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Old 06-15-2008, 12:35 PM   #31
Dagger of Lath
 
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Default Re: The Low Tech You want

Quote:
Originally Posted by whswhs
If I were titling the books, I might take inspiration from the title "Ultra-Tech" and call the book we're talking about "Infra-Tech" (and "Visible Tech" for the era in between). But I have an arcane sense of humor.
I'd laugh at that one.
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Old 06-15-2008, 01:50 PM   #32
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Default Re: The Low Tech You want

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kromm
...a few vehicles for adventurers, and tools that enable skill use.
Horses. Lots of horses. Breeds, cost to obtain, maintain. Realistic and Epic travel distances. How feed, fodder, and "breakdowns" will affect travel. Slow and fast speeds for horseback or camelback travel. Nearly every fantasy epic has this stuff as background, from just transport to fighting while mounted with hand weapons to lances and pistols and cavalry charges - still done at least once, I believe, in WWI, and certainly through TL5 like the US Civil War and the Crimea.
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Old 06-15-2008, 01:54 PM   #33
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Default Re: The Low Tech You want

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Originally Posted by Polydamas
I want something like the first Low Tech, only longer ;). We already have Martial Arts for a big-book-o-swords, for example, so we don't need very much space for weapons rules ... except for the guns.

Agreed about the need for good armouring and smithing rules which make Fine and Very Fine swords easier to make at high TLs with full equipment. You might even be able to fit in a sidebar about skill modifiers for making low-tech stuff at high TLs (lots of amateurs can do serviceable TL 2-3 cobbling, armouring, or whatever today because they have good tools, reference books, pre-made materials, etc.)
From this point of view, more detailed equipment quality rules would be fun if not only pertaining to weapons and armor, but there for everything. Every time a PC buys something new, the GM can, VERY optionally, assume the skill of the craftsman and his equipment, make a quick skill roll, and instantly have something to say about each item. maybe there's an aesthetic flaw which can be used to reduce the price but doesn't change quality, or a non-visible flaw that might actually make the object one quality level lower...but charged for the higher price, etc.

Again, optional, but one of the actual BENEFITS of high TLs is quality control and inspection, so having the stuff on the shelf be pretty darn variable would be fun.
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Old 06-15-2008, 02:06 PM   #34
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OOh I like that

Was just thinking the other day how most fantasy settings have markets that seem cut and paste
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Old 06-15-2008, 02:07 PM   #35
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Default Re: The Low Tech You want

I definitely want statistics for black powder matchlock and wheel-lock firearms, pistols and long-arms. The flintlocks in High-Tech were a good start, but I've got a setting which hasn't invented the flintlock yet - wheel-locks are standard.

I also echo the call for different armor weights; preferably for full suits of armor and individual pieces.

One other item should be "daily life in the rural area" and "daily life in the city" for all tech levels. City life in TL 0 is definitely different from TL 2, and both are different from life at TL 4.

One of the things I liked about Low-Tech for 3e was that it was essentially broken down by tech level, not by category like 4e's High-Tech and Ultra-Tech are. I'd love to see that format carried over to 4e's Low-Tech.
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Old 06-15-2008, 02:20 PM   #36
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Default Re: The Low Tech You want

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Originally Posted by Kromm
Because we added TL8. In 3e, "high-tech" was TL4-7 (four TLs); in 4e, it's TL5-8 (still four TLs). With apologies to those who like ancient cultures, all their tech would fit in a thimble next to what exists at the high-tech end of things, so when the TL advanced by one, we stretched out the low-tech end, because it was more likely to fit in a book still.
I don't think this is a very accurate description. You changed TL ranges. Year 1990 was TL7 back then, now it's TL8. I felt that the turn of millenium was a good moment to change TLs. Back then, I was kinda proud we reached TL8, felt a 'digital' sense of progress. Now I feel cheated like a child running for the horizon.

(Reminds me: I was born in the previous millenium, in a country which no longer exists.)
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Old 06-15-2008, 02:33 PM   #37
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Default Re: The Low Tech You want

Quote:
Originally Posted by Molokh

I don't think this is a very accurate description. You changed TL ranges. Year 1990 was TL7 back then, now it's TL8.
Spoken like someone who didn't actually work on the book. Believe me, TL5-8 in 4e have every bit the technological range that TL4-7 did in 3e. The 3e edition of High-Tech choose to ignore much of its range, while the 4e edition actually paid attention to it, which meant that a lot of stuff that was brushed under the carpet to make things fit into 128 pages expanded into major word count in the 4e version.
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Old 06-15-2008, 02:43 PM   #38
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Default Re: The Low Tech You want

We need the things ordinary travellers have to deal with in a low-tech society...accomadations, travel methods and times, things like that. Riding with a caravan is slower, yet has advantages...how fast will they be moving?
What sort of food can be preserved for journeys? And how heavy is it?
All the things that are so important when the trip isn't across town, or stepping through the teleportal, but when you're using feet, wheels, or wind (or even steam)
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Old 06-15-2008, 03:15 PM   #39
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Default Re: The Low Tech You want

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kromm
Spoken like someone who didn't actually work on the book. Believe me, TL5-8 in 4e have every bit the technological range that TL4-7 did in 3e. The 3e edition of High-Tech choose to ignore much of its range, while the 4e edition actually paid attention to it, which meant that a lot of stuff that was brushed under the carpet to make things fit into 128 pages expanded into major word count in the 4e version.
I mean that the 'addition' of TL8 is not quite a true addition, as 4e TL8 stuff basically is TL7 by 3e standards. I don't claim that TLs 5-8 in 4e are smaller than 4-7 in 3e. I'm claiming that 4e pushed a half-TL (20 years out of 45 belonging to TL8, IIRC) into the range which was initially occupied by TLs 4-7. The 'Special Year' was pushed from 2000 to 2025. Now we have 25 years of tech which is neither HT nor UT. I know it's purely subjective, but still it leaves a feeling of a minor loss.
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Old 06-15-2008, 03:30 PM   #40
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Default Re: The Low Tech You want

3e Low Tech is a great read as is. To make it worth while to update, I'd think it'd need to be beefier in the settings department.

Maybe:
a chapter addressing low-"punk" settings (as in Bronze Age punk) and rules would be decent.

worked examples of survival, warlord/tyrant, merchant, and politician
centered campaigns.

some of the location specific flavor of the relevant 3e setting books (China, Egypt, etc..)
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