Dodging the dragon's breath

[Hide]

Hey there!

I am fighting a dragon, and I am within the effective area of its (conic) fire-breath attack.

GURPS’ “cone attacks” deal "large area injury", so DR is (more or less) irrelevant, I get that part.

However, if there is no cover:

What happens to active defenses? Are they really forfeited? (Considering the following situations)

Can I dodge? How and when? (What is the meaning of this?)

Can I block with my shield? How much damage can I block?

Can I block with my hands and say something like “I covered my eyes with my hands”? (What would be the skill required to do so? -hopefully not full DX-)

Finally, what parts of the body are damaged by conic "large area injury" attacks?
If you strongly hit an enemy by the front, does it mean you can cripple the eyes, the limbs, etc. all at once?

Thank you!
- Hide

[Kelly Pedersen]

Originally Posted by Hide

However, if there is no cover:

What happens to active defenses? Are they really forfeited?

If you can't get to cover or outside the area of the cone completely, then yes, you can't dodge. Don't get caught in the open when fighting a dragon!

Originally Posted by Hide

Can I dodge? How and when? (What is the meaning of this?)

A retreating Dodge allows you to move your Step distance. If that takes you out of the area of the attack, you're clear. The referenced post is talking about that. If you have a Step of 3, for instance, and you're 2 yards from the edge of the cone of fire, you can Dodge out of it.

Originally Posted by Hide

Can I block with my shield?

By default, no. A block only applies to a "melee attack, thrown weapon, projected liquid, or muscle-powered missile weapon" (Blocking, p. B375). A cone of fire is none of those.

Originally Posted by Hide

Can I block with my hands and say something like “I covered my eyes with my hands”? (What would be the skill required to do so? -hopefully not full DX-)

It's not supported by the rules as written, but I'd allow this. I'd do it as a Parry based on straight DX (so, DX/2+3+any bonus for Combat Reflexes or similar traits). If you succeeded, you'd count any armor on your hands as applying to your eyes, which could help a bit when calculating average DR, or if you rolled the eyes randomly (see my next response below).

Originally Posted by Hide

Finally, what parts of the body are damaged by conic "large area injury" attacks?

Normally, I'd just apply it to the torso. If you wanted to get more complicated than that, I'd roll on the random hit location table and apply damage to the part rolled (here's where covering your eyes with your hands might help). Once enough damage was done to cripple a given part, I'd roll again and apply the rest to the new location.

[evileeyore]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

A retreating Dodge allows you to move your Step distance. If that takes you out of the area of the attack, you're clear.

You still have to Dodge, whether that is a Retreating Dodge*, a Dodge and Drop, or a Dive for Cover.


* See also Sideslip and Slip as Retreat Options from Martial Arts pg 123..

It's not supported by the rules as written, but I'd allow this. I'd do it as a Parry based on straight DX (so, DX/2+3+any bonus for Combat Reflexes or similar traits). If you succeeded, you'd count any armor on your hands as applying to your eyes, which could help a bit when calculating average DR, or if you rolled the eyes randomly (see my next response below).

I'd also allow a Dodge to declare that you turned away from the cone and thus protected your face, or whatever parts you're shielding with one half of your body.

B400: "Against an explosion or cone, only locations facing the blast or cone are exposed (e.g., if you’re turned away, your face and eyes aren’t exposed)."

Originally Posted by Hide

Finally, what parts of the body are damaged by conic "large area injury" attacks?

As per B400, anything exposed. So yes, you can completely cripple, blind, deafen, etc someone if they take a full hit to the front that does enough damage.

Large Area Injury is rough. I suggest not being the target of it.

[Hide]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

(...)

Normally, I'd just apply it to the torso. If you wanted to get more complicated than that, I'd roll on the random hit location table and apply damage to the part rolled (here's where covering your eyes with your hands might help). Once enough damage was done to cripple a given part, I'd roll again and apply the rest to the new location.

(Firstly, Thanks for your comments)

Really? But as of RAW?

Because as far as I understand, large area injury in cone attacks applies damage to the whole area facing the attack’s source, not just the torso. I mean, why would you classify it as a “large area injury” if it ends up being a specific torso attack?

A fire-bolt, it might be a “torso attack” if you do not declare hit location. But I believe “large are injury” means “you hit everything in your scope” (such as the stomp of a very large creature). Thus I have been wondering about the effects… Probably, sufficient “large area injury” damage cripples the whole (facing) body.

Originally Posted by evileeyore

(...)
As per B400, anything exposed. So yes, you can completely cripple, blind, deafen, etc someone if they take a full hit to the front that does enough damage.

Large Area Injury is rough. I suggest not being the target of it.

This is what I think, indeed.

