[Spaceships] High-End Spaceships

[scc]

OK, I'm kicking around an idea for some opponents, probably for military style space combat games but I've run into a problem: The PC's rivals will need fighters (Or spaceships, depending) that while built to the same plans as normal mook units are simply better.

Roughly speaking all spaceships belonging to the bag guys will be cybershells, and any rivals they pick up will be very high level infomorphs.

I am planning on using something like the Super Robots call out from page 8 of Pyramid #3/40, but only when a rival is actually in the cockpit, and those will apply even if he's piloting a mook craft for some reason

[Mailanka]

I'm not entirely sure I understand the problem. It's that you want to have (for example) a bunch of F-15 fighters, but there are "mook" F-15s that are easily shot down and "elite" F-15 fighters that are not?

Well, a lot of that difference be in the pilot. Someone with pilot 18 is much harder to shoot down and is much more likely to get on your 6 than someone with pilot 12. If you start adding in the rules for Damage Control and gunnery and such, then the difference between a 250 point pilot and a 50 point pilot becomes very clear.

It's also quite probable that even though they all look like F-15s, some are wussy F-15As and some are totally awesome F-15Es (or whatever). They might have mostly the same traits, but you could legitimately alter things like what armor they have one, or the quality of their firearms, or what their engines are. These are rather broad changes, but they can certainly fit.

And finally, you have the solution you already devised.

I might add that the difference between a mook and a non-mook is often just the tag "mook." Mooks typically never make defense rolls and a single hit will take them down. That might also be appropriate here, depending on your genre conventions.

[Varyon]

If you want craft piloted by elites to perform better - and not just in terms of generic mook rules (drop in one hit, no defense rolls, etc) and higher skill - there are certain stats that will be appropriate to improve. DR may make some sense (particularly appropriate if they've got force screens), as might damage, HT, and so forth. Ideally, you'll want it to be things that make sense for someone to get lucky on - the improved DR simply means incoming shots tend to hit the most heavily armored parts and/or tend to impact at less-than-ideal angles, damage means the pilots tend to hit weak points, HT just means the ship is more reliable in their hands, and so forth.

Another option to consider, particularly if your fighter craft are glass cannons, is to have elites - and the PC's - each fly as the leader in a wing of fighters. The wing acts in tandem, using the leader's skill but adding together RoF and the like (fluff-wise, when they hit a target, the vast majority of the rounds that actually hit will be from the leader). The character's craft will not be hit for more than cosmetic damage until all the other craft in the wing have been downed - the others serve as a buffer to keep the character alive.

[vicky_molokh]

Consider uses of Luck.

[David Johnston2]

It seems like this is a clearly a result of radical differences in skill levels. The non-sapient machines simply aren't good shots or pilots.

[Peter Knutsen]

Originally Posted by Mailanka

I'm not entirely sure I understand the problem. It's that you want to have (for example) a bunch of F-15 fighters, but there are "mook" F-15s that are easily shot down and "elite" F-15 fighters that are not?

Well, a lot of that difference be in the pilot. Someone with pilot 18 is much harder to shoot down and is much more likely to get on your 6 than someone with pilot 12. If you start adding in the rules for Damage Control and gunnery and such, then the difference between a 250 point pilot and a 50 point pilot becomes very clear.

It's also quite probable that even though they all look like F-15s, some are wussy F-15As and some are totally awesome F-15Es (or whatever). They might have mostly the same traits, but you could legitimately alter things like what armor they have one, or the quality of their firearms, or what their engines are. These are rather broad changes, but they can certainly fit.

And finally, you have the solution you already devised.

I might add that the difference between a mook and a non-mook is often just the tag "mook." Mooks typically never make defense rolls and a single hit will take them down. That might also be appropriate here, depending on your genre conventions.

In a DF type campaign, it can make sense for some adventurer characters to specialize in Mook-Slaying, having levels of Striking ST or 1 Extra Attack Limited to Only Vs Mooks.

Heck, I'm even considering something fairly close to that for my Ärth setting, which isn't like DF at all.

