Dust Explosion - Grain, flour, wheat - Page 12

Icelander · 09-16-2016, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gedrin

Reading about the elementals, I can't help but think that the intelligent ones might be connoisseurs of "stuff mixed in air". The descriptive language might be difficult to convey the desired result, but assuming you could communicate, and get cooperation (possibly the hard part if they're purist types), appropriate mix and distribution accounting for ambient currents might well count as air elemental artistic expression.

This is very true.

For Abadas, as well. He's the son of an ifrit noble, possibly even the Sultan of the City of Brass himself, and he's soul-bonded with a living spell, a Gust of Wind, which is effectively an artificial air elemental.

Mixing air and fire this way is intensely beautiful to him. He even has Artist and Performance skills for pyrotechnics and flame-structures.

Kalzazz · 09-16-2016, 04:44 PM

Out of curiosity, how many points did this nameless merc clock in at?

Icelander · 09-16-2016, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kalzazz

Out of curiosity, how many points did this nameless merc clock in at?

I didn't calculate it. Just wrote down some relevant stats and skills.

He would come in at a lot of points, I expect. He was extremely competent in a fight, even if things never broke his way in life. I guess around 400 points. He had Attributes about 3 levels lower than Rasul. Charax actually did have a supernatural ability, Injury Tolerance: Damage Reduction (as do all truly experienced warriors in the setting).* It didn't end up mattering, as Rasul didn't injure him and Murlak's magical golden 550 grain bullet imbued with green dragon ichor killed him in one shot despite it.

*People who, in setting, are very experienced at a violent trade, attain abilities that ordinary humans don't have. Not always dramatic magical abilities, especially if they are not any kind of magic-users, but more like Batman and many of his Rogues' Gallery; able to survive damage that should kill any human (IT:DR), consistenly avoid random risks (Luck), are harder to affect with supernatural attacks (Resistant), etc.

Icelander · 09-19-2016, 03:48 AM

I've made some rulings that I can use to calculate accuracy.

The bombing run is made slowly enough so that there are no penalties for Speed, only for Range. It's at a 1,000 yards of height, after maximum Aiming bonus for Dropping, targeting a hex (+4), which translates into -8. Forward Observer gives +1 per 2 margin of success. Failure on the Dropping roll (modified by the Forward Observer) means scatter by ca 10 yds times the margin of failure. I'll roll 3d for the scatter yards and 1d for the direction, if it matters.

As for adjudicating the dropping of whole elements with one roll, I'll rule that a success by 0 means that 50% of the munitions hit the target. Adjust the percentage according to the chances of success on a 3d6, so that success by 1 means ca 63% hit, success by 2 means that 74% hit, etc. By contrast, failure by 1 means that 37.5% hit, etc. The margin of success or failure can also be used to determine how much of the munitions scatters by 1x3d yds, 2x3d yds, 3x3d yds, etc.

When combined with the rolls in the post on the previous page, it leads to the following hit rates: Gold Squadron (84%), Electrum Squadron (9%), 1st Pegasus Squadron (98%, critical on both rolls), 2nd Pegasus Squadron (91%), 3rd Pegasus Squadron (95%), 4th Pegasus Squadron (37%), djinni (98%), flying carpet (84%), Phantom Steeds (9%) and Brass Wyverns (74%).

Electrum Squadron released too late, the center of their drop being around 50 yds behind the target and the drop patterns was also fairly irregular for them. The Phantom Steeds released too early, with the center of their irregular drop being some 45 yds in front of the target. The 4th Pegasus' center was off by 18 yds to the east-north-east, in front of and to the left of the target (selected as the center of the road that the reinforcements are walking down).

As for Gold Squadron*, 7% of their strike overshot by 14 yds, 4% of it went 6-12 yds east-north-east (short and to the left) of the target, 3% of it went short by 12-36 yds and the rest (ca 2%) was short by some 50 yds. Fully 840 lbs. of finely ground flour were dropped exactly at the target, a narrowing in the road where the footing is treacherous to both sides. Only a few light troops were present when the drop was made, but the column of heavy infantry was around 30 yds from arriving at it. Assuming that the first drop took 17 seconds to land, the first troops were 13 yards from the target when the bags of flour started to land.

