[Psionic Powers] Psi version of Banish Spell

[binn05]

For my psionic DF campaign, I'm creating a Banish ability similar in concept to the banish spell.
I saw other people use Jumper and Warp to simulate the Banish spell with Sorcery rules, but as per Powers, p118, it says I can design the ability using paralysis and extended duration.

I a little confused with I design it the right, so if anyone can check my design, I'd appreciate the help. :D

Banish
Concentrate for 4 seconds and roll a Quick Contest of Wills against your foe. You must touch his skin and keep contact with it during all the concentrate maneuvers. If you succeed, it cannot come back to this plane until a week has passed. If it resists, you can only try again after one day has passed.

Banish
Affliction 1 (+255%) [35,5/level]
Paralysis, +150%; + Extended Duration, 3,000x, +140%, 1 week, per Powers, p118 - I changed the Permanent for 3,000x to better fit the concept.
Based on Will, +20%;
Fixed Duration, +0%;
Malediction 1, +100%;
[+410%]

Acessibility, Only on Extraplanars, -30%;
Contact Agent, -30%;
Cost Fatigue x4, -20%;
Increased Immunity 3 (1 day), -30%
Melee Attack, C, No Parry, -35%;
PM, -20%; - a modified version of the PM from DF14.
Takes Extra Time x2, -20%;
[-155]

I'm building it with levels similar to Psionic Powers abilities. Level 1 needs to touch bare skin. Level 2 any contact will do. Level 3, ranged as per Malediction 1. Level 4, Takes Extra Time 1, Level 5, remove TET.

[ericthered]

You don't need to base it on will if its already a malediction.

I'd look into invoking multiplicative multipliers if I could. This is a powerful ability, but its extremely difficult to pull off. You've got to concentrate for four seconds and then touch them on the skin, as well as spending a lot of FP.

Otherwise it looks good.

[kdtipa]

If your goal is a leveled thing that increases range instead of effectiveness, it feels like a clunky way to define it. In a campaign I run, I'd be tempted to just define my own thing, and base the cost on what I feel like is balanced against other abilities in the campaign. Maybe something like...

Banish
20 points
By concentrating for 5 seconds while touching the skin of an extraplanar being, spending 5 fatigue, and then winning a contest of Will with the being, you can send it back to its home plane. It cannot leave its home plane for 1d6+4 days.
Faster Banish (+2/level): each level of this modifier reduces the time by 1 second, to a minimum of 0 seconds, at which point it becomes a free action.
Slower Banish (-2/level): each level of this modifier (mutually exclusive with Faster Banish) increases the time it takes by 1 second. Cannot reduce total cost of Banish below 10 points.
Less Tiring Banish (+2/level): each level of this modifier reduces the fatigue cost of banishing by 1 point to a minimum of 0, at which point it costs you no fatigue.
Tiring Banish (-2/level): increases the fatigue cost by 1 per level (mutually exclusive with Less Tiring Banish). Cannot reduce total cost of Banish below 10 points.
Further Away (+2/level): At the first level, the touch will work through clothing and armor. At the second level, you merely need to be in C range (same hex). At the third level and beyond, it adds 1 yard to your range.
Longer Banishment (+5/level): Each level of this modifier adds 1d+4 days to the duration of the effect.

With a setup like that, you can skip fiddling with the rules in the book and just get exactly what you want. It's your campaign. If you think it's balanced, then give it a shot. If you really want to use the rules in the book, I think you have something pretty decent, but I think buying off the limitations for range and contact agent will be necessary instead of "levels" for changing the range. As it stands, it looks like your base ability would cost around 35 points.

The more I think about the rules as written and using them to accommodate this ability, the more I think I might start from the other direction, and give the base ability that costs a lot, and then offer limitations to make it more affordable, that they can buy off as they get more powerful...

RAW Banish
49 points per level
By concentrating for one second, and winning a contest of Will with an extraplanar being, you send it back to its home plane of existence. The target's will roll is: Will +1, -1 per level of the Banish ability. It cannot leave its home plane unless summoned by another being. It's stuck there permanently otherwise. It must convince someone to summon it to break the banishment.

