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Old 12-24-2008, 10:16 AM   #21
Kuroshima
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Default Re: Translation problems in new GURPS Lite Spanish

  • p12, under "Corto de Vista", "lentes de Contactos" -> "lentillas" or "Lentes de Contacto" [Grammar]
  • p13, under "Desventajas", "Irreflexion" -> "Impulsivo" or "Impulsividad" [Style]
  • p13, under "Juramento", "Juramento Mayor Vow:" -> "Juramento Mayor:" [Leftover Word]
  • p14, under "Desventajas", "Pretencioso" -> "Exceso de Confianza" or "Sobreconfiado". The translation is correct but doesn't fit the style, in that the disadvantages are named using nouns instead of adjectives. Also, "exceso de confianza" was used in 3er ed ¿IIRC? and is a more direct translation, better for people who pick Lite in Spanish and then get core books in English [Style]
  • p16, under "Aprovechar", "Localozas" -> "Localizas" [Misspelling]
  • p16, under "Arma Cuerpo a Cuerpo", "DS/Varies" -> "DS/Varias" (This happens in ever possible ocasion) [Leftover word]
  • p16, under "Mayales", "Escudar" -> "Bloquear" [Mistranslation]
  • p16, under "Arma de Proyectiles", "DS/Varies" -> "DS/Varias" (This happens in ever possible ocasion) [Leftover word]
  • p17, under "Habilidades", "Caminar" -> "Marcha" Caminar literally means walking. [Style]
  • p17, under "Ciencias Naturales", "Atronomía" -> "Astronomia" (Search it with "Atron", as it is split between lines) [Misspelling]
  • p17, under "Habilidades", "Conocimiento de area" -> Should at least be changed to "Conocimiento del area" to meet grammar. It sounds sily in Spanish, but correct. The alternatives pose problems since they convey a specific size of the area, and thus won't work well at both city- and galaxy-wide area knowledges (Conocimiento Local, Conocimiento Regional,...). [Grammar]
  • p17, under "Criminología", "studio" -> "Éstudio" [Misspelling]
  • p18, under "Fotografía", "Reveler" -> "Revelar" [Misspelling]
  • p18, under "La Calle", "Criminals" -> "Criminales" [Misspelling]
  • p18, under "Karate", "daño frontal basico" -> ??? (Should be thrust damage, and it's something that I could never find a decent translation for, but Frontal is even worse than 3rd ed's Acometida, that at least made some sense) [Mistranslation]
  • p18, under "Lanzar", "baseball" -> "béisbol" [Leftover word]
  • p19, under "Matutear", "active" -> "activa" [Leftover word]
  • p19, under "Matutear", "buscadires" -> "buscadores" [Misspelling]
  • p19, under "Mecánica", "ordinaries" -> "ordinarias" [Misspelling]
  • p19, under "Medicina", "prescribir drogas" -> "prescribir medicamentos" or "recetar medicamentos". Drogas in general refers to recreational drugs [Style]
  • p19, under "Montar", "lamontura" -> "la montura" [Misspelling]
  • p19, under "Natación", "contr" -> "contra" [Misspelling]
  • p19, under "Naturalista", "localizer" -> "localizar" [Misspelling]
  • p19, under "Ocultar", "onjetos" -> "objetos" [Misspelling]
  • p19, under "Oratoria", "inciter" -> "incitar" [Misspelling]
  • p20, under "Saltar", "entrenadao" -> "Entrenado" [Misspelling]
  • p20, under "Saltar", "intents" -> "intentes" [Misspelling]
  • p20, under "Sigilo", "o moverte" -> "o te permite moverte" [Missing Word]
  • p20, under "Traje medioambiental", "clse" -> "clase" [Misspelling]
  • p20, under "Trampas", "construer" -> "construir" [Misspelling]
  • p20, under "Desventajas", "Habilidades de Vehiculos" -> "Manejo de Vehiculos" Also, this skill isn't where it should be, by alphabetic order[Style]
  • p20, under "Habilidades de Vehiculos", "DS/Varies" -> "DS/Varias" (This happens in ever possible ocasion) [Leftover word]

I'll continue adding errors as I find them. This was nowhere near being ready for publication, errors with the boxed texts notwithstanding, and it pains me to see it like this.
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Old 12-24-2008, 10:31 AM   #22
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Default Re: Translation problems in new GURPS Lite Spanish

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Jackson
(SJ throws his hat on floor and stomps on it)

Okay, yes, there is definitely a problem. (...)
Thank you Steve for hearing us ;^)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Jackson
(...) Has anyone noticed any problems with sections OTHER than the sections in boxes? If so, which ones?
I saw a good deal of erratum, typos and improper use of the Spanish language in GURPS Lite Spanish, so I think the entire document (not only the boxes) would need serious effort of checking and correction.