Drops after that were each aimed ca 10 yds behind the last drop, following the road. That means that the 70 lbs. from Gold Squadron that overshot was within the target area for the flying carpet (and fell straight among the first two ranks of the column). It also means that Electrum Squadron, while missing the part of the column that they were supposed to aim for (40 yds from the target area of Gold, 10 yards behind the start of the heavy column at the start of drop), do hit the rear of the marching column, albeit with much more dispersion than they should have (and thus less dust concentration in the air).

The miss of Electrum Squadron and the Phantom Steeds, as well as the less than perfect strikes of the flying carpet and the Brass Wyverns, means that there is far less flour hitting the first part of the column than intended. Fortunately, the djinn dropped a ton of finely ground flour perfectly on the position where the first ten yards of the column were at the beginning of the strike (hitting around ranks 25-35).

*The PCs closest followers and the ones who led the strike.

Icelander · 09-26-2016, 07:44 AM

If all goes well, I'm going to be playing out the session during which the results of this become clear tonight.

I've established that with the rolled accuracy as it is, the main target area is a line 50 yds long and 10 yds broad. The djinni whirlwind is 15 yard high and 10 yards in diameter. He'll be moving around the line, throwing up any dust that looks to be settled on the ground and mixing it thoroughly with the air.

So will eight smaller dust devils, whose main function will be to steer any expansion of the dust cloud and ensure that it does not spread out so fast that it fails to have enough dust concentration for an explosion.

If the djinni and Abadas report that the concentration is fine, though, the dust devils will gleefully allow the cloud to expand further, over the skirmishers and archers marching to either side of the road (currently embroiled in a difference of opinion with their officers, in re running away).

This is the dust and hopefully dust that is delivered to the target area.

Powdered:
3 tons of finely ground flour* (2 tons directly on target; 0.5 ton accidentally on target, but in wider spread, 0.5 ton off target)
2 tons of chaff (and other grain byproducts) scrounged from mills** (3710 lbs. on target; 180 lbs. no more than 21 yards from target hex)
1 ton of charchoal dust from the shipyards*** (1960 lbs. directly on target, 40 lbs. slowly drifting down on the target)

Dropped from 1,000 yds and hope it powders a little:
3 tons of dried dung collected to be used as fuel**

My question to the forumites is, what will happen when that dust cloud is hit by a fireball doing 92 points of damage, with an added Incendiary modifier on top of the IA burning damage?

How large a cloud would still explode with this much dust?

Will the dried dung do anything useful?

*Dropped in empty ceremic wine amphora, wooden beer kegs and small wooden boxes, all likely to burst on impact.
**These were dropped in 50-lb bags, which would hopefully burst on impact from a 1,000 yds up.
***Air-carried in by the djinn himself, for perfect placement and concentration.

Nereidalbel · 09-26-2016, 11:24 AM

It doesn't matter how much damage the fireball does; the entire cloud either isn't mixed right, or, it goes boom. Those flour mills that explode on the news? A single bearing overheated just enough to deal 1 point of damage in GURPS terms. As long as you don't somehow miss the massive dust cloud, you're set for boom time.

As for the dung? What doesn't powder enough to explode becomes flaming shrapnel. Your dust cloud now has incendiary fragmentation damage!

Icelander · 09-26-2016, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

It doesn't matter how much damage the fireball does; the entire cloud either isn't mixed right, or, it goes boom. Those flour mills that explode on the news? A single bearing overheated just enough to deal 1 point of damage in GURPS terms. As long as you don't somehow miss the massive dust cloud, you're set for boom time.

The extra Incendiary modifier helps, in that it treats everything it damages as one flammability class (p. B433) less for the purpose of setting it on fire. 'Highly Flammable' clusters of airborne dust become 'Super-Flammable', i.e. imperfect incendiaries like flour in barely adequate concentrations in air become like an optimal mixture of coal dust and air.

