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Old 07-11-2012, 08:36 AM   #501
philreed
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Default Re: 6e Car Wars, what do you want to see

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I'd like it to be a bit beefier than the original version, say the inclusion of things like wheel guards/hubs, paint sprayers, FOJ, Ram Plates, and a few other add-ons that became standards.
Yes, you get the idea. By having a narrower focus the game could pack more in a smaller and less expensive box.
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Old 07-11-2012, 12:52 PM   #502
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Default Re: 6e Car Wars, what do you want to see

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Yes, you get the idea. By having a narrower focus the game could pack more in a smaller and less expensive box.
I'm cool with that. A new addition of Truck Stop could add rules for 10 wheelers and big rigs. I'd also like to see couple of AADA vehicle guides, (I'd suggest PDF versions), at some point. As well as quarterly Uncle Al's updates (Spring, Summer, Winter, Fall) that SLOWLY introduce a few new products at a time, and keep damage creep to a minimum (No X-Ray Lasers, Gatling Cannons, tac nukes, etc.).
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Old 07-11-2012, 04:52 PM   #503
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Default Re: 6e Car Wars, what do you want to see

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As well as quarterly Uncle Al's updates (Spring, Summer, Winter, Fall) that SLOWLY introduce a few new products at a time, and keep damage creep to a minimum (No X-Ray Lasers, Gatling Cannons, tac nukes, etc.).
But how do you do that? 5 years and you've needed 20 full editions of Uncle Al's, each of which needs to have what, 5 or 6 new items? And if they're not better than the existing items, then who's going to buy those? OK, different not better maybe, but still, I think asking for that is going to land you right back in killer add-ons land.

I'd rather see supplements focus on different aspects of the game (like Truck Stop, racing, arena books, etc.) instead of new equipment for the same old same old. And if there were going to be a new equipment supplement, I'd rather it be bigger (vs. quarterly), less frequent, and better-playtested.
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Old 07-11-2012, 06:25 PM   #504
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Default Re: 6e Car Wars, what do you want to see

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But how do you do that? 5 years and you've needed 20 full editions of Uncle Al's, each of which needs to have what, 5 or 6 new items? And if they're not better than the existing items, then who's going to buy those? OK, different not better maybe, but still, I think asking for that is going to land you right back in killer add-ons land.

I'd rather see supplements focus on different aspects of the game (like Truck Stop, racing, arena books, etc.) instead of new equipment for the same old same old. And if there were going to be a new equipment supplement, I'd rather it be bigger (vs. quarterly), less frequent, and better-playtested.
I think this is a good point. From all I've read, one of the major problems with previous editions was power creep. And if you keep releasing piles of weapons, I don't know if you can avoid that. But new arenas, towns, cities, adventures (as individual modules, and possibly linked modules to form campaigns), sets of cars/trucks/cycles with matching quality counters, and so on -- I would think there's a lot of scope for that. And, every now and then, a new weapon or two that has, as you say, been extensively playtested to make sure it's not the new Hammer of God that nobody can stand against.
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Old 07-12-2012, 08:43 AM   #505
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Default Re: 6e Car Wars, what do you want to see

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Originally Posted by ammulder View Post
But how do you do that? 5 years and you've needed 20 full editions of Uncle Al's, each of which needs to have what, 5 or 6 new items? And if they're not better than the existing items, then who's going to buy those? OK, different not better maybe, but still, I think asking for that is going to land you right back in killer add-ons land.
And this is the big crux - keeping the rule creep in check. Design choices are good, but in moderation. Personally, I'd like the bulk of any expansions to be maps, counters, adventures - things that don't add new rules and options to the game.

Some new gadgets are good but it's important to keep them in check. If a quarterly 'zine of some sort is put back in place, limiting new gadgets to an average of 2 per issue might be a good benchmark.
enough to look forward to, but not enough to grossly expand what is available too quickly. Couple this with a new Uncle Al's Catalog every 3 years or so, collecting them up (and adding 8-12 new ones), would be about the right rate for those sorts of items to be added, IMO.