Affliction 10/level

• Paralysis: modified to represent being moved to home plane (+150%)
• Based on Will (+20%)
• Extended Duration: Permanent until Summoned (+150%)
• Malediction: Makes your attack a Will roll, and suffer -1 per yard of range (+100%)
• Accessibility: Only on Extraplanar beings outside their home plane (-30%)
• total mod +390% = 49 points / level

Modifications for Banish
Calculating the percentage against the base cost of ten points per level gives me the cost of these modifiers, so a limitation that is worth -20% will means -2 points to the cost per level of the Affliction. It follows the RAW rules, but presents it a different way so players don't have to do the percent math. Basically, these listed costs modify the cost per level of Banish...

• Costs Fatigue (-2 per Fatigue): Each level of this modification means having to spend one point of fatigue per use of the Banish ability.
• Touch Only (-3): Based on the Melee Attack limitation, changing the range to C, so you have to be in reach, and can only use Banish if you succeed on a roll to grab them (assuming they are avoiding the touch). This might be mutually exclusive with Malediciton, but because there's no range, we can't really use reduced range either. It's probably fair and balanced to do this despite the oddity.
• Preparation Required: 1 hour (-5): Means you require an hour of prep work before you can do this.
• Preparation Required: 10 minutes (-3): Means you require ten minutes of prep work before you can do this.
• Preparation Required: 1 minute (-2): Means you require one minute of prep work before you can do this.
• Takes Extra Time (-1 per doubling): Because it normally takes your second of concentration, the base time is 1 second. Each level of Takes Extra Time doubles that amount. Level 1 means 2 seconds; level 2 means 4 seconds; level 3 means 8 seconds; and so on. Similar to Preparation Required in that it adds time before the effect, but Preparation required can happen well in advance, and Takes Extra Time must be done as part of your activation of the ability.

[kdtipa]

Originally Posted by ericthered

You don't need to base it on will if its already a malediction.

Malediction makes your attack roll based on your Will, but doesn't change the resistance attribute...

"... To determine if the attack succeeds, roll against your Will, applying the range penalties detailed below. Your foe may choose to resist; if so, resolve the attack as a Quick Contest of Will. You must win to affect the victim.
When enhancing an Affliction, the Quick Contest above replaces the usual
resistance roll. You roll against Will, but your target rolls against HT – or other attribute, if the attack has Based on (Different Attribute) – modified as usual for the Affliction."

[binn05]

Originally Posted by ericthered

You don't need to base it on will if its already a malediction.

I'd look into invoking multiplicative multipliers if I could. This is a powerful ability, but its extremely difficult to pull off. You've got to concentrate for four seconds and then touch them on the skin, as well as spending a lot of FP.

Otherwise it looks good.

Originally Posted by kdtipa

Malediction makes your attack roll based on your Will, but doesn't change the resistance attribute...

As kdtipa explained, the idea is for the foe to resist with its Will instead of HT.

Originally Posted by ericthered

I'd look into invoking multiplicative multipliers if I could.

What would be the difference? I never used multiplicative multipliers, how would I do it?

Originally Posted by ericthered

This is a powerful ability, but its extremely difficult to pull off. You've got to concentrate for four seconds and then touch them on the skin, as well as spending a lot of FP.

I'm trying to simulate Psionic Powers style of abilities, with different tiers removing drawbacks from the ability.

Originally Posted by ericthered

Otherwise it looks good.

Thank you.

[binn05]

Originally Posted by kdtipa

If your goal is a leveled thing that increases range instead of effectiveness, it feels like a clunky way to define it. In a campaign I run, I'd be tempted to just define my own thing, and base the cost on what I feel like is balanced against other abilities in the campaign. Maybe something like...

I like what you did, but I don't think it would be useful for my players. Besides one of them (maybe, not sure), the rest prefer a shop list of pre-made abilities instead of a lot of customization.

And since they are used to the Psionic Powers tier system, even if it is more work for me up front, it helps me in the long run when players are choosing psi abilities.

[kdtipa]

Originally Posted by binn05

... Besides one of them (maybe, not sure), the rest prefer a shop list of pre-made abilities instead of a lot of customization.

I understand. Several of my players are very new to role-playing, let alone GURPS, and I find myself doing a lot of work up front too.

RAW Banish, version 2
31 points
By concentrating for 4 seconds while touching your target's skin, spending 4 fatigue, and winning a contest of Will with an extraplanar being, you send it back to its home plane of existence. It cannot leave its home plane unless summoned by another being. It's stuck there permanently otherwise. It must convince someone to summon it to break the banishment, or it must happen by chance.

