Jet minimum reach

[cupbearer]

hi

if i buy innate attack as a jet, what is the minimum reach? is it close or 1 yard? Or something else?

thanks.

Oliver.

[Mr_Sandman]

I don't think it's explicitly stated anywhere, but I don't see any reason a jet couldn't be used at C.

[mlangsdorf]

An innate attack with jet is technically a form of Ranged Attack, and follows the ranged attack rules for close combat[1] (see the Jet enhancement, Basic p 106). Ranged weapons can be used in close combat (Basic p 391) at a penalty equal to their Bulk. Innate attacks inherently have Bulk 0 (see http://forums.sjgames.com/showpost.p...7&postcount=15) and can be used without penalty in close combat.

[1] Innate attacks are ranged attacks, by definition, unless you add the Melee Attack limitation. Jet is mutually exclusive with Melee Attack, so Innate attacks with Jet are still ranged attacks.

[Donny Brook]

I'm pretty sure I've seen something at least semi-official saying Jets should be treated like melee attacks.

[Tinman]

Originally Posted by Donny Brook

I'm pretty sure I've seen something at least semi-official saying Jets should be treated like melee attacks.

I've seen this.
Also, Kromm talking about mages using them light lightsabers.

[Anaraxes]

Originally Posted by Donny Brook

I'm pretty sure I've seen something at least semi-official saying Jets should be treated like melee attacks.

In the uFAQ, perhaps? Three Krommquotes referring to jets as melee:

http://forums.sjgames.com/showpost.p...4&postcount=71

[Mr_Sandman]

The description of jet on p. 106 of Characters explicitly says “Treat it as a melee weapon with a very long reach rather than as a ranged weapon.” But, it also gives a 1/2 damage range, which melee weapons don’t have. I think it has to come down to GM common sense. If it’s shooting out of a character’s hand, there should be no problem using it in close combat. On the other hand, if it has a gadget limitation, and it’s be shot from the end of a staff, it might be hard to justify using it at reach C.

[cupbearer]

hi

i agree it is a melee attack and so technically it should have a minimum reach, but i don't see any reference. there is a post on this forum form someone saying it has a min reach 1 yard, but to be honest i haven't seen any reference to where that information comes from. does any one know the official answer?

thank you.
Oliver.

[RGTraynor]

Ugh. I cringe at the thought of using one in close combat, myself. Flame Jet, Sand Jet, Acid Jet, think about it ... most of these are going to splash when they hit a target, since they aren't actually lightsabers. I really most sincerely do NOT want to be mere inches away from a burst of fire or acid impacting a target. I might not be liable to take much damage, but it stands to reason there might be.

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by cupbearer

hi

i agree it is a melee attack and so technically it should have a minimum reach, but i don't see any reference. there is a post on this forum form someone saying it has a min reach 1 yard, but to be honest i haven't seen any reference to where that information comes from. does any one know the official answer?

thank you.
Oliver.

I don't think there is any official answer to be found; you may need to send a PM to Kromm (assuming he's not still busy with the move). Most Jets seem like they'd be usable at Reach C, so I'd treat them as a melee attack with Reach C-10 (unless, as noted, they originate from a staff or similar; in that case I'd increase minimum, 1/2D, and maximum equally - so a Jet can be C-10 with full damage out to 5 yards, 1-11 with full damage out to 6 yards, 2-12 with full damage out to 7 yards, etc).

Originally Posted by RGTraynor

Ugh. I cringe at the thought of using one in close combat, myself. Flame Jet, Sand Jet, Acid Jet, think about it ... most of these are going to splash when they hit a target, since they aren't actually lightsabers. I really most sincerely do NOT want to be mere inches away from a burst of fire or acid impacting a target. I might not be liable to take much damage, but it stands to reason there might be.

Not all Jets are going to splash (and for some the "splash" will typically be harmless, such as with a typical water jet), and indeed those that do splash should also be able to damage other objects/characters near the struck target. If you want your Jet to have appreciable splash, you'll want to toss some level of Explosion on some of the damage (this would be a good case for the GM to waive the "burning or crushing only" requirement). Say you toss Explosion on 10% of the damage (for net +5%). This would mean anything in the same hex as the target will take 10% of the rolled damage as "splash damage," anything 1 yard away will take around 3.33%, anything 2 yards away will take around 1.67%, etc (although unless you've got really high initial damage, this will typically just mean damage to those in the same hex and maybe a bit to those a yard away).