Kuroshima and Almafeta: having a decent GURPS Lite Spanish is important for GURPS and for Spanish-speaking people, even if the other books are in English.

So, myself lacking of time, I want to sincerely thank you both for the voluntary work you are doing here.

Nevertheless I can point these small things (apologies for possible repetitions). Some of them are purely issues of opinion, though:
  • Where the document says: "raza: La especie a la cual perteneces. Personajes no humanos (elfos, enanos, medianos, y Marcianos, por ejemplo) son comunes en los JdRs", I'm not sure "Marcianos" (Martians) should use here a capital letter M.
  • Where the PDF says: "Si quieress más características de las que te puedes permitir con el total de puntos provisto por tu DJ", the word "quieress" should be "quieres".
  • This is only a suggestion. Under: "Los Puntos de Impacto (PI) representan la capacidad de tu cuerpo para sufrir lesiones. Tu puntuación de PI es igual a tu FZ. Por ejemplo, FZ 10 confiere 10 PI.", I see "Puntos de Impacto" as a too literal translation of the English "Hit Points". It is usually translated into Spanish as "Puntos de Golpe", but I think "Puntos de Vida" can be suited, too.
  • Under: "Odiosos Hábitos Personales", I think "Hábitos Personales Odiosos", while still is very literal, is a more proper usage.
  • Under: "Ser tecnológicamente avanzado o dotado en lenguas son ventajas. Las insuficiencias en estas áreas son pueden ser una desventaja limitante.", it is needed to choose between "son" or "pueden ser", but not both in the same phrase. More subjectively: also, saying "una desventaja limitante" could be (IMHO) improved substituting that with "una desventaja limitativa".
  • I would translate "Difícil de Matar" as "Duro de Matar". The trait is "Hard to Kill". Yes, this is subjective, too.
  • "Defensas Intensas" corresponds with "Enhanced Defenses". I would translate it as "Defensas Mejoradas".
  • "Irreflexión", corresponding with "Impulsiveness", has a straight translation to Spanish: "Impulsividad".

And so on. This small list comes from a quick glance of the text.

PS: However, I personally prefer the new translation of Healt (HT) as "Salud". The earlier (third ed) Spanish translation under The Factoría de Ideas was "Vigor", what I understood better as related to Strength. Anyway this is point is very subjective.
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Last edited by demonsbane; 12-25-2008 at 03:19 PM. Reason: typos!
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Old 12-24-2008, 10:48 AM   #23
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Default Re: Translation problems in new GURPS Lite Spanish

Just two things (there are more, but time is lacking):
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuroshima
[list][*]p13, under "Juramento", "Juramento Mayor Vow:" -> "Juramento Mayor:" [Leftover Word]
May be better options here "Juramento Importante", "Juramento Grave" o "Juramento Serio"?

Quote:
[*]p18, under "Karate", "daño frontal basico" -> ??? (Should be thrust damage, and it's something that I could never find a decent translation for, but Frontal is even worse than 3rd ed's Acometida, that at least made some sense) [Mistranslation]
The Spanish translation of Thrust/Swing damage is a bit tricky. Thrust could be, along with "Acometida", "Estocada", thus Thrust Damage would be "Daño de Estocada".
I find the current translation of Swing Damage ("Daño Lateral" in the document) as very unfortunate. It is as reading "Lateral Damage"...

Quote:
I'll continue adding errors as I find them. This was nowhere near being ready for publication, errors with the boxed texts notwithstanding, and it pains me to see it like this.
Thanks for your effort.
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Old 12-24-2008, 10:54 AM   #24
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Default Re: Translation problems in new GURPS Lite Spanish

Quote:
Originally Posted by demonsbane
The Spanish translation of Thrust/Swing damage is a bit tricky. Thrust could be, along with "Acometida", "Estocada", thus Thrust Damage would be "Daño de Estocada".
I find the current translation of Swing Damage ("Daño Lateral" in the document) as very unfortunate. It is as reading "Lateral Damage"...
Swing Damage could be, temporarily, "Daño de Hendir".

Thrust Damage could be, temporarily too, "Daño de Clavar"

(ahem).

Perhaps this can be helpful in some degree for revolving around this issue...
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Old 12-24-2008, 10:58 AM   #25
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Default Re: Translation problems in new GURPS Lite Spanish

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuroshima
I'm no profesional editor, just a native Spanish speaker with a reasonable knowledge of English. My methodology might be incorrect, or my explanations might be less than clear. Sorry about that.
I have professional experience translating from English to Spanish.

