Fragile (Unnatural) margin of failure on death roll

[Maz]

IDHMBWM but isnt Mortal Wounds an optional rule, like bleeding?

If so, thats probably why the traits do not explicitly mention it. Just like regeneration do not take the
Bleeding rules into account.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Maz

IDHMBWM but isnt Mortal Wounds an optional rule, like bleeding?

No, but it's a rule that was added in 4e, so a lot of advantages probably forget that it exists.

[NineDaysDead]

Originally Posted by Maz

If so, thats probably why the traits do not explicitly mention it. Just like regeneration do not take the Bleeding rules into account.

How should regeneration take the Bleeding rules into account?

[evileeyore]

Originally Posted by NineDaysDead

How should regeneration take the Bleeding rules into account?

It's more that the optional Bleeding rules don't take healing into account.


But then a simple GM ruling of "You've regened the wound, it stops bleeding" would cover that.

[Hide]

Originally Posted by Hide

AFAIK it says you die: "(...) You automatically fail the HT roll to stay alive if reduced to -HP or below (...)" B137.

So... mortally wounded means you are still alive. Here it says you fail staying alive, just saying.

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Hide

So... mortally wounded means you are still alive.

Mortally wounded occurs when you fail the HT roll to remain alive.

[Hide]

Originally Posted by Anthony

Mortally wounded occurs when you fail the HT roll to remain alive.

I think that would be the case for a normal mate; but this is a fragile mate.

The text does not say jump to "-1xHP" status when hitting HP below zero; consider what eevee pointed out (quoting the book, B137): "that much damage severs your ties with the force that animates you". So you die.

You took a -50 CP disadvantage after all.

If it makes you comfortable, you could say a fragile character instantly jumps to -1xHP status when pushed below 0 HP... However, that would be stretching it further than needed; then I could say, "Hey, since my PC has 'fragile unnatural' it always is an automatic HT rolll failure and I am perma-stuck on mortally wounded; I just need to hide and wait 1,799 turns for someone to stabilize me".

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Hide

I think that would be the case for a normal mate; but this is a fragile mate.

The point is, the rules text does not say this. I think it's probably what the rules are intended to do, but there are plenty of cases where the intent of the rules does not match up with the actual rules (or where the apparent intent is unclear).

[Hide]

Originally Posted by Anthony

The point is, the rules text does not say this. I think it's probably what the rules are intended to do, but there are plenty of cases where the intent of the rules does not match up with the actual rules (or where the apparent intent is unclear).

I don’t know man; I feel this is stepping into the fields of rhetoric.

I know of a few situations in which yeah, certain rules seem to state something else on their respective subjects while the intention is different; however, regarding your OP, and given the context of these particular disadvantages (i.e. point value, intention and the rest of the text) I would say it is clear that a character with “fragile unnatural” dies at HP<0 and that if said character had “fragile explosive” too, that there will be a chance of explosion (depending on your dice).

Personally, I would not stack these two at full value because both disadvantages ultimately imply you have issues to stay alive at a certain HP threshold, “unnatural” having the worst; yet, if there are means to revive a PC (impeded at -10xHP), then “explosive” might have a more meaningful value (since it completely destroys the body, preventing your revival).

[Ulzgoroth]

Originally Posted by Hide

I don’t know man; I feel this is stepping into the fields of rhetoric.

I know of a few situations in which yeah, certain rules seem to state something else on their respective subjects while the intention is different; however, regarding your OP, and given the context of these particular disadvantages (i.e. point value, intention and the rest of the text) I would say it is clear that a character with “fragile unnatural” dies at HP<0 and that if said character had “fragile explosive” too, that there will be a chance of explosion (depending on your dice).

Personally, I would not stack these two at full value because both disadvantages ultimately imply you have issues to stay alive at a certain HP threshold, “unnatural” having the worst; yet, if there are means to revive a PC (impeded at -10xHP), then “explosive” might have a more meaningful value (since it completely destroys the body, preventing your revival).

It's pretty fair to point out when rules text is written so that the legalistic reading doesn't give the intended interpretation.

Doesn't mean you should play with an obviously-undesired legalistic RAW interpretation, of course.