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Old 08-11-2009, 03:02 PM   #21
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Default Re: [Martial Arts] Getting the Wind Knocked Out of You

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Originally Posted by Crakkerjakk View Post
Sounds like you need to go gather some data next time you're at the bar.
Adults can't go around punching each other for no reason.

I gathered all my data as a youth. Purely horseplay, of course, nothing serious. But it's defintely very easy to stun an unprepared person with a solar plexus blow.
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Old 08-11-2009, 04:31 PM   #22
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Default Re: [Martial Arts] Getting the Wind Knocked Out of You

That depends entirely on the person. Heavy abdominal musculature and general fitness both greatly affect this, as does ones pain threshold. I got kicked in the solar plexus by a black belt in Karate...one who fought full contact... and while it made it a bit harder to breath, it did not slow me down when it came to returning the blow. The same thing applies to groin strikes, btw.
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Old 08-11-2009, 04:35 PM   #23
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Default Re: [Martial Arts] Getting the Wind Knocked Out of You

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Originally Posted by Icelander View Post
Adults can't go around punching each other for no reason.
Not for no reason. For Science!

Seriously, my and my friends are typically quite punch-happy. Though it's usually shoulders. And it is absolutely for no reason. Or at least very very frivolous reasons.
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Old 08-11-2009, 08:32 PM   #24
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Default Re: [Martial Arts] Getting the Wind Knocked Out of You

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Not for no reason. For Science!
It's all fun and games until someone loses their breath :\ ;)
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Old 08-11-2009, 08:53 PM   #25
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Default Re: [Martial Arts] Getting the Wind Knocked Out of You

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Originally Posted by Crakkerjakk View Post
Not for no reason. For Science!

Seriously, my and my friends are typically quite punch-happy. Though it's usually shoulders. And it is absolutely for no reason. Or at least very very frivolous reasons.
Addiction (Minor Violence) or Compulsive Behavior (Minor Violence)?
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Old 08-12-2009, 12:43 AM   #26
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Default Re: [Martial Arts] Getting the Wind Knocked Out of You

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Originally Posted by Icelander
Purely horseplay, of course, nothing serious.
Gathering from "horseplay" and "nothing serious" is going to skew your results, though. Much less impulse to keep going afterwards, no pumping adrenaline, no "I have to keep going or I'll die" mentality. People will stop after hits that might not even slow them down otherwise. Imagine having a lazy office job, and getting a nasty papercut across your finger, and how much you'll notice and focus on it then. Then imagine getting the same cut in the middle of a raging gunbattle; you probably won't even realize you're bleeding until you're wondering who's blood that is on you afterward. GURPS has to aim for the later.

I don't think there's been any time where I've been punched or kicked or anything hard enough to be full-on stunned for anywhere close to 10 seconds, even from complete surprise. Closest I've been took a (low-ish speed) car to do, and I don't think I was stunned for more than a few seconds, if that (Granted, I -did- decide it seemed like a nice place to lay and rest for a bit, but I was still active the whole time).
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Old 08-12-2009, 09:03 AM   #27
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Default Re: [Martial Arts] Getting the Wind Knocked Out of You

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Originally Posted by Phoenix_Dragon View Post

Gathering from "horseplay" and "nothing serious" is going to skew your results, though. Much less impulse to keep going afterwards, no pumping adrenaline, no "I have to keep going or I'll die" mentality.
Agreed. I've been in a few serious punch-ups, and I ignored blows there that I'd have gasped and cursed over when goofing around with friends. You cannot compare the two.

I'd say that "getting the wind knocked out of you" during horseplay is mental stun caused by disbelief that a friend hit you in the vitals (well, solar plexus) for real damage – say, 1 HP. Roll 1d for seconds of "WTF?" and assume another 1-2 seconds for the IQ roll to recover, as for any total surprise situation (p. B393). You're not surprised that you've been hit, but you are surprised that some doofus hit you that hard. Also make the knockdown roll vs. HT for having taken at least 1 HP to the vitals; see p. B420. This latter effect probably matters less than the mental stun, though.

In a real fight, the same injury requires only the knockdown roll, with failure meaning being sent to the deck for a second or two. The fact that you're fighting for your life and expecting to be seriously hurt negates the chance of mental stun.
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Old 08-12-2009, 09:32 AM   #28
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Default Re: [Martial Arts] Getting the Wind Knocked Out of You

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Originally Posted by Kromm View Post
I'd say that "getting the wind knocked out of you" during horseplay is mental stun caused by disbelief that a friend hit you in the vitals (well, solar plexus) for real damage – say, 1 HP.
It is vs HT ... due shock of blow your lungs are contracted and cant expand to take breath in(actually "same" effect as Pressure points strike to torso does).

It can be for 0 dmg(after you catch your breath you dont have any injury;can be done only on unsuspecting,relaxed person).


Edit:
- "as pressure points" in combat
- as hit to unsuspecting person/friend total surprise + physical and mental stun

Last edited by Agramer; 08-12-2009 at 10:00 AM.
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Old 08-12-2009, 01:18 PM   #29
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Default Re: [Martial Arts] Getting the Wind Knocked Out of You

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Originally Posted by Agramer View Post
It is vs HT ... due shock of blow your lungs are contracted and cant expand to take breath in(actually "same" effect as Pressure points strike to torso does).

It can be for 0 dmg(after you catch your breath you dont have any injury;can be done only on unsuspecting,relaxed person).
What is this "no injury" bit? People are entirely too stingy with their damage values here, it seems. A few points of damage arn't that noticable. I'm probably walking around with 2-3 damage on my face, due to a punch last night*. Even a "major" wound isn't something that you necessarily have to go to the doctor for, though you probably should.

I think Kromm has the right of it: Most of the time you get the wind knocked out of you it's going to be Mental Stun, not Physical stun. That's just from my own experience growing up with friends whose idea of fun is punching games.

Last time I went to a buddie's wedding, another friend(call'em K) decided to punch me i nthe gut after the reception, just as a joke. K isn't a weak guy at all, and the punch was totally unexpected. But it didn't have me gasping and wheezing for breath. I had about a second of momentary disorientation(shock penalty?) and then I was fully capable of responding. I did ham it up a bit, but that's because, well, it's entertainment people!

*ST 12, DX +1 Boxing, that's 1d-1, or 0-5 damage. he may be ST 13 though, so it could've been 1-6 damage. My chin will probably be sore for a few days, but he didn't punch me as hard as he could or I would've felt it alot more. But it wasn't what I'd call a "love tap" either.

Edit: cleaned up quote tags.
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Old 08-12-2009, 01:40 PM   #30
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Default Re: [Martial Arts] Getting the Wind Knocked Out of You

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But it didn't have me gasping and wheezing for breath.
Then you didn't "get the wind knocked out of you"—it's when your diaphragm stops working due to a spasm, and you literally suffocate for a few seconds; no wheezing or gasping is possible. It also doesn't require any actual damage be done—every instance where it's happened to me, there has been no actual "injury," just the right force in just the right spot.
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