Mercurial Greatswords, Rule of Cool weapons

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by Turhan's Bey Company

There's probably a version in GURPS New Sun (that's basically a description of Severian's sword), but seeing as it's a licensed product, I wouldn't expect the book to show up on Warehouse 23.

Been a long tim since I read and owned that book but I am pretty sure there was.
The thing is though that his swird was built with the concept but it was not really made for combat but as a headsmans axe.
So kind of like the hammers described above.

[malloyd]

Originally Posted by Disliker of the mary sue

Hm could you kindly elaborate on what you mean by that statement?

It transfers no more energy that any weapon of the same total weight (and in fact since it somewhat spreads out the energy transfer, it will cause *less* damage than an equally heavy solid weapon). And since it will cause the weapon to change trajectory as it swings as the center of mass moves around, should also lower accuracy.

It's one of those things that sounds cool, but doesn't actually do what the coolness seems to be based on. Yes as the mercury moves outward toward the end of the blade, that end gets heavier. If it kept moving at the same speed, it would hit harder. But it *doesn't* - the energy to accelerate the moving mercury up to the higher speed must come from somewhere, and it comes from the energy of the rest of the weapon, slowing it down. I think it's the same kind of error as the mercury filled bullet, or more subtly the airplane taking off on a treadmill or the rolling wheel rotating about its center, based on imagining stuff moving the wrong way.

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by malloyd

I think it's the same kind of error as the mercury filled bullet, or more subtly the airplane taking off on a treadmill or the rolling wheel rotating about its center, based on imagining stuff moving the wrong way.

What is wrong with a mercury filled bullet? Isnt that more effective then lead poisioning?

[TheVaultDweller]

Originally Posted by Varyon

For hammers, you might be able to get a bit more damage out of the mercury trick, but you'd be much better off just investing in a heavier head. As for dead blow hammers, from the Wikipedia article it actually sounds like those are designed to reduce damage by (in GURPS terms) turning some of it into increased knockback.

You know what, that makes a lot of sense! Deadblow hammers are great at transfering momentum. When you hit something with it, it feels like the hammer just gets "stuck" to the surface. I guess if I was impacting a free-standing object with a regular hammer and a deadblow hammer, the regular hammer would more likely cause a small crush on the thing and the dead-blow would hurl the thing away, so, yes, it makes. I never tried it, though, so I could be wrong. But what I remember from physics says it makes sense.

Now I'm picturing a dwarf using a dead-blow hammer and knocking backing foes several yards. Could be potentially useful/funny in a DF campaign :D

[Nereidalbel]

Originally Posted by Refplace

What is wrong with a mercury filled bullet? Isnt that more effective then lead poisioning?

Not really. Ingested mercury kills you dead, but, even an injection directly into the arteries isn't fatal, if you get some medical treatment.

[malloyd]

Originally Posted by Refplace

What is wrong with a mercury filled bullet? Isnt that more effective then lead poisioning?

Actually probably not much. Mercury isn't all that much more toxic than lead. It's relative poisonousness is often exaggerated a lot while the lead it underemphasized.

But I mean the one where you imagine the mercury hitting the front increases the impact. Yes that's nonsense, equivalent to thinking the bullet would hit harder if you sawed it in half and glued the back to the front with slightly flexible glue, but it's a common story.

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by TheVaultDweller

Now I'm picturing a dwarf using a dead-blow hammer and knocking backing foes several yards. Could be potentially useful/funny in a DF campaign :D

Something similar does exist in DF. See the Impact Maul and Impact Warhammer (DF8:33). They have a hollowed-out head filled with metal pellets, making them more agile while preserving their full damage. I could picture a "heavy" variant of those, which are slower but hit much harder.

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

Not really. Ingested mercury kills you dead, but, even an injection directly into the arteries isn't fatal, if you get some medical treatment.

Inhaled vapors might be the most reactive form but mercury filled bullets are supposed to be about using the mercury as an expansion gimmick/ You don't want the sort of expansion Wide but shallow) such a thing would do if it did anything.

[Mathulhu]

Mercurial greatswords and dead drop hammers don't work in the same way. The movement of the extra weight in the dead drop hammer is parallel to the impact. In the mercurial greatsword the movement is perpendicular to the impact.

A really easy way to make a weapon that acts like a mercurial greatsword would be to take an axe and put a metal ring around the shaft. If the ring is allowed to move while the weapon is swung it would have the increased impact expected from a mercurial sword. Does anyone know a real world example of a weapon of this type?

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by Mathulhu

Does anyone know a real world example of a weapon of this type?

I highly doubt such a thing exists. As malloyd pointed out with that pesky conservation-of-momentum thing, something like this won't actually cause any increase in damage, while it will certainly make the weapon harder to accurately swing. They'll work as cinematic/superscience devices, but in a realistic campaign? Not so much.

Of course, in a cinematic campaign, my vote goes for the mercurial sword over the hula-hoop sword, simply due to Rule of Cool.