Reference screen - Page 2

Doc Cross · 05-20-2018, 10:55 AM

I hardly ever use GM screens, despite owning about a dozen. Now, I'd much prefer an app for Android.

Kirk · 05-20-2018, 01:17 PM

For those that want soft copies, that seems like a fairly easy thing to offer once a hard copy, say 3 back and front cardstock style, is developed.

Sitting with others fully focused on the tactile nature of rolling dice, moving pieces, and referencing actual hard copy documents is a full part of the enjoyment.

Those that would enjoy TFT as an app can surely request it, but IMO nothing can replace actual FTF interaction, and I would have no interest in an electronic experience for TFT.

Steve Jackson · 05-20-2018, 01:43 PM

I don't even possess a copy of the Metagaming ref screen for TFT. What was on there that you used most? Was there anything that was just a waste of space? This has been discussed above but I want to make the questions specific.

GlennDoren · 05-20-2018, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirk

For those that want soft copies, that seems like a fairly easy thing to offer once a hard copy, say 3 back and front cardstock style, is developed.

Sitting with others fully focused on the tactile nature of rolling dice, moving pieces, and referencing actual hard copy documents is a full part of the enjoyment.

Those that would enjoy TFT as an app can surely request it, but IMO nothing can replace actual FTF interaction, and I would have no interest in an electronic experience for TFT.

I'm a fan of both. I completely agree the tactile experience of analog/board games cannot be replaced. But I also enjoy the option of a good digital version :)

I think there are two angles regarding digital: play aids, and full-out games. I'd be up for both--but at a minimum, having digital play-aids still enhances playing the boardgame.

I have a multi-character sheet PDF on my ipad pro, which is super convenient when used with the Apple Pencil (makes it easy to mark up, erase, etc.). Lets me track everything for the entire group of characters cleanly and quickly. Plus, I have a couple sheets with charts (DX mods in combat, etc.) that can be quickly scrolled to on the ipad as well. I even have a "dice probabilities" chart so players can quickly see the chance of succeeding on 3d6/4d6/5d6. Makes the game play faster when you dont need to flip thru rulebooks or character sheets, no eraser crums everywhere, etc. And frees up table space for the actual board/counters/dice.

Again, I enjoy the smell of my old rulebooks as much as any OCD gamer ;) But i would never give up my ipad+apple pencil+pdfs after having enjoyed the benefit :)

And as a veteran computer game programmer, I admit: I've been tinkering with updating the home-brewed "computer melee" project that got me into the game industry 25 years ago. I think there's plenty of benefit to having an app that can play full-blown scenarios on-screen, and also provide AI-controlled NPCs (or computer DM'd scenarios)--even if just providing behaviors to be played on the tabletop.

ecz · 05-20-2018, 03:57 PM

I dream a screen customizable where there are plastic "pockets" toward the GM and toward the players to insert the tables you prefer and that are fully removable and interchangeable.

~~Jim Kane~~ · 05-20-2018, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Jackson

I don't even possess a copy of the Metagaming ref screen for TFT.

Here you go STEVE, take a peek:
https://picclick.com/Rare-Metagaming...l#&gid=1&pid=8

AND

https://picclick.com/Rare-Metagaming...l#&gid=1&pid=9

That's 80% of it, less the players-side-center-panel, which was the Rodger Stine TFT painting, and the words: "Fantasy Masters' Screen" (Games Research Group revised GM to FM for some reason I do not know), and the inside left-panel, which was all manner of DX Adjustments.

Hope this is helpful as a jump-off point for others to effectively comment on.

JK

larsdangly · 05-20-2018, 04:27 PM

Wow! My TFT collection seems to be more complete than Steve Jackson's! Although perhaps not surprising; I'm such a TFT freak that I've got original hard copies of the setting books that were written for TFT near the end of its run but ended up published for some other now defunct game...

Anyway, the important components of the old published screen are:

Weapon, armor and shield tables

Compiled DX modifiers

Strength table (i.e., HTH damage per ST score)

Those are the things you use pretty much all the time. I think a well designed table of ST costs for spells would also see a lot of use.

~~Jim Kane~~ · 05-20-2018, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JLV

In fact, the original one had player-useful info on the PLAYER side of the screen, and I think that's a great policy to continue with...

Yes, agree with JLV. All the player useful info on the players-side - such as: weapons, armor, shields, equipment, etc. and all the useful GM charts and tables on the GM-side. Seems obvious, BUT I am sure we have all seen those screens which almost seem to spend more time being picked up and flipped around by a GM to get to a chart, then kept in place to block player vision.

