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Old 07-12-2020, 12:52 PM   #1
AllenOwen
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
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Default Damage question

I think I know the answer, but I want to be sure:

If you do 1d+1 damage, and are told that under certain conditions (high enough skill, etc) you increase the damage by say, +1 damage per die, this means that you now do 1d+2 damage, since my die is 1d. Or if I did 2d damage, my damage would now be 2d+2. And I maybe ought to use the optional rule on B269.
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Old 07-12-2020, 12:53 PM   #2
Ulzgoroth
 
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Default Re: Damage question

+1 damage per die means +1 damage per die, not +1 die per...whatever.

EDIT: Did you get a low-profile edit in, or was I hallucinating things? Anyway, yeah, you've got it entirely right.
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Last edited by Ulzgoroth; 07-12-2020 at 01:00 PM.
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Old 07-12-2020, 12:55 PM   #3
Refplace
 
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Default Re: Damage question

Yep, just right.
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Old 07-12-2020, 01:50 PM   #4
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Default Re: Damage question

Quote:
Originally Posted by AllenOwen View Post
I think I know the answer, but I want to be sure:

If you do 1d+1 damage, and are told that under certain conditions (high enough skill, etc) you increase the damage by say, +1 damage per die, this means that you now do 1d+2 damage, since my die is 1d. Or if I did 2d damage, my damage would now be 2d+2. And I maybe ought to use the optional rule on B269.
Correct, I had to read this a few times because my mind was making an assumption on what you wrote, that is it was taking your first example with the second as one example instead of two different examples.

To clarify:
damage modifiers tend to be as you state, +1 (or +2) damage per die, or a flat +1 - +3 damage.

ad+b
where a is the amount of dice and b is the constant add before the above bonus damage.

That gives you:

ad+b+((a OR 2a) OR (+1/+2/+3))

Hopefully that complicates things.
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Old 07-12-2020, 02:52 PM   #5
Balor Patch
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Default Re: Damage question

Quote:
Originally Posted by AllenOwen View Post
I think I know the answer, but I want to be sure:

If you do 1d+1 damage, and are told that under certain conditions (high enough skill, etc) you increase the damage by say, +1 damage per die, this means that you now do 1d+2 damage, since my die is 1d. Or if I did 2d damage, my damage would now be 2d+2. And I maybe ought to use the optional rule on B269.
Damage per die doesn't use the rule on B269. I've never liked that how that ruling privileges one meta-concept (dice) over another (adds) but, between feeling Weapon Master is already overpowered and how using B269 on the fly can be abusive, I've never house ruled against it.
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Old 07-12-2020, 03:04 PM   #6
Varyon
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Default Re: Damage question

One important thing to keep in mind if you're converting Adds to Dice - as noted on B269, per-dice bonuses apply to base damage, not to damage modified by converting adds. If you have a swing of 1d+2, are using a weapon that deals sw+2 cut, and have something (Weapon Master, All Out Attack (Strong), etc) that gives +2/die to damage, your end damage is 1d+6 (which can be converted to 2d+2 or 3d-1, depending on your preference). It is not 2d+4 (which can be converted to 3d), even though that's what you'd get if you added the damage from your weapon, converted adds to dice, and then applied the +2/die bonus.

Granted, the game won't break if you opt to skew things that way - above, you're looking at between +22% (2d+2 becoming 2d+4) and +10.5% (3d-1 becoming 3d) to damage from doing the conversion stepwise. Honestly, one could argue to convert +n/die bonuses into a percentage bonus (based on base damage or damage modified by weapon) to get a cleaner progression, although it would require more math. For reference, +1/die is roughly +30% (1/3.5). So long as you're consistent, you should be fine.
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Old 07-12-2020, 03:42 PM   #7
Anaraxes
 
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Default Re: Damage question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Balor Patch View Post
I've never liked that how that ruling privileges one meta-concept (dice) over another (adds)
You have to define an order of application of those two rules for the literal-rules crowd. Otherwise you're going to get an argument when 2d+2 +2/die converts to 3d, which then should be 3d+1 because you should have gotten +3 for 3 dice rather than +2 for 2, so 2d+5 = 2d+4 (whereupon someone points out that the discrepancy should really center around 2d+3 versus 2d+4). Conversely, if you enforce conversion-to-dice first, then 2d+2 doesn't convert to any extra dice, so you get 2d+4, which should have been 3d the other way around -- and 2d+4 isn't even a legal value to have when adds-to-dice is in force. Sort of misses the point of the adds-to-dice rule.

B269 is pretty clear -- add plusses per die to the total first, so they only count from basic damage. As the last step -- if you choose to use that option in your game, that is -- convert the adds to dice.

The fact that adds-to-dice is optional is just another reason to use basic damage for the plusses per die. It keeps the rest of the procedure the same whether or not you use that option.
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Old 07-12-2020, 04:45 PM   #8
Imbicatus
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Default Re: Damage question

My house rule is that I ignore damage dice conversion. Per die adds never convert . You you may have 2d+6 but you don’t have to slow play to recalculate, it gives PCs an edge, because they are more likely to have weapon master or high unarmed skill, and the difference isn’t enough to lose sleep over.
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Old 07-12-2020, 10:08 PM   #9
tbone
 
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Default Re: Damage question

Check out Kromm's two posts in this thread, which lay down the rule and provide a detailed example to explain the why. It's in response to a DFRPG question, but applies to GURPS too.

http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=153369
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Old 07-13-2020, 02:00 AM   #10
Ultraviolet
 
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Default Re: Damage question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Imbicatus View Post
My house rule is that I ignore damage dice conversion. Per die adds never convert . You you may have 2d+6 but you don’t have to slow play to recalculate, it gives PCs an edge, because they are more likely to have weapon master or high unarmed skill, and the difference isn’t enough to lose sleep over.
When this edition came out, my understanding was what you did not convert adds to extra dice, so I insisted to my co-players that we didn't. It is almost completeley an accepted fact now, and the issue never comes up.
One point was to not complicate the "+1/die" modifiers and the like.
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