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Old 06-20-2013, 08:12 PM   #1
RogerBacon
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Default Side effect questions

Side effect says that the roll to resist is -1 per 2 points of damage that penetrates DR.

Q1: Can an attack that does no wounding still have a side effect? Would teh 'damage' just be rolled for teh purposes of seeing how much would have penetrated to find the penalty or would there be no penalty?

Q2: It says stunning wears off normally, which means a roll to recover each round. Is that roll also penalized by the amount that the initial roll was or is it unmodified?
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Old 06-20-2013, 08:31 PM   #2
gilbertocarlos
 
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Default Re: Side effect questions

No, No.

If you don't do damage, the roll is unmodified.
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Old 06-20-2013, 08:41 PM   #3
Sunrunners_Fire
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Default Re: Side effect questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerBacon View Post
Q1: Can an attack that does no wounding still have a side effect?
Yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerBacon View Post
Would teh 'damage' just be rolled for teh purposes of seeing how much would have penetrated to find the penalty or would there be no penalty?
You would determine penetrating damage as per normal. No Wounding merely means the attack's penetrating damage doesn't result in HP or FP loss; it doesn't result in injury.

It remains penetrating damage and so Side Effect functions normally as Side Effect doesn't care about injury, only penetrating damage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerBacon View Post
Q2: It says stunning wears off normally, which means a roll to recover each round. Is that roll also penalized by the amount that the initial roll was or is it unmodified?
I've seen it argued both ways. I don't recall what the official ruling was.

I, personally, follow the same rule for Side Effect as I do for Affliction. The HT+1 check is modified by the level of the Affliction and so the HT+1 check is modified by one-half the penetrating damage.
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Old 06-20-2013, 09:05 PM   #4
RogerBacon
 
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Default Re: Side effect questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire View Post
Yes.



You would determine penetrating damage as per normal. No Wounding merely means the attack's penetrating damage doesn't result in HP or FP loss; it doesn't result in injury.

It remains penetrating damage and so Side Effect functions normally as Side Effect doesn't care about injury, only penetrating damage.



I've seen it argued both ways. I don't recall what the official ruling was.

I, personally, follow the same rule for Side Effect as I do for Affliction. The HT+1 check is modified by the level of the Affliction and so the HT+1 check is modified by one-half the penetrating damage.
Thanks. That's the way I'm thinking of doing it too.
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Old 06-20-2013, 09:24 PM   #5
vierasmarius
 
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Default Re: Side effect questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by gilbertocarlos View Post
No, No.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire View Post
Yes.
I've seen it argued both ways (as here). I'm in the "yes" camp myself, but even if you feel Side Effects shouldn't be allowed on No Wounding attacks, you could use a "Virtual" Wounding modifier (somewhere between -25% and -40%) which only tracks wounds for the purpose of Side Effect / Symptom, and does no actual injury. I don't think that's necessary for Side Effect, but to have a Symptom last beyond the moment of "injury" you'll need something a little meatier than No Wounding.
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Old 06-20-2013, 11:59 PM   #6
Anthony
 
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Default Re: Side effect questions

Technically, 'no wounding' does not mean 'no damage'; it basically indicates a wounding multiplier of 0. However, you can't get symptoms with no wounding.
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Old 06-21-2013, 12:45 AM   #7
Sunrunners_Fire
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Default Re: Side effect questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony View Post
Technically, 'no wounding' does not mean 'no damage'; it basically indicates a wounding multiplier of 0. However, you can't get symptoms with no wounding.
You can't get Symptoms to work with No Wounding, correct. No Wounding doesn't do HP loss and Symptoms requires HP loss in order to function. You can get Side Effect to work with No Wounding as it doesn't care how much or how little HP you've lost; it only cares about the damage that penetrated DR.

GURPS Basic, pg 109:
Quote:
Side Effect
Variable
You may only add this enhancement to an Innate Attack, and you cannot combine it with penetration modifiers other than Armor Divisor. If any damage penetrates the target’s DR, he must make a HT roll, at -1 per 2 points of penetrating damage, or suffer a “side effect.”
Quote:
Symptoms
Variable
Symptoms are effects that occur if the cumulative damage (HP or FP loss) inflicted by the enhanced Innate Attack exceeds a fraction of the victim’s basic HP or FP. The victim does not get a HT roll to resist Symptoms! The GM should consider limiting Symptoms to attacks that inflict 1d damage or less.
GURPS Basic, pg 111:
Quote:
No Wounding (nw)
-50%
The attack inflicts basic damage, and may cause knockback and blunt trauma, but its penetrating damage has no wounding effect (HP or FP loss). Apply this limitation to a crushing attack to represent effects such as a mighty gust of wind or jet of water. Use it with impaling, piercing, or cutting attacks that are carriers for Afflictions or Innate Attacks (usually those that inflict fatigue or toxic damage) with the Follow-Up modifier (p. 105); this represents small poison darts, stings, etc. that can slip through armor without inflicting grievous wounds.
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Old 06-21-2013, 10:22 AM   #8
Kromm
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Default Re: Side effect questions

Yes, the correct sequence is:
  1. Roll basic damage.
  2. Assess effects that depend on basic damage, such as blunt trauma, knockback, and DR ablation from corrosive damage.
  3. Subtract DR to find penetrating damage.
  4. Assess effects that depend on penetrating damage, such as Side Effect.
  5. Apply wounding modifier to find injury.
  6. Assess effects that depend on injury, such as crippling and Symptoms.
No Wounding is irrelevant until you reach step 5.
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