Disadvantages for Secret beings, i.e. Bigfoot, a Demon, or an Alien

[RyanW]

Originally Posted by JulianLW

Maybe the thing I'm thinking about is an Enemy: Everybody, All the time, with a mitigator: disguise?

That would likely be going too far, and I certainly wouldn't let it be combined with Social Stigma (oh no, the people who are actively trying to kill me every moment of every day also don't like me very much). A severe negative Social Stigma will by itself put many reaction rolls into the "roll again under potential combat situation" territory.

[Aldric]

You don't need to buy Enemy, you may if there is some organization or someone that's hunting you, but it's not really needed.

Monstrous Appearance gives -5 to reaction rolls.
Socia Stigma (Monster) gives an additional -3 and notes that you are feared or hated and liable to be hunted on sight.
On top of that you can probably also claim some OPH.

Your average reaction is very bad, I don't think you need more than that.

A Secret would replace Social Stigma and maybe allow you to walk down the street and interact with people, if you can mitigate that Appearance reaction penalty

[JulianLW]

Originally Posted by RyanW

That would likely be going too far, and I certainly wouldn't let it be combined with Social Stigma (oh no, the people who are actively trying to kill me every moment of every day also don't like me very much). A severe negative Social Stigma will by itself put many reaction rolls into the "roll again under potential combat situation" territory.

I disagree. Social Stigma: Monstrous also covers the disadvantage of not having any civil - or even human - rights. Combining Enemy: Most Humans and Social Stigma is a way of accurately reflecting that lots of humans will draw a gun and shoot at you on sight. But even the ones who don't will find you to be a horrible creature and react to you poorly and call the cops - who will bring guns. With Monstrous Appearance, they'll probably also run away screaming.

Originally Posted by Aldric

You don't need to buy Enemy, you may if there is some organization or someone that's hunting you, but it's not really needed.

Monstrous Appearance gives -5 to reaction rolls.
Socia Stigma (Monster) gives an additional -3 and notes that you are feared or hated and liable to be hunted on sight.
On top of that you can probably also claim some OPH.

Your average reaction is very bad, I don't think you need more than that.

A Secret would replace Social Stigma and maybe allow you to walk down the street and interact with people, if you can mitigate that Appearance reaction penalty

What you've described here is the kind of reaction penalties the Elephant Man suffered from in Victorian England. But people still recognized him as human, mostly. Though some humans DID respond to him as a racial enemy, i.e. a monster. I'm talking about how you would stat Admiral Ackbar if he showed up at your local Starbucks today. That dude has got MUCH more severe GURPS disadvantages than Monstrous Appearance and Social Stigma.

Following the blunt suggestion to figure out the game effects and apply penalties for that, this is what I've come up with for being the only alien on Earth, a package worth [-135].

Enemy: Most Humans (Hunter/15) [-60], Racial Appearance: Monstrous [-20], Secret: Aliens of My Species Exist on Earth [-10], Secret Identity: Human [-30], Social Stigma: Monster [-15]

Explanation: Humans (who frequently would regard any extraterrestrial alien as an enemy to be hunted) are encountered almost all the time on Earth (15 or less) and must be constantly overcome through stealth, disguise, and extreme avoidance. This makes it necessary to live in hiding almost all the time, like Bigfoot - not even the Unabomber's enemies forced him to this degree of hiding, and the Unabomber's lifestyle wouldn't have been cautious enough to protect Admiral Ackbar from almost immediate discovery and (probably) death.

Any human at all who sees you will probably at the very least call the police, who may eventually come in large numbers in pursuit. Any human who encounters you, unless their Perception is defeated by some skill, will react to your Racial Appearance and Social Stigma: Monster (i.e. feared, hated, and without civil or human rights) at -8 total, probably leading to a disastrous reaction. Occasionally these encounters (through failures of Disguise, Stealth, etc.) will put either of your Secrets at risk of becoming public.

If the Secret: Aliens of My Type Exist on Earth is discovered and becomes public, that disadvantage would likely be traded for a negative Racial Reputation, a -4 reaction from everybody, making it much more difficult for to avoid detection. (Your problem would no longer be just "What the hell was that thing?!" but instead, "That was a chupacabra!" or whatever name the media gave to your alien/monster type.)

If Secret Identity: Human is discovered (take this Secret only if you ever attempt to take any actions involving humans - set up a fake identity on the internet, etc - since doing so is engaging in a lethal risk), that disadvantage could be traded for Dead Broke, a -4 Personal Reputation, a change in the power of your Enemy (though without a change the point cost), and -3 Status (lower than a street person) - if you're still at large. But really, when this Secret is discovered, now you're dead or a specimen in a laboratory.

Anyway, all of these together really seem to sufficiently describe just how screwed you'd be if you were the only slimy-looking alien on Earth in 2020. I doubt you'd last long; the only way to do it would be to find the wildest possible place and avoid everybody, all the time. Like Bigfoot.

[RyanW]

Originally Posted by JulianLW

I disagree. Social Stigma: Monstrous also covers the disadvantage of not having any civil - or even human - rights. Combining Enemy: Most Humans and Social Stigma is a way of accurately reflecting that lots of humans will draw a gun and shoot at you on sight. But even the ones who don't will find you to be a horrible creature and react to you poorly and call the cops - who will bring guns. With Monstrous Appearance, they'll probably also run away screaming.