In a space opera-inspired GURPS Spaceships setting, it could well make sense for player characters or named NPCs to have extra levels of certain traits, Limtied to Only Vs Mooks. Not just attack but also defence. I think there's a Vehicular Dodge in one of the GURPS Action volumes. Even if normally only one level is allowed, it could be perfectly reasonable to allow that one general-purpose level and also a stack of 2-4 levels that are Only Vs Mooks.

[Anthony]

In a space opera setting I would ignore [Spaceships] and just build everything as characters, possibly with a scaling rule (i.e. everything is D-scale for free, or something of the sort).

[scc]

OK, let me explain what I was going through my head.

I was leafing through Spaceships 7 and I saw both the Sapient Brain and Ether Flukes. I've also been re-reading parts of Mecha and the bit on hive races caught my eye and suddenly it occurred to me that using the Psionic Sapient Brain and Ether Flukes and the option for bio-ships I could make the Vjara from Macross Frontier, or a least something like them.

One thing lead to another and with the psychic thing I'm thinking personalities could move between bodies and that possibly only a few of the spacecraft actually have self-aware personalities inside them, the rest a just mindless drones. I'm thinking a model here would be the Invid where the only self aware where the Regis, Ariel, Sera and Corg.

Having these personalities would allow PCs to have Rivals among the enemy ranks, ones that keep coming back even if they die. It could even allow them to have lovers of there an immature princess personalities that can take human form somehow.

I'm thinking the these personalities normally get to use better then normal craft. Some of this could be accomplished by selecting better systems like using Hot Reactionless Engines instead of standard ones, or picking better weapons for them, but they should defiantly have better defenses as well, particular armor, and that's not possible for organic armor with the current options.

I'm thinking that personalities have a variety of psychic powers.

I'm sorry for not being more forth coming in the OP but I'm thinking submitting things to Pyramid

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by scc

I'm thinking the these personalities normally get to use better then normal craft. Some of this could be accomplished by selecting better systems like using Hot Reactionless Engines instead of standard ones, or picking better weapons for them, but they should defiantly have better defenses as well, particular armor, and that's not possible for organic armor with the current options.

I'm thinking that personalities have a variety of psychic powers.

I'd actually work on combining these two thoughts. The main difference between normal drones and those designed for sapients might be the inclusion of a Psionic Amplifier*, letting the personality use its psychic powers on the scale of spaceship combat. So an elite fighter isn't tougher because it has more armor, but because the pilot is projecting a psychokinetic force-field strong enough to protect against enemy weapons. Other powers could make a ship faster and more maneuverable, guide projectiles towards their targets, or even teleport in combat.

Assuming that these hive ships are all NPCs, I wouldn't worry about precise stats for the powers or amplifiers. Just note on the sheet for a particular pilot what the effects of his powers are. Some may be passive (shield and maneuverability enhancements) while others may require a skill roll to activate. These powers might (though don't necessarily have to) scale with the size of the ship being piloted - a bigger ship means a bigger amplifier.

*I thought I saw one of these in Spaceships 7, but can't find it now. Anyone know if it was from somewhere else, or did I just make it up?

[scc]

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

I'd actually work on combining these two thoughts. The main difference between normal drones and those designed for sapients might be the inclusion of a Psionic Amplifier*, letting the personality use its psychic powers on the scale of spaceship combat. So an elite fighter isn't tougher because it has more armor, but because the pilot is projecting a psychokinetic force-field strong enough to protect against enemy weapons. Other powers could make a ship faster and more maneuverable, guide projectiles towards their targets, or even teleport in combat.

Assuming that these hive ships are all NPCs, I wouldn't worry about precise stats for the powers or amplifiers. Just note on the sheet for a particular pilot what the effects of his powers are. Some may be passive (shield and maneuverability enhancements) while others may require a skill roll to activate. These powers might (though don't necessarily have to) scale with the size of the ship being piloted - a bigger ship means a bigger amplifier.

*I thought I saw one of these in Spaceships 7, but can't find it now. Anyone know if it was from somewhere else, or did I just make it up?

I was already assuming that the personalities would have psionic powers that would reinforce the ships they're in, regardless of whether they're in a mook or elite unit