Being self aware of mental disadvantages

[Balor Patch]

Originally Posted by Prince Charon

By definition, a Delusion is something you believe to be true, that other people don't. Therefore, if you know it to be false (whether it actually is or not) you don't have a Delusion.

However a character can still know he has the Delusion disadvantage, because he recognizes that other people treat him like a Cassandra. "I keep trying to warn them but they never listen!"

[Prince Charon]

Originally Posted by Balor Patch

However a character can still know he has the Delusion disadvantage, because he recognizes that other people treat him like a Cassandra. "I keep trying to warn them but they never listen!"

Well, they could know that other people think they're wrong/crazy. Most people don't think of their own lives in gaming terms like that.

EDIT: That ('My life is a role-playing game.') could be an interesting quirk, OPH, or Delusion, though.

[safisher]

Originally Posted by robkelk

Not quite - it's more accurate to say that Delusion is for beliefs that other people think are not true. Usually, they think this because they have evidence, but it is possible by the RAW that they're wrong and the character with the Delusion is right.

Correct...I did say "The rules allow the GM to have a plot twist and make certain types of Delusions true."

[Johnny1A.2]

Originally Posted by Peter Knutsen

Characters will be aware of their fears, yes, but a crucial element of a phobia is the irrationality, and characters will rationalize their fears.

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. For ex, I have a mild phobia about heights. In GURPS terms it's mild, but even when I'm in the grip of it, I am fully aware that it is irrational. (Heights can be genuinely dangerous, of course, but more often than not my phobia kicks in when I am quite safe).

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by Johnny1A.2

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. For ex, I have a mild phobia about heights. In GURPS terms it's mild, but even when I'm in the grip of it, I am fully aware that it is irrational. (Heights can be genuinely dangerous, of course, but more often than not my phobia kicks in when I am quite safe).

Phobias are the kind of disadvantage that it's perfectly fine to avoid the trigger for. Delusions and Compulsions, not so much.

[Johnny1A.2]

Originally Posted by Maz

Yet extremely common in action heroes.

But in their case should be worth few points, because they so rarely pay any price for it.

[ericthered]

Originally Posted by malloyd

I dunno where I learned that, but ....

Well, if you're not willing to put months of solid work into it, no it doesn't work. Tracting (as its called) does get discouraging at times and its actually considered a less effective use of time: If you can be teaching potential walkins or working on sister so-and-so's husband of 10 years and he's actually making progress, its encouraged to be doing that.

And yes, people treat you differently. Its probably one of the reasons they send 19 year olds out to places they've never been. Though I'd call it an OPH rather than a delusion .

The numbers actually aren't as bad as you'd think. The church recently dropped the mission age for women and that caused a giant spike in numbers that's dropping back down. 90k was a one time thing and a spike like that isn't as productive as constant numbers. 300,000 new members a year has been fairly constant the last ten years. And there's always two missionaries, so halve your numbers. The people don't always stay, but many missionaries never see that. So drop your base number down to about six weeks. do what you want to it after that, but children of members are only about 20% of the total.

Of course, I know it gives results because I've done it successfully, and family, friends, and neighbors have done it successfully. And for the most part, we were well aware of the odds. Particularly for the areas we're in, which vary wildly -- from needing luck to come home with something over two years (parts of france, japan, and so forth) to places where good missionaries are finding people every week.

But yes, it gives reaction penalties and takes a good solid amount of work.

[VariousRen]

I would have to disagree with the statement that it's bad role playing to try and resist a mental disadvantage at every opportunity.

The drunk off his ass special forces member who's just trying to forget (never bothers to resist his alcoholism) and the recovering new father who's trying to put his past behind him (always rolls against alcoholism) are both completely valid characters. When you choose to resist is part of how you turn a stat block into a proper character.

In fact, the special forces member may have a self control of 15 (he can stop when he needs to and get down to business) while the new father has a self control of 6 (he gives in at every turn, but at least he tries), but the difference in when they try is a very important part of how you play them.

So in the example above, how far can the drunk father go to avoid triggering his disadvantage? Is the disadvantage a craving (I failed my roll, so I have to seek out a drink), or giving into an opportunity (There's already a drink here, so I make a roll)? At what point does avoiding the disadvantage trigger the disadvantage?

With delusions, I think it's perfectly reasonable to be self aware of the reaction penalty that is tied into the disadvantage. You may think all cats are alien overlords, but the last time you told the neighbors this they called the cops every night for a month. Probably better to keep the information to yourself and keep wearing your tinfoil hat, without having to explain everything to the police... again.

[Maz]

Originally Posted by VariousRen

I would have to disagree with the statement that it's bad role playing to try and resist a mental disadvantage at every opportunity.

I'd say someone who try to resist all the time is an example of someone who should start to buy off the disadvantage.

Your examples are perfectly valid of course, but when people mention "making rolls all the time" I'm pretty sure it's because they have unfortunate experiences with ROLL-players who never attempts to play their disadvantages and only get them for free points and try to avoid actually being disadvantaged by constantly rolling. With a control roll of 6 you tend to fail all the time anyway. But with CR 15 it will very often mean that you never have to act on the disad, making it more or less "free points".

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by robkelk

Not quite - it's more accurate to say that Delusion is for beliefs that other people think are not true. .

Well no. It's really more accurate to say that Delusion is for beliefs that cause you to act in a way that other people think is crazy. If you believe that extraterrestrials are infiltrating our society to take over and quietly gather information that might support such a theory but only talk about it to people with similar beliefs until you have compelling evidence (and you can actually tell the difference between "compelling" and "indicative to someone who is already a believer") then you have at most a quirk. If you rant, expect others to take specious evidence seriously, commit crimes with little justification, or spend enormous sums on unworkable ideas to expose the extraterrestrial menace, then that's a Delusion.