Affliction 10/level

• Paralysis: modified to represent being moved to home plane (+150%)
• Based on Will (+20%)
• Extended Duration: Permanent until Summoned (+150%)
• Malediction: Makes your attack a Will roll, and suffer -1 per yard of range (+100%)
• Accessibility: Only on Extraplanar beings outside their home plane (-30%)
• Costs Fatigue, level 4, 4 fatigue per use (-20%)
• Touch Skin Only, modified Melee Attack (-40%... C range, but you have to touch skin)
• Takes Extra Time, level 2, 4 seconds to use (-20%)

Total Modifier Percent: +310%

Additional levels of Banish
3 points / additional level
You can become better at banishing. The first level of improvement means you only need to spend 2 seconds concentrating, touch the target but can be through clothing, and spend 3 fatigue. The second level of improvement means you only need to spend 1 second concentrating, can be one yard away (but technically still have to make an attack because of melee weapon), and spend 2 fatigue. At the final allowed additional level, you can activate this as a free action from up to 2 yards away (still need the attack roll because of melee weapon, and have the -1 per yards away because of Malediction), and spend 1 fatigue.

Adjusted limitations for first level...

• Costs Fatigue, level 3, 3 fatigue per use (-15%)
• Touch Only, modified Melee Attack (-30%... C range, but you have to touch)
• Takes Extra Time, level 1, 2 seconds to use (-10%)

Total Difference from Base: 25% => 2.5 points... round to 3?

If fatigue cost goes down by 1 per upgrade, range increases to C, 1 (then c to 2, and c to 3), and takes extra time reduces so it takes 1 second, then free action? Maybe considering it reduced time? You have a Banish that costs a lot up front and doesn't cost much to improve. You can see how you'd just keep reducing the limitations to get the "next level".

Honestly... I don't like this official rules approach because the up front cost is huge, and the players have almost no reason not to spend the 9 points to improve it to max level where it becomes a free action (or maybe just an action that occurs on your turn instead of having to concentrate for a round). It feels unbalanced. But it meets the criteria of being pretty simple and improving in levels

[kdtipa]

I think you might be better off doing a custom power so that levels cost the same.

Banish
10 points / level
By concentrating for 5 seconds while touching the skin of an extraplanar being, spending 5 fatigue, and then winning a contest of Will with the being, you can send it back to its home plane. It cannot leave its home plane for 1d+4 days (I like this better than a fixed amount of time). Each additional level of this power reduces the concentration time by 1, to a minimum of 1 second; reduces the fatigue cost by 1 to a minimum of 1; and increases the duration of banishment by 1d+4 days. It also increases your reach for this ability incrementally. The first additional level means the touch can be through clothing and armor. The second level means being able to be 1 yard away (an adjacent hex). The third and fourth additional levels mean adding one yard to that range (so at max level you can be 3 yards away).

[ericthered]

Originally Posted by binn05

As kdtipa explained, the idea is for the foe to resist with its Will instead of HT.

Huh, I had that wrong in my head.

What would be the difference? I never used multiplicative multipliers, how would I do it?

Its an option on powers page 102. You add all of the positive modifiers, figure out a cost, and then apply the negative modifiers to that. Your cost after all of the positive modifiers would be [51]. Then you apply the negative modifiers, which are capped at -80%, and the final cost is [11].

Note that you don't get to apply about half of your modifiers. When someone has -155% in modifiers, I would look for point crocks, but this ability is actually that effectively limited. A version that only requires touch (not contact), doesn't require a windup, and doesn't cost FP would still be worth [11].

[binn05]

Originally Posted by ericthered

Huh, I had that wrong in my head.




Its an option on powers page 102. You add all of the positive modifiers, figure out a cost, and then apply the negative modifiers to that. Your cost after all of the positive modifiers would be [51]. Then you apply the negative modifiers, which are capped at -80%, and the final cost is [11].

Note that you don't get to apply about half of your modifiers. When someone has -155% in modifiers, I would look for point crocks, but this ability is actually that effectively limited. A version that only requires touch (not contact), doesn't require a windup, and doesn't cost FP would still be worth [11].

Ah, I see it now. The only problem would be that I would need to redo all the other abilities already in the campaign, lol.