Observing other people's games

Grouchy Chris · 08-12-2011, 07:17 PM

I often think that seeing how a different group runs their game would be interesting and informative. We often talk about various playing and GMing styles here, but to me, it seems a bit like talking about different styles of painting or moviemaking without ever seeing anyone else's paintings or movies. It's difficult to get an idea of what they're really like.

So, do you ever sit in on another game, to see how another group does it? Do you ever have others come by and observe your game?

whswhs · 08-12-2011, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grouchy Chris

So, do you ever sit in on another game, to see how another group does it? Do you ever have others come by and observe your game?

I haven't done the former a lot; I don't have that much gaming time left over. I observed a friend's GURPS Steampunk campaign, back when GURPS Steampunk was in playtest, but that was for professional reasons. On the other hand, I'm glad to have people observe sessions of my own campaigns; in fact I actively encourage it for anyone who's thinking of becoming a player of mine.

Bill Stoddard

Dammann · 08-12-2011, 08:37 PM

I've had observers, but never been one. Anytime I have been acquainted enough with someone to sit in, I have usually chosen to participate.

whswhs · 08-12-2011, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dammann

I've had observers, but never been one. Anytime I have been acquainted enough with someone to sit in, I have usually chosen to participate.

How well acquainted do you have to be? I invite people on fairly brief acquaintance; or on the basis of newsgroup discussion, in two cases; or even just after one of my players has asked permission on their behalf. My feeling is that it's to my interest to have more people know what my games are like. . . .

Bill Stoddard

whswhs · 08-12-2011, 08:53 PM

Incidentally, there's one other option here: Inviting someone to play a cameo in a campaign they're not in. I've had any number of outstanding performances. For example, in Manse, after we spent the entire three years building up to entry into the dark underground realm of the master adversary, I invited a friend to attend in that role . . . and he showed up for the first of two sessions in his "evil wizard" convention costume, which had the players saying, "We're in for it now!"

Bill Stoddard

Dammann · 08-13-2011, 03:55 AM

I guess you wouldn't need to be all that well acquainted, but most of the people I've known who I've learned are running a game are short on players. And this surprises me, since, to me, it seems like there are about 50 players to every GM, and most players never run a campaign.

You sound like you are fortunate enough to have a lot of potential players around, but you also sound like you foster that situation well. I suspect most GMs are less proactive in building up a network of players.

I love the idea of the adversary showing up after so much build up, in person, in costume!

Mr_Sandman · 08-13-2011, 07:41 AM

I haven't liked observers in the past. I felt that someone watching can inhibit my, or my players, creativity.

Recently though, I've been running a game in a FLGS, rather than in a private home, for the first time. So when someone asked if they could observe, I figured, why not? It's a public place. Also, since this was someone coming into a gaming store, they are genuinely interested in gaming, I'd let them see how GURPS works.

That was the session that one of my younger players decided to go out of control. His character went on a senseless killing spree during what was supposed to be a stealthy, recon, information gathering mission, and generally behaved in an antic manner that had some of my other players talking about leaving the game afterwards if I didn't do something about the player. As it turned out, the problem player left the game right after that, but I still shake my head over the impression that must have been left on the observer.

whswhs · 08-13-2011, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dammann

You sound like you are fortunate enough to have a lot of potential players around, but you also sound like you foster that situation well. I suspect most GMs are less proactive in building up a network of players.

That's probably a good way to look at it. I read about a lot of games where the group is pre-existent, and one person within the group agrees to run a campaign for the already established group. I've never done that, right back to when I first started running dungeon crawls in the 1970s! My approach has always been to come up with the idea for a campaign, and then look for suitable players, creating the player group around the campaign . . . and to invite in people I haven't had as players before. As a by-product, I've long had a network of more interested players than will fit into the largest single session I'd be willing to run. Letting people observe is one way I recruit new players and give my established players a chance to size up people they haven't met.

Quote:

I love the idea of the adversary showing up after so much build up, in person, in costume!

I had a milder version of that in my Gods and Monsters campaign (crypto supers in the British Secret Service ca. 1920): There were two episodes that involved encounters with a mysterious flying boy from a remote island. The woman I recruited to play the part showed up clad in green!

Grouchy Chris · 08-13-2011, 12:14 PM

One reason I'd like to drop in as an observer is to get a better idea of how other styles actually work in practice. I've thought before that a game with a certain style would not appeal to me, but then I thought, "Isn't that rather like saying you don't like horror movies without ever having seen a good horror movie?" Perhaps if I saw a different style done well, I'd have a different opinion.

There are also questions of housekeeping and organization that I don't think I'd ever think to ask, but which might come up from observing someone else's game. Simple things like where to keep all the paperwork or how to do a certain transition, for instance. These little tips might come up in forum conversation, but then again they might not, and I think I'd benefit better demonstration than from description, anyway.

And of course it's worthwhile just to meet other people. People are interesting, and people who are interested in the things I'm interested in doubly so.

hatch · 08-13-2011, 04:25 PM

I've been playing RPGs for almost 30 years now, so just by the fact of having played with lots of different people in lots of different places, I've seen a lot of play styles first hand. If you're a relatively new or inexperienced player, or if you've only played with one or two groups then I think the best thing you can do to improve your gaming is to just play with as many different people in as many different games as you can. I'm not so much a fan of "sitting in" as just picking up dice and a character sheet and playing. Personally, I would feel weird just watching a group play without being engaged, and I would feel weird being observed by a non-player.

