GURPS Monster Hunters 1: Champions

[PK]

Originally Posted by zoncxs

I love the conditional rituals part. I keep thinking to myself "with my tham at 17 and magery at 7 i can "hang" 24 spells... so thats 20 lightning bolts and 4 warp spells" ^,^

Not exactly. Note that the rules on stacking spells explicitly apply to conditional spells as well -- you cannot hang the same spell effect on the same subject (including yourself). One way around this is to make the spells as charms -- that way the spell isn't in effect until you break the charm. So you could have 20 lightning-bolt charms, but not 20 lightning bolts ready to go if you snap your fingers. It's a subtle but important difference. In particular, it means your lightning bolt spells can be stolen. :)

Also, just a heads up. Playtesting has borne out that direct-damage spells are rarely the most effective use of magic. (This was an intentional design choice.) Witches aren't walking guns -- their edge is versatility, not firepower. You're much better off, IMO, coming up with spells that give all of your enemies -3 to their active defenses, spells that detect or ward off monsters, spells to buff your teammates, etc. An imaginative witch is a powerful witch -- but a witch who uses his magic as a fancy gun is much less so.

(And by "warp," I'm assuming you mean a spell to create a gate or a shortcut, not actual teleportation, since no Path skill covers the latter.)

[Crakkerjakk]

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

Also, just a heads up. Playtesting has borne out that direct-damage spells are rarely the most effective use of magic. (This was an intentional design choice.) Witches aren't walking guns -- their edge is versatility, not firepower. You're much better off, IMO, coming up with spells that give all of your enemies -3 to their active defenses, spells that detect or ward off monsters, spells to buff your teammates, etc. An imaginative witch is a powerful witch -- but a witch who uses his magic as a fancy gun is much less so.

Early Dresden-style. Distract 'em with something that diverts their defenses and then get 'em with the .357.

[Langy]

I really like the Ritual Path Magic, but I think it'd be even better with some more worked examples of spells.

Is it normal for Magery not to affect Path skills? Does Magery only impact the amount of energy reserve you can hold, or am I missing something?

Also: Why does FP provide 1 energy per 3 FP? That seems like an excessively bad FP-Energy ratio.

[PK]

Originally Posted by Crakkerjakk

Early Dresden-style. Distract 'em with something that diverts their defenses and then get 'em with the .357.

Exactly. In fact, look at what you can do with just Path of Energy. A typical witch focusing on that might have Magery 5 and Path of Energy-17, which means he can contribute 15 energy from his mana reserve and (just trust me on this!) about 18 energy safely, on average, from ambient energy. So that's 33 energy total for each charm, which can produce . . .

Lightning Bolt: Greater Create Energy (6) + Damage, Indirect (6d+3 burn) (5), tripled for one Greater effect to 33 energy. Useful and powerful, but only because it's burning damage; the actual damage done is comparable to a single Entry Rifle bullet.

Flash: Greater Create Energy (6) + Afflictions, Stunning (0) + Area of Effect, 3 yards (2) + Range, 7 yards (3), tripled for one Greater effect to 33 energy. Potentially stun all the foes within a 3-yard radius.

Diverted Shadows: Lesser Control Energy (5) + Bestows a Penalty (-3 to active defenses) (20) + Area Effect, 7 yards (6) + Excludes your team of 3-4 people (2), is 33 energy. You subtly warp light and darkness in a large area so that everyone who isn't on your team is at -3 to their active defenses.

Light Intensification: Lesser Transform Energy (8) + Altered Traits, Infravision (10) + Area of Effect, 5 yards (4) + Subject Weight, 300 lbs. (3) + Duration, 3 days (8), is 33 energy. Gather your friends within 5 yards and cast the spell; their eyes transform the energy into infrared light, bypassing even massive darkness penalties when fighting most foes for an effective +2 to +9 to skill in most cases.

Now, as you start to move down that list, IMO, the spells become more effective in terms of bang for the buck. And this is just with Path of Energy -- start using Paths together and it's amazing some of the things you can pull off . . .

[PK]

Originally Posted by Langy

I really like the Ritual Path Magic, but I think it'd be even better with some more worked examples of spells.

Yup. I had wanted to include those, but (as with so many things) page count was an issue. Trust me -- if this series does well, I'm definitely wanting to revisit the magic rules . . .

Is it normal for Magery not to affect Path skills?

In this system it is, yes.

Does Magery only impact the amount of energy reserve you can hold, or am I missing something?

You're missing that Magery is the cap on your Path skills! That's its most important benefit by far -- the mana reserve is secondary. High skill levels let you gather much more ambient energy and make all of your spells more effective.

Also: Why does FP provide 1 energy per 3 FP? That seems like an excessively bad FP-Energy ratio.