Basically all dust close enough to the fireball to take 1 point of damage from it will burn, even if it normally counts only as 'Flammable', 3 points; like kindling, oil or dry wood... or maybe like chaff and other mill detritus or even crumbling dried dung thrown everywhere by an air drop.

I was wrong about the 92 points of damage, though. It does 15d+33 burn ex/1 (avg. 88.5), but I haven't officially rolled. Waiting for the player.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

As for the dung? What doesn't powder enough to explode becomes flaming shrapnel. Your dust cloud now has incendiary fragmentation damage!

With the extra Incendiary damage modifier, any human who takes 10 points or more of damage from the initial fireball will be set on fire. Their armour and weapons will combust if they take 30 points.

So there's an excellent chance there will be burning flesh and fiery molten metal inside the cloud of dust when it blows, so there's some more fragmentation. Not to mention several hundred cuirasses of segmented plate, helmets, spears, swords and shields that won't be hit by the brunt of the magical fireball, but which will certainly be caught inside the exploding dust cloud and which might be thrown in all directions as shrapnel if we get a proper explosion and not just a dust conflagration.

Nereidalbel · 09-26-2016, 12:40 PM

If this works, your players may be able to justify bringing a few hundred tons of flour for the counter-offensive. Seriously though, I am interested in hearing how this plays out.

Joe · 09-26-2016, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

Seriously though, I am interested in hearing how this plays out.

Likewise! Been watching this for a while now...

Icelander · 09-26-2016, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

If this works, your players may be able to justify bringing a few hundred tons of flour for the counter-offensive. Seriously though, I am interested in hearing how this plays out.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe

Likewise! Been watching this for a while now...

B O O M !

(More tomorrow).

09-16-2016, 04:44 PM	#112
Kalzazz Join Date: Feb 2009	Re: Dust Explosion - Grain, flour, wheat Out of curiosity, how many points did this nameless merc clock in at?

09-19-2016, 03:48 AM	#114
Icelander Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Iceland*	Calculated accuracy of the drop I've made some rulings that I can use to calculate accuracy. The bombing run is made slowly enough so that there are no penalties for Speed, only for Range. It's at a 1,000 yards of height, after maximum Aiming bonus for Dropping, targeting a hex (+4), which translates into -8. Forward Observer gives +1 per 2 margin of success. Failure on the Dropping roll (modified by the Forward Observer) means scatter by ca 10 yds times the margin of failure. I'll roll 3d for the scatter yards and 1d for the direction, if it matters. As for adjudicating the dropping of whole elements with one roll, I'll rule that a success by 0 means that 50% of the munitions hit the target. Adjust the percentage according to the chances of success on a 3d6, so that success by 1 means ca 63% hit, success by 2 means that 74% hit, etc. By contrast, failure by 1 means that 37.5% hit, etc. The margin of success or failure can also be used to determine how much of the munitions scatters by 1x3d yds, 2x3d yds, 3x3d yds, etc. When combined with the rolls in the post on the previous page, it leads to the following hit rates: Gold Squadron (84%), Electrum Squadron (9%), 1st Pegasus Squadron (98%, critical on both rolls), 2nd Pegasus Squadron (91%), 3rd Pegasus Squadron (95%), 4th Pegasus Squadron (37%), djinni (98%), flying carpet (84%), Phantom Steeds (9%) and Brass Wyverns (74%). Electrum Squadron released too late, the center of their drop being around 50 yds behind the target and the drop patterns was also fairly irregular for them. The Phantom Steeds released too early, with the center of their irregular drop being some 45 yds in front of the target. The 4th Pegasus' center was off by 18 yds to the east-north-east, in front of and to the left of the target (selected as the center of the road that the reinforcements are walking down). As for Gold Squadron, 7% of their strike overshot by 14 yds, 4% of it went 6-12 yds east-north-east (short and to the left) of the target, 3% of it went short by 12-36 yds and the rest (ca 2%) was short by some 50 yds. Fully 840 lbs. of finely ground flour were dropped exactly at the target, a narrowing in the road where the footing is treacherous to both sides. Only a few light troops were present when the drop was made, but the column of heavy infantry was around 30 yds from arriving at it. Assuming that the first drop took 17 seconds to land, the first troops were 13 yards from the target when the bags of flour started to land. Drops after that were each aimed ca 10 yds behind the last drop, following the road. That means that the 70 lbs. from Gold Squadron that overshot was within the target area for the flying carpet (and fell straight among the first two ranks of the column). It also means that Electrum Squadron, while missing the part of the column that they were supposed to aim for (40 yds from the target area of Gold, 10 yards behind the start of the heavy column at the start of drop), do hit the rear of the marching column, albeit with much more dispersion than they should have (and thus less dust concentration in the air). The miss of Electrum Squadron and the Phantom Steeds, as well as the less than perfect strikes of the flying carpet and the Brass Wyverns, means that there is far less flour hitting the first part of the column than intended. Fortunately, the djinn dropped a ton of finely ground flour perfectly on the position where the first ten yards of the column were at the beginning of the strike (hitting around ranks 25-35). The PCs closest followers and the ones who led the strike. __________________ Za uspiekh nashevo beznadiozhnovo diela! Last edited by Icelander; 09-19-2016 at 06:13 AM.