I am considering the pro/con of suggesting reproducing the Movement & Combat Options List on the Players side, in LARGE SIZE... AND on the GM side, in small-size, as I always found having that in front of new players got them thinking along the binary, scripted action, two-tier structure, and helped reduce players from answering the question of: [I]"So what do you do for your movement phase?", with: "I run across the room, jump up on top of the statue, grab the gem with one-hand, while cutting off the Orc's head as I land, do a pirouette, jump over the flaming one-hex pits, and run through the curtain of darkness into the safety of the tunnel... yeah, can I do that in one turn.. right?"

Ugh. I just remembered what it felt like to grind my teeth while wearing dental braces.

JK

Steve Jackson · 05-20-2018, 05:42 PM

Thanks for the pointers, Jim. Yes, my collection is less complete than it was before the flood a few years back. More important things were lost than the ref screen . . .

There are, on the market (though I don't have links), customizable GM screens of the sort described. Though a lot can be done with a photocopier and a piece of poster board!

It's been a TFT weekend for me; I've been through the entire AM/AW/ITL text once this weekend and will probably complete a second pass tonight. The first pass was focused on typography; the current pass is mostly looking for screenworthy stats.

Steve Jackson · 05-20-2018, 06:51 PM

We can do a better job of presenting info, and with fewer Formatt rubdowns, but yes, that screen was more useful than I recalled.

Clearly I'm just going to have to find a copy, even one in terrible shape, for sale. Or if anybody has a spare and wants to swap for some goodies, talk to me . . .

I have no idea, btw, why "Fantasy Master" was adopted. After my time. I don't agree with it; FM is radio.

05-20-2018, 10:55 AM	#11
Doc Cross Join Date: Mar 2005	Re: Reference screen I hardly ever use GM screens, despite owning about a dozen. Now, I'd much prefer an app for Android.

05-20-2018, 01:17 PM	#12
Kirk Join Date: Feb 2018	Re: Reference screen For those that want soft copies, that seems like a fairly easy thing to offer once a hard copy, say 3 back and front cardstock style, is developed. Sitting with others fully focused on the tactile nature of rolling dice, moving pieces, and referencing actual hard copy documents is a full part of the enjoyment. Those that would enjoy TFT as an app can surely request it, but IMO nothing can replace actual FTF interaction, and I would have no interest in an electronic experience for TFT.

05-20-2018, 01:43 PM	#13
Steve Jackson President and EIC Join Date: Jul 2004	Re: Reference screen I don't even possess a copy of the Metagaming ref screen for TFT. What was on there that you used most? Was there anything that was just a waste of space? This has been discussed above but I want to make the questions specific.

05-20-2018, 03:57 PM	#15
ecz Join Date: Jan 2018	Re: Reference screen I dream a screen customizable where there are plastic "pockets" toward the GM and toward the players to insert the tables you prefer and that are fully removable and interchangeable. __________________ VASLeague Tournament Director www.vasleague.org

05-20-2018, 04:27 PM	#17
larsdangly Join Date: Dec 2017	Re: Reference screen Wow! My TFT collection seems to be more complete than Steve Jackson's! Although perhaps not surprising; I'm such a TFT freak that I've got original hard copies of the setting books that were written for TFT near the end of its run but ended up published for some other now defunct game... Anyway, the important components of the old published screen are: Weapon, armor and shield tables Compiled DX modifiers Strength table (i.e., HTH damage per ST score) Those are the things you use pretty much all the time. I think a well designed table of ST costs for spells would also see a lot of use.

05-20-2018, 05:42 PM	#19
Steve Jackson President and EIC Join Date: Jul 2004	Re: Reference screen Thanks for the pointers, Jim. Yes, my collection is less complete than it was before the flood a few years back. More important things were lost than the ref screen . . . There are, on the market (though I don't have links), customizable GM screens of the sort described. Though a lot can be done with a photocopier and a piece of poster board! It's been a TFT weekend for me; I've been through the entire AM/AW/ITL text once this weekend and will probably complete a second pass tonight. The first pass was focused on typography; the current pass is mostly looking for screenworthy stats.

05-20-2018, 06:51 PM	#20
Steve Jackson President and EIC Join Date: Jul 2004	Re: Reference screen We can do a better job of presenting info, and with fewer Formatt rubdowns, but yes, that screen was more useful than I recalled. Clearly I'm just going to have to find a copy, even one in terrible shape, for sale. Or if anybody has a spare and wants to swap for some goodies, talk to me . . . I have no idea, btw, why "Fantasy Master" was adopted. After my time. I don't agree with it; FM is radio.