Star Wars Stormtroopers in Real Armor [Ultratech]

[Say, it isn't that bad!]

Originally Posted by awesomenessofme1

The only classified information they'd ever be given is the amount needed to perform their specific, current mission and it would be very limited even then.

Without addressing the other point, which I'm undecided on; this second one is probably accurate. "Need to know" is a thing, as far as I know, and the vast majority of classified stuff, they wouldn't need to know.

[isf]

Another option is that even though the storm trooper armor looked the same, later models were cheaper and less advanced versions of the original armor: you don't need milspec armor to terrorize civilians.

[AlexanderHowl]

Originally Posted by awesomenessofme1

We're going to just have to agree to disagree on Legal Immunity (I would say the same laws being enforced by a different authority isn't enough to justify it), but I think their Rank would cover any need for security clearance. The only classified information they'd ever be given is the amount needed to perform their specific, current mission and it would be very limited even then.

Rank is unrelated to Security Clearance among members of any military structure (a Rank 6 Chaplain will usually not have access to any classified information). Anyway, access to need to know information is the definition of Security Clearance 1. As for Legal Immunity, Legal Immunity 1 is defined as equivalent restrictions from a different authority.

[Say, it isn't that bad!]

Originally Posted by isf

Another option is that even though the storm trooper armor looked the same, later models were cheaper and less advanced versions of the original armor: you don't need milspec armor to terrorize civilians.

With electronic Friend or Foe, and badge ID, it's entirely possible that one group of stormtroopers could be elites wearing top-of-the-line armour, and another group is random minions whose job is to patrol while looking scary, and you'd need an Armoury roll at close range to tell the difference.

[Say, it isn't that bad!]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl

Rank is unrelated to Security Clearance among members of any military structure (a Rank 6 Chaplain will usually not have access to any classified information). Anyway, access to need to know information is the definition of Security Clearance 1. As for Legal Immunity, Legal Immunity 1 is defined as equivalent restrictions from a different authority.

Hmm... just checked, and you're right.

[awesomenessofme1]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl

Rank is unrelated to Security Clearance among members of any military structure (a Rank 6 Chaplain will usually not have access to any classified information).

This isn't true at all.

"For instance, a general “cleared” for military secrets commensurate with his Military Rank would not have to buy Security Clearance separately, but a civilian with exactly the same level of access would have to pay points for the privilege." - B82

A chaplain almost certainly wouldn't have Rank 6. He would have a lower Rank and a few levels of Courtesy Rank.

"Limited-duty officers, specialists, and personnel with little actual responsibility or command authority have a lower Rank in GURPS terms, despite possibly possessing titles identical to those of a higher Rank; represent this with one or more levels of Courtesy Rank." - B30

Edit: And re: Legal Immunity, like I said, agree to disagree. The book says the lowest level of Legal Immunity means "You are not subject to ordinary laws, but the rules that govern your behavior are just as strict." Soldiers are subject to the same laws, just tried in a different court. In my opinion, that doesn't rise to the level of Legal Immunity. But I can understand why someone would interpret it that way.

[Say, it isn't that bad!]

Originally Posted by awesomenessofme1

Edit: And re: Legal Immunity, like I said, agree to disagree. The book says the lowest level of Legal Immunity means "You are not subject to ordinary laws, but the rules that govern your behavior are just as strict." Soldiers are subject to the same laws, just tried in a different court. In my opinion, that doesn't rise to the level of Legal Immunity. But I can understand why someone would interpret it that way.

Given that most countries' military laws are codified in entirely separate books than their civilian laws, and given that most countries do not allow their civilians access to: fully-equipped, fully-weapon'd tanks; fully-automatic weapons; grenades; rocket launchers; etc., it seems clear that military personnel are most often under a different set of laws.

Combined with the fact that Stormtroopers are often a de facto occupation force, and it does seem reasonable to assign Legal Immunity rank 1 to them.

[AlexanderHowl]

Originally Posted by awesomenessofme1

This isn't true at all.

"For instance, a general “cleared” for military secrets commensurate with his Military Rank would not have to buy Security Clearance separately, but a civilian with exactly the same level of access would have to pay points for the privilege." - B82

A chaplain almost certainly wouldn't have Rank 6. He would have a lower Rank and a few levels of Courtesy Rank.

"Limited-duty officers, specialists, and personnel with little actual responsibility or command authority have a lower Rank in GURPS terms, despite possibly possessing titles identical to those of a higher Rank; represent this with one or more levels of Courtesy Rank." - B30

Edit: And re: Legal Immunity, like I said, agree to disagree. The book says the lowest level of Legal Immunity means "You are not subject to ordinary laws, but the rules that govern your behavior are just as strict." Soldiers are subject to the same laws, just tried in a different court. In my opinion, that doesn't rise to the level of Legal Immunity. But I can understand why someone would interpret it that way.

I have to disagree. An O-7 chaplain is still O-7 and may whatever deity they believe in help a lesser ranked individual who forgets it. Just because they do not have line command does not mean that they do not have command, they just have command over the entire Chaplain Corps for their service.

[awesomenessofme1]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl

I have to disagree. An O-7 chaplain is still O-7 and may whatever deity they believe in help a lesser ranked individual who forgets it. Just because they do not have line command does not mean that they do not have command, they just have command over the entire Chaplain Corps for their service.

It's perfectly fine for you to think that, but it's not what the rules say. And you didn't acknowledge my more substantive point.

[AlexanderHowl]

The clearance available to flag officers vary between their exact jobs. An O-7 chaplain, as noted above, may not have knowledge available to an O-7 supply officer, who may not have knowledge available to an O-7 line officer. Staff officers, however, have command positions, so they would have Military Rank according to their rank in the military. Security Clearance 1 is sufficient to differentiate between the basic level of secrets for staff officers and line officers (at the 'need to know' level).