[Captain Joy]

Originally Posted by Hide

Finally, what parts of the body are damaged by conic "large area injury" attacks?
If you strongly hit an enemy by the front, does it mean you can cripple the eyes, the limbs, etc. all at once?

The default to "torso" is really just saying "no injury cap and don't worry about crippling"; it's the same as playing the game ignoring hit locations. I think what Kelly Pederson (who will correct me if I'm wrong) is saying is that if you want your large area injury attacks to cause crippling injuries, then using the random hit location table to determine which body parts are crippled is a reasonable way to do that. It's not RAW, but it's not anti-RAW. I don't believe there is a RAW way to address large area injury causing crippling injury. It's not that it's forbidden by RAW, it's simply not addressed.

[Kelly Pedersen]

Originally Posted by Hide

Really? But as of RAW?

Yes. See "Large-Area Injury", p. B400: "Don’t modify large-area injury for hit location (that is, treat it as a torso hit) unless only one location is exposed."

Originally Posted by Hide

I mean, why would you classify it as a “large area injury” if it ends up being a specific torso attack?

It makes quite a big difference if, for example, you have a bunch of DR on your torso, but no DR at all on your face, and both are exposed. You'd only get half the benefit of your torso DR, since you average the torso and the lowest other exposed location's DR.

Originally Posted by Captain Joy

I think what Kelly Pederson (who will correct me if I'm wrong) is saying is that if you want your large area injury attacks to cause crippling injuries, then using the random hit location table to determine which body parts are crippled is a reasonable way to do that.

Yup, pretty much exactly.

[Captain Joy]

Originally Posted by Hide

Can I block with my shield? How much damage can I block?

B484 provides some insight – from the Damage to Shields box-text: "A powerful blow may punch through your shield! The shield acts as cover, with “cover DR” equal to its DR + (HP/4). Damage in excess of cover DR penetrates the shield and possibly injures you; see Overpenetration (p. 408)."

[Hide]

Originally Posted by Kelly Pedersen

Yes. See "Large-Area Injury", p. B400: "Don’t modify large-area injury for hit location (that is, treat it as a torso hit) unless only one location is exposed." (...)

So you meant "no penalty to hit and it hits everything as if it was the torso", right? I thought you meant, "I take it as a torso and forfeit all the bonuses from hitting other locations (i.e. eyes)".

Or is fire damage exempt of delivering burning damage to the eyes during cone attacks?

I understand the concept of rolling random hit locations; yet I think that's like lending a hand to PCs.
Isn't? In other words, I don't get why you would do that, because my idea/understanding is this:

I have 10 hit points (and no armor), and then a dragon deals 30 points of damage to me with its breath of fire (cone)... Let's suppose I survive, what happens next?

Supposing I was facing the dragon, I guess most of my character’s body will be at least crippled if not destroyed. Or what prevents this from happening?

Originally Posted by Captain Joy

B484 provides some insight – from the Damage to Shields box-text: "A powerful blow may punch through your shield! The shield acts as cover, with “cover DR” equal to its DR + (HP/4). Damage in excess of cover DR penetrates the shield and possibly injures you; see Overpenetration (p. 408)."

Ah right, the shield as passive cover!

[Kelly Pedersen]

Originally Posted by Hide

So you meant "no penalty to hit and it hits everything as if it was the torso", right? I thought you meant, "I take it as a torso and forfeit all the bonuses from hitting other locations (i.e. eyes)".

I meant what I quoted from the book - large-area injury attacks are always treated as if they hit the torso, and don't have any special effects for other locations.

Originally Posted by Hide

Or is fire damage exempt of delivering burning damage to the eyes during cone attacks?

Yes, unless the eyes are the only location exposed, in which case the attack has its normal effect for the hit location.

I understand the concept of rolling random hit locations; yet I think that's like lending a hand to PCs.
Isn't? In other words, I don't get why you would do that, because my idea/understanding is this:

Originally Posted by Hide

I have 10 hit points (and no armor), and then a dragon deals 30 points of damage to me with its breath of fire (cone)... Let's suppose I survive, what happens next?

By the RAW, you take 10 damage, but suffer none of the crippling effects. This is a simplification, yes. If you want a more complicated but possibly more realistic option, use random hit locations to see how the damage gets distributed instead, as I suggested.

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by Hide

(Firstly, Thanks for your comments)

Really? But as of RAW?

Because as far as I understand, large area injury in cone attacks applies damage to the whole area facing the attack’s source, not just the torso. I mean, why would you classify it as a “large area injury” if it ends up being a specific torso attack?
.

The thing with large area injury if it doesn't instantly kill you then it's probably very shallow damage so no it won't cripple you. The game effect of large area injury is that is that it reduces armor protection if you have any lightly or unarmored areas.