choices are made.

Core and Core: Adventurers could be sold together as a modern day RPG all on their own (indeed, they may as well be printed as one book). Core: Adventurers would be sold separately as well, for people who already own the Basic Set.


SHADOW WARS CYCLE
This is not a book, it's a game world framework and campaign setting. Set in a "modern day" Earth evil powers abound, hidden in the shadows just out of sight of the media and just beyond the psyche of the average person. They manipulate and try to control us. They use and abuse us.

Each book in the Shadow Wars Cycle will detail different groups struggling to control and win the Shadow Wars. Each book will include their own character creation rules additions as well as a world description for that aspect of the Shadow War. Possible expansion books would include:
Secret Psi, Modern Magik,Madness Dossier, Tiger and the Dragon, Men in Black,

Character Templates in each book would be a Power Lens to be added to an Adventurer template from Core: Adventurers. Of course, if necessary new Adventurer templates and Motivational lenses can be added in the expansion books. These should be written in such a way . New and different Powers can be added in each expansion book.


THE STARDUST CYCLE
This would start out with a worldbook release. A nice, fluffy open-world galaxy spanning Space Opera setting. A great war is looming, but great things are happening in the background. Most of that will be detailed in expansions (e.g. the machinations of the Evil Empire might be covered in an appropriate expansion book). Character creation would basically be using the Core: Adventurer templates, possibly with some extra lenses. The basic game could be played using Core+Adventurers. Spaceships combat would use a subset of the GURPS Spaceships rules, and ships would be built using the construction rules from Spaceships, but if you want to build your own spaceships buy and use GURPS Spaceships. Weapons and armor can be grabbed from Ultra-Tech.

Possible expansions would include:
Cyber-Tech, Bug Hunters, Aliens Races, Psionic Institute, Evil Empire, Corporate State, The Great War, etc.


These are just my mad scribbling's based on a couple hours of thinking. The basic idea here, however, is to take the "toolkit" approach that GURPS currently has and turn it more into a ready to grab toolbox, with everything you'll need to play one particular game.

[Rasputin]

Originally Posted by whswhs

I don't think there was ever a chance of SJ Games getting a Harry Potter license, given Rowling's lack of enthusiasm (at the time) for anything like fanfiction; after all, RPGs are a device for doing improvised fanfic, among other things. There is also the issue of the cost of getting a license for an incredibly hot property.

I think this is obvious and you know this, but for everyone else, I was using Harry Potter as an example. The point is to catch onto a rising property, which requires some luck. It could be GURPS Game of Thrones made in 2010.

Originally Posted by whswhs

I'd also suggest that two of the big waves of RPGs did not at all come from specific licenses. Rather, they came from games that appealed to people who had read certain material. D&D targeted people who had read the first fantasy wave of the sixties and seventies, and especially Tolkien (which is why it had elves, dwarves, hobbits, orcs, ents, balrogs, dragons, and wizards—and yes, I know they call them "halflings," "treants," and "type so-and-so demons," but the copy I owned back in the seventies used the LotR names, before the Tolkien estate threatened them with lawyers). Vampire: The Masquerade targeted Anne Rice fans. In both cases, you had a wave of people coming into gaming who wanted "something like" the source material, but weren't obsessive literary geeks who had to have all the details included.

Now this is an important observation, and a good one.

[robertsconley]

Originally Posted by evileeyore

I don't know who has been claiming they are sandboxes (or what definition they are using) but they are not sandboxes

First off Paizo's Kingmaker is explicitly structured as a sandbox campaign. As for the rest it depends, most are hybrids. With some portions of the path are linear and some are not.

With Wizards it is a little different than Paizo. Some of their adventure books are basically a super module like Ravenloft and the Yawning Portal. Because of the single book (or two in case of the first one) format they always present a hybrid format. With a mix of adventures sites, mini settings, and side quests.

The point for GURPS is that it diversified to the point that there are dozens of examples of different ways of writing adventures. In the past 17 there is no stereotypical format for every bad example there is a good example and dozens of others in-between with different strengths and weaknesses.