09-26-2016, 07:44 AM	#115
Icelander Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Iceland*	Can forumites suggest upcoming results? If all goes well, I'm going to be playing out the session during which the results of this become clear tonight. I've established that with the rolled accuracy as it is, the main target area is a line 50 yds long and 10 yds broad. The djinni whirlwind is 15 yard high and 10 yards in diameter. He'll be moving around the line, throwing up any dust that looks to be settled on the ground and mixing it thoroughly with the air. So will eight smaller dust devils, whose main function will be to steer any expansion of the dust cloud and ensure that it does not spread out so fast that it fails to have enough dust concentration for an explosion. If the djinni and Abadas report that the concentration is fine, though, the dust devils will gleefully allow the cloud to expand further, over the skirmishers and archers marching to either side of the road (currently embroiled in a difference of opinion with their officers, in re running away). This is the dust and hopefully dust that is delivered to the target area. *Powdered:* 3 tons of finely ground flour* (2 tons directly on target; 0.5 ton accidentally on target, but in wider spread, 0.5 ton off target) 2 tons of chaff (and other grain byproducts) scrounged from mills** (3710 lbs. on target; 180 lbs. no more than 21 yards from target hex) 1 ton of charchoal dust from the shipyards* (1960 lbs. directly on target, 40 lbs. slowly drifting down on the target) Dropped from 1,000 yds and hope it powders a little:** 3 tons of dried dung collected to be used as fuel** My question to the forumites is, what will happen when that dust cloud is hit by a fireball doing 92 points of damage, with an added Incendiary modifier on top of the IA burning damage? How large a cloud would still explode with this much dust? Will the dried dung do anything useful? Dropped in empty ceremic wine amphora, wooden beer kegs and small wooden boxes, all likely to burst on impact. These were dropped in 50-lb bags, which would hopefully burst on impact from a 1,000 yds up. **Air-carried in by the djinn himself, for perfect placement and concentration. __________________ Za uspiekh nashevo beznadiozhnovo diela!

09-26-2016, 11:24 AM	#116
Nereidalbel Join Date: May 2013 Location: Ellicott City, MD	Re: Dust Explosion - Grain, flour, wheat It doesn't matter how much damage the fireball does; the entire cloud either isn't mixed right, or, it goes boom. Those flour mills that explode on the news? A single bearing overheated just enough to deal 1 point of damage in GURPS terms. As long as you don't somehow miss the massive dust cloud, you're set for boom time. As for the dung? What doesn't powder enough to explode becomes flaming shrapnel. Your dust cloud now has incendiary fragmentation damage!

09-26-2016, 12:40 PM	#118
Nereidalbel Join Date: May 2013 Location: Ellicott City, MD	Re: Dust Explosion - Grain, flour, wheat If this works, your players may be able to justify bringing a few hundred tons of flour for the counter-offensive. Seriously though, I am interested in hearing how this plays out.