Honest, IMHO you are doing this very well!
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Old 12-24-2008, 11:20 AM   #26
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Default Re: Translation problems in new GURPS Lite Spanish

Quote:
Originally Posted by demonsbane
I have professional experience translating from English to Spanish.

Honest, IMHO you are doing this very well!
Thanks.

BTW, my head is about to explode, and I've only proofread 22 pages. I have a new-found respect for editors around the world. It would be less tiring to simply translate it myself. Editing is Hard Work(TM). In order to do what I'm doing, I do have Lite in english, Lite in Spanish, my text file with the list of errors, and the Real Academia de la Lengua Española dictionary (online edition) open side by side... I'm proofreading up to page 22, and leave it for tomorrow.

Here are the results fo my proofreading up to p22
  • p21, "Premiate Characteristic Punctos" textbox [Interlingua]
  • p21, "Initial Opulentia" textbox [Interlingua]
  • p21, under "Equipo", "Normaelmente" -> "normalmente" [Misspelling]
  • p21, under "Equipo", "ada" -> "cada" [Misspelling]
  • p21, under "Equipo", "determiner" -> "determinar" [Misspelling]
  • p22, under "Armaduras", "Incombramento e Movimiento" [Interlingua]
  • p22, under "Armaduras", "Esquivar y Parar" -> "Esquiva y Parada" [Grammar/Style]
  • p22, under "Tabla de Armaduras", "pesodel" -> "peso del" [Misspelling]
  • p22, in the actual armor table, "Armadura" -> "Placas" [Mistranslation]
  • p22, in the actual armor table, "Chaqueta de Vuelo" -> "Chaleco antiBalas" [Mistranslation]
  • p22, in the actual armor table, "Chaleco Antibalas" -> "Traje Balistico" [Mistranslation]
  • p22, in the actual armor table, "Chaleco Tacticalo" -> "Traje Tactico" (Not so sure about this one, I don't have enough knowledge on military equipment to give a better translation) [Mistranslation]
  • p22, under "Escudos", "peri" -> "pero" [Misspelling]
  • p22, under "Escudos", "pero aún puedes acarrear un objeto." -> "pero puede sostener un objeto" [Style/Grammar]
  • p22, under "Escudos", "defense active (Escudar, Esquivar y Parar) sin especial esfuerzo" -> "defensa activa (Bloqueo, Esquiva y Parada) sin necesidad de realizar ninguna acción especial" [Style/Mistranslation]
  • p22, under "Escudos", "para escudar; véase Escudar" -> "para bloquear; véase Bloqueo" [Mistranslation]
  • p22, under "Escudos", "active" -> "activa" [Leftover word]
  • p22, under "Armas", "el.38" -> "el .38" (though the whole part of the sentence should be rewritten, as it doesn't sound right - you don't call guns by their callibers alone - nor matches the original text "a detective’s snub-nosed .38". I would translate it as "el revolver del 38 del detective") [Misspelling]
  • p22, under "Armas", "luchar o cazar?" -> "lucha o caza?" [Grammar]
  • p22, under "Armas", "como la distancia, índice de disparo, y precisión" -> "como el alcance, la cadencia de tiro, y la precisión" [Mistranslation]
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Old 12-24-2008, 11:22 AM   #27
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Default Re: Translation problems in new GURPS Lite Spanish

I am not a native Spanish speaker...though I do have a bit of Spanish facility. Not much though.

All I wanted to say was that the work that you native speakers are doing to fix errors in Spanish Lite is inspiring and awesome!
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Old 12-24-2008, 11:47 AM   #28
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Default Re: Translation problems in new GURPS Lite Spanish

Quote:
Originally Posted by trooper6
I am not a native Spanish speaker...though I do have a bit of Spanish facility. Not much though.

All I wanted to say was that the work that you native speakers are doing to fix errors in Spanish Lite is inspiring and awesome!
What's really UNinspiring is the amount of errors that I'm finding. I knew it was bad when I started, but this is getting ridiculous. I hope that the other translations are better than this one...
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Old 12-25-2008, 04:11 AM   #29
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Default Re: Translation problems in new GURPS Lite Spanish

