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Old 11-03-2016, 12:38 AM   #11
sir_pudding
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Questions about Warp and Ally

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Originally Posted by Ghostdancer View Post
I'm sorry, but your wrong. Can be turned is sometimes a feature and yet GURPS Zombies (p. 66) lists it as a possible quirk. Being susceptible to banishment could be a setting feature (as could any trait) worth 0-points or a quirk.
Well, it probably should be consistent with the same creature type in the campaign.
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Old 11-03-2016, 12:41 AM   #12
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Questions about Warp and Ally

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Originally Posted by sir_pudding View Post
Well, it probably should be consistent with the same creature type in the campaign.
I agree with this completely. Unless there is a real reason - pick one method and go with that.
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Old 11-03-2016, 12:50 AM   #13
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Questions about Warp and Ally

One general thought I've had for Ally with the Magical limitation - it's probably reasonable for lack of the power source to turn off the Ally part of the trait without making the physical presence of the being go away! That summoned demon is still standing there, it's just that it now doesn't have any supernaturally-imposed allegiance to you anymore... Of course, that sort of switch should be established when the player buys the trait, not sprung on them later. Still, it can make for an interesting change to ring on Summonable Allies.
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Old 11-03-2016, 12:54 AM   #14
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Questions about Warp and Ally

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Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen View Post
One general thought I've had for Ally with the Magical limitation - it's probably reasonable for lack of the power source to turn off the Ally part of the trait without making the physical presence of the being go away! That summoned demon is still standing there, it's just that it now doesn't have any supernaturally-imposed allegiance to you anymore... Of course, that sort of switch should be established when the player buys the trait, not sprung on them later. Still, it can make for an interesting change to ring on Summonable Allies.
Another way to do this may be to use the No-Mana Shutdown disadvantage from GURPS Thaumatology (p. 119) as a part of a "Summoned" meta-trait.
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Old 11-03-2016, 01:00 AM   #15
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Questions about Warp and Ally

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Another way to do this may be to use the No-Mana Shutdown disadvantage from GURPS Thaumatology (p. 119) as a part of a "Summoned" meta-trait.
That would shut the summoned being down, though, whereas I'm talking about the wizard's summoned demon walking into the no-mana zone, getting a thoughtful look on its face, turning back to the party, and saying "I'd like to renegotiate my contract."
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Old 11-03-2016, 01:05 AM   #16
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Questions about Warp and Ally

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That would shut the summoned being down, though, whereas I'm talking about the wizard's summoned demon walking into the no-mana zone, getting a thoughtful look on its face, turning back to the party, and saying "I'd like to renegotiate my contract."
Ahhhh! I see. Hmmm. That's Reprogrammable with Mana-Sensitive/Magical modifier.

Edit: Also, "Summonable (Magical, -10%), +90%."
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Old 11-03-2016, 10:44 AM   #17
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Questions about Warp and Ally

So I'm calling vulnerability to being dispelled a feature, because magical summoned creatures can gain traits that otherwise wouldn't be available to players. This will probably make dispelling magic more common, since summoned creatures can be pretty powerful.

Another question has occurred to me with using Ally in Sorcery. In general if something shuts down one aspect of your alternate ability, all of it is shut down. Sorcery is just an applied version of alternate abilities, so it's got the same caveat attached. When a conjured creature is "killed" they cannot be recalled for a full day, would this count as Ally being shut down (and thus prevent all other spell casting)? The same question applies to the appearance roll, does failing this prevent spell casting for the rest of the day?
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Old 11-03-2016, 11:36 AM   #18
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Questions about Warp and Ally

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So I'm calling vulnerability to being dispelled a feature, because magical summoned creatures can gain traits that otherwise wouldn't be available to players. This will probably make dispelling magic more common, since summoned creatures can be pretty powerful.

Another question has occurred to me with using Ally in Sorcery. In general if something shuts down one aspect of your alternate ability, all of it is shut down. Sorcery is just an applied version of alternate abilities, so it's got the same caveat attached. When a conjured creature is "killed" they cannot be recalled for a full day, would this count as Ally being shut down (and thus prevent all other spell casting)? The same question applies to the appearance roll, does failing this prevent spell casting for the rest of the day?
No. It's not that you can't use the summoning power again. It's just that there's nothing there to summon at the moment.
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Old 11-03-2016, 12:58 PM   #19
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Questions about Warp and Ally

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Originally Posted by Ghostdancer View Post
Ahhhh! I see. Hmmm. That's Reprogrammable with Mana-Sensitive/Magical modifier.

Edit: Also, "Summonable (Magical, -10%), +90%."
I'd actually argue, as I suggested above, that there doesn't have to be a modifier on Summonable to do this. The way I see it, Ally as an advantage is providing an NPC who is loyal to you. I think it's reasonable to say that the Magical limitation on Ally itself can be interpreted to be limiting the "loyalty" bit, rather than the "physical presence" bit.

All this discussion of summoned Allies being magically bound is making me think that there should probably be a variant on the Conjured enhancement where, instead of a reaction roll when you conjure the new ally, it's a contest of Will instead. That's probably the usual Based on Will +20% enhancement, just applied to Conjured instead of the full Ally advantage, so turning it into a +120% enhancement.
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Old 11-03-2016, 02:38 PM   #20
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Default Re: [Sorcery] Questions about Warp and Ally

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Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen View Post
I'd actually argue, as I suggested above, that there doesn't have to be a modifier on Summonable to do this. The way I see it, Ally as an advantage is providing an NPC who is loyal to you. I think it's reasonable to say that the Magical limitation on Ally itself can be interpreted to be limiting the "loyalty" bit, rather than the "physical presence" bit.
Actually, Minion (Magical, -10%), +45% is a better fit in some cases. The critter doesn't go away in a no-mana zone, but your control does.

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Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen View Post
All this discussion of summoned Allies being magically bound is making me think that there should probably be a variant on the Conjured enhancement where, instead of a reaction roll when you conjure the new ally, it's a contest of Will instead. That's probably the usual Based on Will +20% enhancement, just applied to Conjured instead of the full Ally advantage, so turning it into a +120% enhancement.
Requires Will vs. Will roll is orth -15% - not +20%. But I like the idea.
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