Because that amount worked well during playtesting. Casters shouldn't be relying on their FP, because it is a bad deal. They're better off using their mana reserve and gathering ambient energy.

[SCAR]

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

No, the rules I'm referring to in that tweet are what I added in MH1. Specifically, the expansion of wildcard skills from "list" to "concept," the explicit rules about ignoring penalties, and the new bonus card rules. JD seems to have gotten confused about which book they went in. (Do note that he's done a great job of collating all of the rumors, but nobody's perfect!)

Excellent, thanks for the clarification. The new Wildcard rules are very cool, and they do make WC's a lot more than 'just' broad super-expert skills.

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

Not IMO. Angel is an atoner -- he's obsessed with redemption, in a rather angsty way. Spike became one of the Good Guys, and he means it completely, but he's more-or-less come to peace with his previous actions -- he doesn't care if he's killing demons, vampires, or (truly evil) people, and he does it because it's the right thing to do and because it's fun. When one thinks of good-guy Spike, the concept of "street-smart" comes to mind long before "deep regrets about his past" does -- at least, IMO.

You're right. I'm rewatching Season 7 at the moment, still in the earlier 'tortured soulful Spike' which almost certainly coloured my perception of him.

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

Note 2: Yes, Xander is a sidekick at best. Being "the heart of the team" doesn't cost points in GURPS, sorry. I just figured I'd get this out of the way now before the "Xander is a crucial element of the team!" folks jump in on it. :)

In a bigger group (which sadly we lack here at the moment), I'd happily play the Xander sidekick character.

Are there rules (or will there be rules in MH4) to give Sidekicks some sort of bonus point boost for added survivability? Sort of the opposite of bonus points for high WC skill, survivability bonus points for low relative point cost in a mixed point cost game?

[Langy]

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

You're missing that Magery is the cap on your Path skills! That's its most important benefit by far -- the mana reserve is secondary. High skill levels let you gather much more ambient energy and make all of your spells more effective.

Do you think One Path Magery be acceptable in this system? If so, I think you could probably make a Dresden-like character with Magery 5 [55] + Magery 5 (One Path Magery, Path of Energy, -40%) [30] or so, though he might have even higher Path of Energy Magery.

The only thing I see really lacking in this system is some easy way to define magical foci, like Harry's blasting rod. These are probably 'Artifacts' that provide an energy reserve, but the only thing MH1 mentions about them is that they provide an energy reserve and should be plot points rather than 'normal' items. What if I wanted to make a Dresden-like character? Should I just take Magery (One Path Magery, -40%; Gadget Limitations, -40%) [2/level], to represent his blasting rod/rings/etc, or should we come up with some way to create balanced Artifacts?

[PK]

Originally Posted by SCAR

In a bigger group (which sadly we lack here at the moment), I'd happily play the Xander sidekick character.

Then you'll definitely like MH4. And yes, there's some discussion of how to play a mixed-power-level team in a fair way, but I'm holding off on details right now. Plus, quite frankly, if you're playing a sidekick in a champion team, you probably should know to hold back a bit in the dangerous situations . . . :)

Originally Posted by Langy

Do you think One Path Magery be acceptable in this system?

Honestly, no, I don't. IMO, if someone's really good at one Path, he should just buy up Magery and raise the one Path skill -- he's still saving points on the other Paths.

But that's just my view. Admittedly, I know the system a lot better than y'all, so I think I have a reasonable perspective -- but that doesn't mean you shouldn't try it out and see how well it works for you. Let me know if you do!

[Michael Thayne]

The new rules for wildcard skills are very cool, the new rules for magic even more so. The moment I saw them, it struck me as very appropriate for the genre, and a nice compromise between the limited spell lists of the standard magic system and the over-the-top nature of Supers' Magic! skill. How much effort did working out those magic rules take?

Now I just need 2 and 3 so I can actually run a Monster Hunters game. I'm very curious to see how the bad guys will compare to the "good guy" versions of Demons, Lycanthropes, and Vampires. The Vampire template in particular surprised me--seemed geared towards producing angst-free vampires, has me envisioning the party's vampire as a mild-mannered fellow who raises chickens for food. I like that image, but it makes me wonder what will be responsible for making sure most vampires are villains.

Related aside: One of the quotes included in the book implied that Buffyverse vampires can survive on animal blood (quote specifically from Angel). Hadn't realized this; the episode of Buffy I'd seen implied Angel was stealing plastic bags of blood from the local hospital. That seems like unnecessary work if he could have been drinking animal blood. Did Joss Whedon change his mind about that at some point?

[Agemegos]

Originally Posted by Michael Thayne

Now I just need 2 and 3 so I can actually run a Monster Hunters game.

I need MH4 for jmurrell's low-power noir/mystery/horror/action/monster-hunting PbP. Any chance it will be out by, say, the 21st?