Big expansions (such as a truck stop expansion) would be another discussion - how much do you want to expand the rules via that route? Onviously you want to do it some, but how much is too much? I think Aeroduel and Tanks probably went over the line in being too much. Similarly, Boat Wars probably was too, but it has an obvious split that would make a good expansion size IMO - boats in one and hovercraft in another.
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Old 07-12-2012, 10:17 AM   #506
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Default Re: 6e Car Wars, what do you want to see

Agree with Mage and Mulder re: power creep. The last Uncle Al's were atrocious (Crystal/Catalytic Spikes, HT Motors) - these were obviously broken. HT Motors are particularly offensive since they destroy the distinction between gas and electric - for only $400... ugh

Remember the 'Oops we goofed' in the Uncle Al's, or the 'New and Improved' items - these were rules revisions made to things that were broken - but it was always ad hoc. It didn't seem like there was much in the way of quality control - or proper playtesting in advance to make sure bad stuff didn't happen in the first place.

I remember (I think it was a comment in an ADQ) something about how if everyone started doing the same thing then something was obviously wrong - like people layering component armor, laser guiding the old 15 shot VFRPs, everyone using HTMs, loading half loads of HD ammo into HMGs etc to make it a one space 2DD weapon, etc.

I'd like to see a modern system of feedback - like these message boards, an an online rule Compendium constantly updated to fix bad items and rules. If any item becomes a 'must have', nerf it.

On the flip side if an item is unused or underused then it probably needs a boost (like the poor AC which is badly overpriced - just compare it to a VMG with a half load of HD ammo).

If we have a good system in place to fix bad content we won't have to worry as much about the 'first draft' of a rebooted CW

Last edited by juris; 07-12-2012 at 10:28 AM.
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Old 07-12-2012, 11:20 AM   #507
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Default Re: 6e Car Wars, what do you want to see

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I'd like to see a modern system of feedback - like these message boards, an an online rule Compendium constantly updated to fix bad items and rules.
I'd rather all this be done ahead of time. Put all the stuff in at the beginning and you won't have to worry about creep down the line.
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Old 07-12-2012, 11:51 AM   #508
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Default Re: 6e Car Wars, what do you want to see

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I'd rather all this be done ahead of time. Put all the stuff in at the beginning and you won't have to worry about creep down the line.
There will always be something to add down the line. And for me, that is good - I'd rather have a game with long-term support and development rather than one big game that nothing else is ever done with.
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:06 PM   #509
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Default Re: 6e Car Wars, what do you want to see

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There will always be something to add down the line. And for me, that is good - I'd rather have a game with long-term support and development rather than one big game that nothing else is ever done with.
A suggestion in this regard. While there are clearly plenty of people who want a gradual development of technology, there are also people who like to play the base game. A way to accommodate both groups already exists, though it has to be designed into the base game to be effective.

That way is year-of-introduction, as used formally in Star Fleet Battles and less-formally in Battletech (where it was grafted on after things had already been changing for a while). Simply give each new bit of tech an in-game date, before which it can't be used. Then people who want all the latest shinies can declare their games to be up-to-the-minute, and people who want just the basic kit (or indeed Chassis-and-Crossbow) can easily set that up too, just by picking a single number rather than having to include or exclude each separate specific item.
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Old 07-12-2012, 02:34 PM   #510
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Default Re: 6e Car Wars, what do you want to see

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Originally Posted by ammulder View Post
But how do you do that? 5 years and you've needed 20 full editions of Uncle Al's, each of which needs to have what, 5 or 6 new items? And if they're not better than the existing items, then who's going to buy those? OK, different not better maybe, but still, I think asking for that is going to land you right back in killer add-ons land.

I'd rather see supplements focus on different aspects of the game (like Truck Stop, racing, arena books, etc.) instead of new equipment for the same old same old. And if there were going to be a new equipment supplement, I'd rather it be bigger (vs. quarterly), less frequent, and better-playtested.
I'm thinking one page Uncle Al's PDF, with no more than 3-4 items, if that. But I could also be talking out my rear.
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