If I just want to do a "check it out" thing with a group, then I'll offer to play a minor character or sidekick, or flesh out an NPC. Somebody that can be killed off if things aren't working out, or if things do work out and I want to switch to playing a 'regular.'

It's not everyone's cup of tea, but if you want to do the RPG equivalent of "speed dating" you might try online gaming with tools like Fantasy Grounds or Maptools. Online groups tend to be loose-knit with a fair amount of churn. So it's not uncommon to join a group, play a session or two and then move on to another group or game. Plus, the Internet lets you play with people you'd never get to play with. I once played in a Savage Worlds online group where I was the only American. The other players were in Ireland, Spain, Japan, Chile, and Trinidad. We started out using voice chat but had to switch to text because nobody could understand anyone else's accent. It was a lot of fun, and a very broadening experience.

08-12-2011, 07:17 PM	#1
Grouchy Chris Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: The City of Subdued Excitement	Observing other people's games I often think that seeing how a different group runs their game would be interesting and informative. We often talk about various playing and GMing styles here, but to me, it seems a bit like talking about different styles of painting or moviemaking without ever seeing anyone else's paintings or movies. It's difficult to get an idea of what they're really like. So, do you ever sit in on another game, to see how another group does it? Do you ever have others come by and observe your game? __________________ The GURPS Wiki has 581 articles and counting! My blog, mainly about GURPS.

08-12-2011, 08:37 PM	#3
Dammann Join Date: May 2011	Re: Observing other people's games I've had observers, but never been one. Anytime I have been acquainted enough with someone to sit in, I have usually chosen to participate.

08-12-2011, 08:53 PM	#5
whswhs Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Lawrence, KS	Re: Observing other people's games Incidentally, there's one other option here: Inviting someone to play a cameo in a campaign they're not in. I've had any number of outstanding performances. For example, in Manse, after we spent the entire three years building up to entry into the dark underground realm of the master adversary, I invited a friend to attend in that role . . . and he showed up for the first of two sessions in his "evil wizard" convention costume, which had the players saying, "We're in for it now!" Bill Stoddard

08-13-2011, 03:55 AM	#6
Dammann Join Date: May 2011	Re: Observing other people's games I guess you wouldn't need to be all that well acquainted, but most of the people I've known who I've learned are running a game are short on players. And this surprises me, since, to me, it seems like there are about 50 players to every GM, and most players never run a campaign. You sound like you are fortunate enough to have a lot of potential players around, but you also sound like you foster that situation well. I suspect most GMs are less proactive in building up a network of players. I love the idea of the adversary showing up after so much build up, in person, in costume!

08-13-2011, 07:41 AM	#7
Mr_Sandman Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: L.I., NY	Re: Observing other people's games I haven't liked observers in the past. I felt that someone watching can inhibit my, or my players, creativity. Recently though, I've been running a game in a FLGS, rather than in a private home, for the first time. So when someone asked if they could observe, I figured, why not? It's a public place. Also, since this was someone coming into a gaming store, they are genuinely interested in gaming, I'd let them see how GURPS works. That was the session that one of my younger players decided to go out of control. His character went on a senseless killing spree during what was supposed to be a stealthy, recon, information gathering mission, and generally behaved in an antic manner that had some of my other players talking about leaving the game afterwards if I didn't do something about the player. As it turned out, the problem player left the game right after that, but I still shake my head over the impression that must have been left on the observer.

08-13-2011, 12:14 PM	#9
Grouchy Chris Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: The City of Subdued Excitement	Re: Observing other people's games One reason I'd like to drop in as an observer is to get a better idea of how other styles actually work in practice. I've thought before that a game with a certain style would not appeal to me, but then I thought, "Isn't that rather like saying you don't like horror movies without ever having seen a good horror movie?" Perhaps if I saw a different style done well, I'd have a different opinion. There are also questions of housekeeping and organization that I don't think I'd ever think to ask, but which might come up from observing someone else's game. Simple things like where to keep all the paperwork or how to do a certain transition, for instance. These little tips might come up in forum conversation, but then again they might not, and I think I'd benefit better demonstration than from description, anyway. And of course it's worthwhile just to meet other people. People are interesting, and people who are interested in the things I'm interested in doubly so. __________________ The GURPS Wiki has 581 articles and counting! My blog, mainly about GURPS.

08-13-2011, 04:25 PM	#10
hatch Join Date: Aug 2011	Re: Observing other people's games I've been playing RPGs for almost 30 years now, so just by the fact of having played with lots of different people in lots of different places, I've seen a lot of play styles first hand. If you're a relatively new or inexperienced player, or if you've only played with one or two groups then I think the best thing you can do to improve your gaming is to just play with as many different people in as many different games as you can. I'm not so much a fan of "sitting in" as just picking up dice and a character sheet and playing. Personally, I would feel weird just watching a group play without being engaged, and I would feel weird being observed by a non-player. If I just want to do a "check it out" thing with a group, then I'll offer to play a minor character or sidekick, or flesh out an NPC. Somebody that can be killed off if things aren't working out, or if things do work out and I want to switch to playing a 'regular.' It's not everyone's cup of tea, but if you want to do the RPG equivalent of "speed dating" you might try online gaming with tools like Fantasy Grounds or Maptools. Online groups tend to be loose-knit with a fair amount of churn. So it's not uncommon to join a group, play a session or two and then move on to another group or game. Plus, the Internet lets you play with people you'd never get to play with. I once played in a Savage Worlds online group where I was the only American. The other players were in Ireland, Spain, Japan, Chile, and Trinidad. We started out using voice chat but had to switch to text because nobody could understand anyone else's accent. It was a lot of fun, and a very broadening experience.