With Social Stigma: Monster and Monstrous Appearance, simply asking for help has a 60% chance of resulting in combat. Having a confrontation with authority (very likely, given that just about everyone will "work against" the monster in some capacity) gives a 99% chance of combat if the monster doesn't flee or completely cooperate.

The closest thing to this in reality is likely "man-eating" predators entering communities or escaping from captivity. People usually avoid them, and call the authorities, rather than immediately attacking them.

[JulianLW]

Originally Posted by RyanW

With Social Stigma: Monster and Monstrous Appearance, simply asking for help has a 60% chance of resulting in combat. Having a confrontation with authority (very likely, given that just about everyone will "work against" the monster in some capacity) gives a 99% chance of combat if the monster doesn't flee or completely cooperate.

The closest thing to this in reality is likely "man-eating" predators entering communities or escaping from captivity. People usually avoid them, and call the authorities, rather than immediately attacking them.

The likeliest reaction to a request for aid is either:

"Requests for aid are denied. The NPCs go about their business, ignoring the PCs."

or

"Requests for aid are denied. Make a 'potential combat' roll; no reaction better than 'Neutral' is possible."

What I'm looking for is the disadvantage for every single encounter being not just a "potential combat" encounter, but a "likely" combat encounter. The character gets no other kinds of encounters from anybody. And with Social Stigma: Monster, even commonsensical NPCs would have no qualms about pulling out a gun and shooting to kill on sight. There is no question of getting of a possible murder charge or destruction of property liability. Being the only Alien in a mundane setting is simply NOT the same as being a Monster in a standard fantasy world - or being a bear or whatever.

Edit: And what if the alien had Charisma, a high Diplomacy skill, and maybe a nice Voice? Could Admiral Ackbar (who arguably did have these traits) go into the local CVS and pull out a regular reaction? No. In no version of the "real" world does he get any reaction but immediate enmity from virtually all humans.

Another Edit: This package is worth [-95] - or [-135] if the alien tries to adopt a human identity and interact with humans. This is quite a bit worse than Cursed [-75], and reading the description of that disadvantage, I think that's valid. The package is also comparable to Terminal Condition, One Month [-100], which also seems about right to me.

[AlexanderHowl]

Actually, my fiancee would think that he is quite cute and would likely go out of her way to help him as long as he was not a threat. While I would be surprised myself, I do not think of someone who is inhuman as an immediate threat, though I would likely keep him away from other people until his motivations were determined.

[JulianLW]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl

Actually, my fiancee would think that he is quite cute and would likely go out of her way to help him as long as he was not a threat. While I would be surprised myself, I do not think of someone who is inhuman as an immediate threat, though I would likely keep him away from other people until his motivations were determined.

Xenophiles.

[RyanW]

Originally Posted by JulianLW

The likeliest reaction to a request for aid is either:

"Requests for aid are denied. The NPCs go about their business, ignoring the PCs."

or

"Requests for aid are denied. Make a 'potential combat' roll; no reaction better than 'Neutral' is possible."

With -8 to reactions, the second is more likely than the first, and together, "potential combat roll" and "potential combat roll at -2" occur over 60% of the time. And at -8, "potential combat roll" means "almost definitely combat".

[pawsplay]

Even if someone was like "OMG it's a demon/bigfoot" the character might still say, "Hey, can I bum a cigarette?" and the NPC might not attack. I think it's a mistake to assume a strong reaction modifier dictates behavior.

[JulianLW]

Bad reactions are not the only - or arguably even the most important - feature of Social Stigma. And Social Stigma doesn't always carry a bad reaction, anyway. The problem with Social Stigma: Monster, is that you're not human, can't rely on human society in any way, and have no rights. Bad reactions are also a problem that doesn't necessarily have anything to do with combat, though they do make combat more likely, as you say. Just because most humans are your enemies doesn't make you less attractive or solve the outsider status issue. A really obviously alien alien on a mundane Earth would experience all of these problems, and they would all exacerbate each other.

Again, just giving the standard monster disadvantages, Monstrous Appearance and Social Stigma: Monster to a character doesn't represent the issue of being the only monster in a setting without monsters, which is a much more significant set of problems:

There are plenty of armed humans all over the place, most of whom would shoot an alien on sight (because of virtually every single sci-fi and horror movie, TV show, and story every made, etc.) - and this has nothing to do with reaction penalties - Enemies.

Even those who wouldn't shoot on sight will almost certainly run screaming in horror (Monstrous Appearance and Stigma) and draw the attention of those who will. And even if you somehow manage to make a friend with a particular human, they'll never be sexually attracted to you, or even feel very comfortable in your presence.

If the cops show up, they gun you down and take photos for the newspapers (yes, just as they would with lots of wild animals): Social Stigma (i.e. no rights whatsoever, not even a human). Due process isn't considered at all. This goes beyond Enemy or any pile of reaction penalties.

Finally, no amount of positive traits are ever going to mitigate how repellent you are to society at large, which indicates both the negative reaction modifiers and an Enemy.

It is possible, over time, that you could, somehow, be recognized by the society and buy off both the Enemy and the Social Stigma ("Alien lives matter!"), but it's going to take a LONG time.