A new batch of corrections!
  • p23, under "Arma", "caliber" -> "calibre" [Misspelling]
  • p23, under "Daño", daño básico frontal (frt) o lateral (ltl) -> ??? (We need better translations for Swing and Thrust. 3rd ed used Thrust->"Acometida", that was mostly ok, and Swing->"Mandoble", that was not, as it means two handed sword) [Misstranslation]
  • p23, under "Daño", "Tabla de Basic Damno" [Interlingua]
  • p23, under "Tipo de Daño", the translator used Impalling->"Penetrante", and Piercing->"Punzante". Better translations would have been Impalling->"Punzante" and Piercing->"Perforante". 3rd ed used Impalling->"Empalante", but "Empalante" is closely tied to the actual impalling, while "Punzante" is the term used for things that can poke holes into something [Style]
  • p23, under "Alcance", "armas de fuerza manual" -> "armas basadas en la fuerza del que las blande" (Longer, but armas de fuerza manual sounds completely stupid) [Style]
  • p23, under "Armas", "IdF (Indice de Fuego)" -> "CdT (Candencia de Tiro) (Indice de fuego is what you whould get if you used babelfish to translate... [Mistranslation]
  • p23, under "Disparos", "dispón" -> "prepara" (Ready should be "Preparar", "Disponer" can have a similar meaning, but it's mostly used as as "Arrange") [Style]
  • p23, under "Disparos", "Disponer" -> "Preparar" [Style]
  • p24, under "Ballestas y FZ", "Ballestasde" -> "ballestas de" [Misspelling]
  • p24, under "Armas Cuerpo a Cuerpo", "frontal o lateralmente." -> ??? (Another Thrust/Swing issue) [Misstrasnlation]
  • p24, under "Notas", "Armas de Fuerza Manual a Distancia" -> "Armas a Distancia basadas en la fuerza del que las blande" (First at all, there's the whole "Fuerza Manual", that isn't a good translation for muscle powered, and then we have the problem that the words are in the wrong order) [Misstranslation]
  • p24, in the weapon table, "Espadon Frontal" -> "Espadon de punta afilada" [Mistranslation]
  • p25, under "Armas", "Armas de Fuerza Manual a Distancia" -> "Armas a Distancia basadas en la fuerza del que las blande" [Misstranslation]
  • p25, under "Armas de Fuerza Manual a Distancia", "armas de fuerza manual a distancia" -> "armas a distancia basadas en la fuerza del que las blande" [Misstranslation]
  • p25, the table heading, "Tabla de Armas de Fuerza Manual a Distancia" -> "Tabla de Armas a Distancia basadas en la fuerza del que las blande" [Misstranslation]
  • p25, in the weapon table, "Short Bow" -> "Arco Corto" [Leftover word]
  • p25, in the weapon table, "ARMA ARROJADIZA (HACHA/MAZA) (DS-4)", "ARMA ARROJADIZA (CUCHILLO) (DS-4)" and "ARMA ARROJADIZA (LANZA) (DS-4)" don't use the proper letter style [Layout]
  • p25, in the weapon table, "Cuchillo Grandefr" -> "Cuchillo Grande" (the fr corresponds to what is in the next column) [Misspelling]
  • p25, under "Notas", "maniobras Disponer de un segundo." -> "maniobras de Preparar de un segundo." [Style/Grammar]
  • p25, under "Armas de Fuego", "Pistol Table" -> "Tabla de Pistolas" [Leftover word]
  • p25, under "Armas de Fuego", "Rifle and Shotgun Table" -> "Tabla de Rifles y Escopetas" [Leftover word]
  • p25, in the ranged weapon table, "Rifle Francotirador" -> "Rifle de Francotirador" [Missing word]
  • p26, "Incombramento e Movimento" textbox [Interlingua]
  • p26, under "Logros Físicos", "Básico de Levantamiento" -> "Levantamiento Basico" [Mistranslation]
  • p26, under "Escalar", "saque" -> "saques" [Grammar]
  • p26, the climbing table is in Interlingua [Interlingua]
  • p26, under "Caminando", "Incombramento e Movimiento" [Interlingua]
  • p26, under "Caminando", "Lesiones General" -> "Lesiones Generales" [Grammar]
  • p26, under "Caminando", "habilidad Caminar" -> "habilidad Marcha" [Style]
  • p26, under "Caminando", "denso,<line break>selva," -> The line break should not be here [Layout]
  • p27, "Regular Questiones Del Regulas" textbox [Interlingua]
  • p27, under "Saltar", "saltar sobre algo más pequeño que tú," -> "saltar sobre algo más mucho pequeño que tú," [Missing word]
  • p27, under "Saltar", "El máximo a saltar corriendo es dos veces el máximo sin correr." -> "La altura maxima de salto con carrerilla es dos veces la altura de salto sin correr" [Sentence]
  • p27, under "Saltar", "La máxima distancia corriendo es dos veces el máximo sin correr." -> "La maxima longitud del salto con carrerilla es dos veces la longitud de salto sin correr" [Sentence]
  • p27, under "Correr", "Incombramento e Movimiento" [Interlingua]
  • p27, under "Correr", "al ritmo marcado corriendo" -> "corriendo marcando el ritmo" [Sentence]
  • p27, under "Lanzar", "maniobras de Disponer" -> "Maniobras de Preparar" [Style]
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Last edited by Kuroshima; 12-25-2008 at 06:03 AM.
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Old 12-25-2008, 11:35 AM   #30
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Default Re: Translation problems in new GURPS Lite Spanish

The next batch is ready!
  • p28, under "Tabla de Daño por Objetos", "Frontal" -> ??? [Mistranslation]
  • p28, under "Tabla de Daño por Objetos", "Tabla de Basic Damno" [Interlingua]
  • p28, under "Tabla de Daño por Objetos", "onjeto" -> "Objeto" [Misspelling]
  • p28, in the actual table, "da-o" -> "daño" [Misspelling]
  • p29, under "Chequeos de Pánico", "tner" -> "tener" [Misspelling]
  • p29, under "Maniobras", "Ataque al máximo" -> "Ataque Total" (It's the term used in the 3rfd ed spanish translation, and in many other RPGs. It is also refered that way under Combate/Ataque) [Style]
  • p29, under "Maniobras", "Defensa al máximo" -> "Defensa Total" (It's the term used in the 3rfd ed spanish translation, and in many other RPGs, multiple times in the section) [Style]
  • p29, under "Maniobras", "Disponer" -> "Preparar" [Mistranslation]
  • p29, under "Movimiento", "Gratuite Acciones" [Interlingua]
  • p30, under "Cambiar de Posición", "lentifica" -> "ralentiza" [Style]
  • p30, under "Cambiar de Posicion", "(cara arriba o abajo)" -> "(boca arriba o abajo)"
  • p30, "Gratuite Actiones" textbox [Interlingua]
  • p30, under "Apuntar", "Ataque al Máximo" -> "Ataque Total" [Style]
  • p30, under "Un arma de fuego o una ballesta están aseguradas si puedes apoyarlas" -> "Un arma de fuego o una ballesta está asegurada si puedes apoyarla" [Grammar]
  • p30, under "Ataque", "Para utilizar un arma, esta debe ser dispuesta" -> "Para utilizar un arma, esta debe ser preparada" [Style]
  • p30, under "Si escogiste una maniobra de Apuntar (p. 30) Si escogiste una maniobra de Apuntar." -> "Si escogiste una maniobra de Apuntar (p. 30) en el turno anterior, tendrás el bono a impactar." [Mistranslation]
  • p30, under "Combate", "Ataque al Máximo" -> "Ataque Total" [Style]
  • p30, under "Ataque al máximo", "un arma dispuesta" -> "un arma preparada" [Style]
  • p30, under "Doble", "si tienes dos armas dispuestas o un arma que no tiene que ser redispuesta tras usarla." -> "si tienes dos armas praparadas o un arma que no tiene que ser preparada tras usarla."
  • p30, under "Doble", "Ataque con una segunda arma" -> "Los ataque con una segunda arma" [Grammar]
  • p30, under "Doble", "Manetate" [Interlingua]
  • p30, under "Énergico", "Esto solo es aplicable a ataque cuerpo a cuerpo frontales o laterales basados en FZ." -> "Esto solo es aplicable a ataque cuerpo a cuerpo ??? o ??? basados en FZ." [Mistranslation]
  • p30, under "Movimiento y Ataque", "dispuesta" -> "preparada" [Mistranslation]
  • p31, "Combatto sin Armas" textbox [Interlingua]
  • p31, under "Combate", "Defensa al Máximo" -> "Defensa Total" [Style]
  • p31, under "Defensa al Máximo", "¡especialmente enemigos que gusten de Ataques al Máximo!" -> "¡especialmente enemigos que gusten de hacer Ataques Totales!" [Sentence]
  • p31, under "Defensa al Máximo", "Defensa Intensificada:" -> "Defensa Mejorada:" [Mistranslation]
  • p31, under "Defensa Intesificada", "Esquivar, Parar o Escudar" -> "Esquiva, Parada o Bloqueo" [Mistranslation]
  • p31, under "Doble Defensa", "escudar" -> "bloquear" [Mistranslation]
  • p31, under "Combate", "Disponer" -> "Preparar" [Style]
  • p31, under "Disponer", "maniobra de Disponer" -> "maniogra de Preparar" (Multiple times in the section) [Style]
  • p31, under "Ataque", "dispuesta" -> "preparada" [Style]
  • p31, under "Ataque", "tirada de defense" -> "tirada de defensa" [Misspelling]

I'm going to take a break, only 8 pages remaining!
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